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Forums - General - Ben Stein to take on Darwinism on April 18

Smidlee on 07 March 2008
Paul said:
 

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/transitional.html


I like This guy wrote about the Tiktaalik.

http://www.scienceagainstevolution.org/v10i8n.htm

Now the experts are telling us that Tiktaalik lived in shallow fresh water and had fins strong enough to push its head out of water. It was just last December when scientists were telling us that Acanthostega was the missing link between fish and tetrapods. At that time we said,

"A few years from now, evolutionists will no doubt replace this fairytale with a new one." 10

We admit it. We were wrong. It was just four months, not a few years.



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Sqrl on 07 March 2008
Smidlee said:
Paul said:
 

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/id/transitional.html


I like This guy wrote about the Tiktaalik.

http://www.scienceagainstevolution.org/v10i8n.htm

Now the experts are telling us that Tiktaalik lived in shallow fresh water and had fins strong enough to push its head out of water. It was just last December when scientists were telling us that Acanthostega was the missing link between fish and tetrapods. At that time we said,

A few years from now, evolutionists will no doubt replace this fairytale with a new one. 10

We admit it. We were wrong. It was just four months, not a few years.


Good call, obviously there can only ever be a single species trying to evolve.

 

edit:

I predict that this Sunday people will go to Church..and by your logic if they do it proves that god doesn't exist.

Just predicting that people will do something, or find something doesn't prove or disprove anything. And one species evolving does not preclude another species from evolving.

 
To Each Man, Responsibility
timmah on 07 March 2008
Escherichia said:
timmah said:
godf said:
timmah said:
Escherichia said:

 

 


 


It is possible to have a high IQ and be a creationist.

But it is stupid to believe in creationism, and the weakness of the arguments you bring up only serves to highlight this.

re DNA being a code, and a code being a sign of intelligence. Scientists have already found repeating codes in radio waves coming from space: these were naturally occurring however, and not a sign of intelligence. This is just a confusion over words: we can call DNA a 'code', and the codes we come across in our day to day life are likely to have been created by an intelligence. But our labelling of DNA as a code indicates nothing about it's likely origins.

Newtonian physics are really only an approximation as to what's really happening. But regardless, at the time of the big bang the laws of physics seem to have been operating very differently to how they do now, under massively different circumstances.

The law of entropy? When we're orbiting the sun? The energy required for a single cell organism is the least problematic part of the origin of life.

There is a very really possibility that you are quite stupid.


This is exactly what I'm talking about. Completely out of line and totally uncalled for. I've not insulted you or called anyone stupid, because that's not debate, it's just rude. Personal insults are just low and immature.

This isn't my first time on the site, so don't think of me as a new poster you can just push around, I've just created a new account because I can't get into my old one, I do know how to use the 'report this post' button.

And yes, with a 148 IQ, a degree in Computer Science, a successfull 65K/year job as a senior Network Engineer before 30, A's in AP Biology, physics, pre-calc, and chemistry, I'm a complete idiot. Ya got me.

I'm seriosly done with this thread now.

 Yeah, that was way outta line. Let me just say this though with a little more tact than our rather crude friend. I have an IQ in the 150-160 range, I have a Bachelors in Biology and am working on a Masters in Biology and would very much like that to lead to Med-School. That doesn't mean that I'm not ignorant of things like say, engineering, or economics, of these things I have no clue...okay i know a little but I'm no expert. For that matter I'm not an expert on Biology either, but I happen to know a fair bit more about it than someone who has a 180 IQ and has never really studied biology.  I wouldn't say your stupid, but you might be ignorant of biology.  Huh, I guess that could be an insult too huh, well I'm not an expert at debate either.

 


Well said and appreciated. I did well in biology in high school (7 years ago), but wouldn't claim to know as much as you on the subject (that doesn't mean I can't debate the origin of the universe with you, though)

It's just that the origin of the universe is so difficult to really understand simply because it's not documented by our understanding. It's tough to explain the effects of the beginning without having several explanations that fit. For people to say that believing in god or that he created the world is 'stupid' is a little rediculous.

I have a great amount of respect for honest debators like you and sqrl, even though I don't agree with you. You both seem to really know your stuff, and I wish I had more time to read up on these subjects so I could make this a real debate. Unfortunately I have a wife, a life, a job, and have to read more about PCs and Servers than mitochondria and amoebas.

Ok, I seriously gots to go. I already spent all day staring at a computer screen and I'm starting to go blind.



Smidlee on 07 March 2008
Sqrl said:
 

Good call, obviously there can only ever be a single species trying to evolve.

 

edit:

I predict that this Sunday people will go to Church..and by your logic if they do it proves that god doesn't exist.

Just predicting that people will do something, or find something doesn't prove or disprove anything. And one species evolving does not preclude another species from evolving.

 


 Neither does slapping together a butch of bones and make up a story proves or disproves anything.



ResiRiley on 07 March 2008

No I think I got this whole thing down pretty good as you guys have all given enough information here to write a text book on........and now things are getting a little too complex for my own liking so I jus t try to look at it more simply.

If I jump in the air I fall back down......right? That's basic and simple and I can understand that.

All the specifics of gravity and weight and everything are details that I dont choose to get caught up in.

 

Now

I just keep tryna close my eyes and actually imagine this "evolution" happen. Dinsosaurs into birds, or a fish into a lizard that turned into a mammal...... I am picturing it and it just doesnt match up

 

Let's say there were 1000 fish living in a pond that was drying up. There is an obvious pressure on the fish to change and adapt. One fish actually does manage to mutate or evlolve or whatever. Now there are 1000 fish that are the same as they were before and 1 lone fish that is now something completley different that ca survive in its changing enviornment. At what point would the superior fish cross breed with the inferior fish and if it did breed with them would it be guaranteed that the offspring would be as superior as the original mutated fish? Or why would the superior fish breed with the inferior.....

Like a mental reatrd breeding with a normal person. Why would they do that and is it assured that the offspring will be as retarded, and even if he was. There would still be only that one retard versus the 1000 normal...

 

Maybe my outlook is juvenile but all of your complex, over drawn theories have yielded 0 proof. I believe in God and don't need proof to say why I do.... its called FAITH and billions of us have it..

If someone asked you did you love your wife, or kids, or friends or whatever. Would u have a reason why? Is there just one overewhelming thing or piece of proof that you can point to and say "This is why I love this person and here's my proof" It just doesnt work like that for some of us and if it's not the same for you thats fine, but dont knock the rest of us.

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timmah on 07 March 2008
twesterm said:
timmah said:

And yes, with a 148 IQ, a degree in Computer Science, a successfull 65K/year job as a senior Network Engineer before 30, A's in AP Biology, physics, pre-calc, and chemistry, I'm a complete idiot. Ya got me.


If you've done all those things, why would you bring up meaningless high school subjects? Engineers more than anything generally realize how worthless most high school classes are and most graduates generally see things pre junior year in college as silly.

Not saying you don't have the job and all that, just think it's odd you would choose to point those things out and even make them the last thing you mention.


I went to a technical shool to get my degree, took mostly computer classes, they did not offer those other courses there. Went there to save money. The high school courses were at a private school and are concidered college level.

I was just a little hot under the collar and was pointing out that I'm not an idiot.



stof on 07 March 2008
ResiRiley said:

No I think I got this whole thing down pretty good as you guys have all given enough information here to write a text book on........and now things are getting a little too complex for my own liking so I jus t try to look at it more simply.

If I jump in the air I fall back down......right? That's basic and simple and I can understand that.

All the specifics of gravity and weight and everything are details that I dont choose to get caught up in.

 

Now

I just keep tryna close my eyes and actually imagine this "evolution" happen. Dinsosaurs into birds, or a fish into a lizard that turned into a mammal...... I am picturing it and it just doesnt match up

 

Let's say there were 1000 fish living in a pond that was drying up. There is an obvious pressure on the fish to change and adapt. One fish actually does manage to mutate or evlolve or whatever. Now there are 1000 fish that are the same as they were before and 1 lone fish that is now something completley different that ca survive in its changing enviornment. At what point would the superior fish cross breed with the inferior fish and if it did breed with them would it be guaranteed that the offspring would be as superior as the original mutated fish? Or why would the superior fish breed with the inferior.....

Like a mental reatrd breeding with a normal person. Why would they do that and is it assured that the offspring will be as retarded, and even if he was. There would still be only that one retard versus the 1000 normal...

 

Maybe my outlook is juvenile but all of your complex, over drawn theories have yielded 0 proof. I believe in God and don't need proof to say why I do.... its called FAITH and billions of us have it..


 Exactly. You're talking about faith, not science.



I'm a mod, come to me if there's mod'n to do. 

Chrizum is the best thing to happen to the internet, Period.

Serves me right for challenging his sales predictions!

Bet with dsisister44: Red Steel 2 will sell 1 million within it's first 365 days of sales.

Paul on 07 March 2008

Ever wonder why those crazy scientists are always tinkering with the flu vaccine? If things don't evolve why don't they just stick with the same formula every year? It's probably a conspiracy between the evolutionists and the drug companies to make more money.

Then again, the flu is just a virus so the fact that it changes and mutates has no bearing on anything.



stof on 07 March 2008
stof said:
A question to the creationists, if the underlying belief is that biological organisms are far too complicated to have occurred randomly, and that surely some intelligent and powerful creator being is responsible for our existence, wouldn't said creator being be far more complicated?

Surely a being capable of creating life is too complex to have just occurred. So who created the creator? And wouldn't that being also be far too complicated to just occur? So who created that being? and wouldn't a being capable of creating a being capable of creating a being capable of creating all life on earth be far too complex to just occur? And if *you get where I'm going with this*

 Good question stof. Good question indeed.



I'm a mod, come to me if there's mod'n to do. 

Chrizum is the best thing to happen to the internet, Period.

Serves me right for challenging his sales predictions!

Bet with dsisister44: Red Steel 2 will sell 1 million within it's first 365 days of sales.

ResiRiley on 07 March 2008

SO.........

Whats your point?

Do u have faith in the fact that you wll be alive in the morning. You don't have any evidence suggesting otherwise, but i'm sure yo think you will be even though you don't have any evidence saying you will....

Everything can't be explained or predicted by some formula....

I subscribe to faith....if you don't fine.... I don't care. Thats your curse (or blessing if thats how u see it)