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Forums - General - John Mccain Won the Republican Nomination. Your thoughts?

Entroper said:

It sounds like you're listening to Clinton and McCain's speeches, not Obama's.  They seem to think that if they repeat "speeches not solutions" often enough, it will become true, and people will just ignore the goals that Obama lays out in his speeches.


 Actually, Most of the speeches I have listened to are Obama's. Clinton makes me gag just to hear her talk, and I have not seen many from McCain. Just the debates.

But I don't need to see McCain's. I know where he stands. He has been in office for just over 127 years now. Obama is new, and thus I have no clue what he really stands for.

I might in the end vote for him. I just need to know why first :) 



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There is also another issue I want to address. None of these candidate are or ever will be "totalitarian" leaders.

1. US is divided between 3 branches and within 2 of those branches the power is divided even further. Within the executive branch there agencies that do have power of executive legislation (orders and directives) but most can not have direct effect on citizens, just on the way these agencies do business. Law enforcement, taxes, intelligence, and all other agencies are purposely designed to have overlapping duties and roles that force these agencies to compete/share with each other and so none can dominate all aspects of its larger role. For example the IRS deals with income taxes and corporate taxes, while the FTC will deals trade, and still even more diversifying its EFTPS handles the moving of the money in the tax system but only with in the treasury department handles outgoing and internal flow between organizations. The legislature it two houses, further dividing.

2. The States in the US have more individual governing power when compared to provinces of other nations. This is why they are called states. The states are divided similarly from within like the federal government; with divided legislatures and executives. They also have the power to handle most law enforcement, property taxes, abortion laws, marriage laws, most civil law, gambling, prostitution, commerce, etc. Federal regulation is actually pretty rare compared to other countries national governments.

3. The constitution prevents most of this from changing, and it is very hard to change it. Article V of the the constitution is:

The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.

So 2/3 of congress or State Legislatures have to agree to call a convention to discuss it and 3/4 of States independent legislatures or state conventions (this would mean revolution) have to ratify it... notice this excludes the executive branch.

I find these comparisons to Hitler unlikely, because I doubt Clinton, Obama, or McCain will be able to eliminate the other branches power, kill Millions in death factories, or eliminate the Bill of Rights (the first ten amendments to the constitution that guarantee state and personal rights)... It would be very hard for them to do it if they wanted because each state basically has it's own Military forces (the National Guard and armed police) and all the armed citizens walking around here.



I would cite regulation, but I know you will simply ignore it.

Entroper said:
TheRealMafoo said:
ssj12 said:
i so didnt see this coming /sarcasm

now Obama needs to win

Why? What is Obama going to do for the country?

I am not against him, I just have not figured out why everyone is for him. He speaks well, and rallies the people well, but he does it while saying nothing.

He says "We need change, and I am here to bring change." Cool. what change? When he tells me what he plans to do, I might then agree with you.


It sounds like you're listening to Clinton and McCain's speeches, not Obama's. They seem to think that if they repeat "speeches not solutions" often enough, it will become true, and people will just ignore the goals that Obama lays out in his speeches.

 

@Legend, what's wrong with renegotiating NAFTA?

I've seen a few of both of theirs, and both of them love to talk about the past, and how they will make the future the past, and how they plan to hold this country back. That's not how I want my country to be run.

 



I don't follow McCain closely enough to judge him yet, but I like his daughter's style.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JusarJH_xFY



TheRealMafoo said:
Entroper said:

It sounds like you're listening to Clinton and McCain's speeches, not Obama's. They seem to think that if they repeat "speeches not solutions" often enough, it will become true, and people will just ignore the goals that Obama lays out in his speeches.


Actually, Most of the speeches I have listened to are Obama's. Clinton makes me gag just to hear her talk, and I have not seen many from McCain. Just the debates.

But I don't need to see McCain's. I know where he stands. He has been in office for just over 127 years now. Obama is new, and thus I have no clue what he really stands for.

I might in the end vote for him. I just need to know why first :)


OK.  I mean, it's not like he's giving you a complete manifesto, but I've found Obama's speeches to be equally as specific as Hillary's or McCain's.  Speeches are where you let people know your goals, which is what all three candidates are doing.  If you want the details, check out his website or his book.  IMO he has a very forward-thinking approach on a lot of issues.  He makes it very clear that he's willing to listen to the opposing side and come up with a compromise that addresses their concerns, like using free market principles in his health care plan, or reworking affirmative action so that it's based on economic status instead of race (and not based on quotas either way).  His goals are liberal in nature, but instead of taking the hard line on everything and demonizing conservatives, he is actually willing to admit when they raise valid concerns, and try to see what can be done about it.  That's exactly what needs to be done to break the stalemate and actually achieve something.



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Btw - Hilary won Texas



Coca-Cola said:
I don't follow McCain closely enough to judge him yet, but I like his daughter's style.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JusarJH_xFY

 I was about to type "You mean his granddaughter right?"  but at that exact moment she said DAD... I was shocked.  



I'm a mod, come to me if there's mod'n to do. 

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@stof
I think she is in her early 20s.

I think she gets her looks from her mom.
http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/photo/2008/02/08/PH2008020801014.jpg



@stof
I think she is in her early 20s.

I think she gets her looks from her mom.
http://media3.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/photo/2008/02/08/PH2008020801014.jpg



the democrat side is going to end up being up to those super delegates. I hope Obama has more.



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