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Forums - Sony - Whoa!! Kojima: "Blu-ray Disc Not Big Enough for MGS4″

darconi said:
FJ-Warez said:
JoeJ said:
Username2324 said:


P.S. GIF's look horrible

GIF's are a non-lossy format, so, well, you're wrong. :p It's a format that's best used for images with lots of repeated parts since those compress well with the LZW compression scheme. PNG is a similar format, but can do 24 bit color, as opposed to GIF's 8 bit color. Perhaps that's what you're thinking of?

If you had said JPEG, well, then we could have agreed with you since JPEG is a lossy format (like MP3) and achieves compression by throwing away data and approximating the output.

EDIT: Whoops, darconi beat me to it...


Errrr, 24 bits > 8 bits, thats compresion, 8 bits gif takes 1/3 of the space (removing colors) of a normal 24 bits image...


...uh, I think you're a little confused on how compression works...


Are you sure??, a PNG has 8 bits per channel, 3 channels, RGB + Alpha, a gif only has 8 bits, and sometimes 1 bit for alpha + 7 for colors... 256 colors  vs 16 millons??? Tell why am I wrong, please... 



By me:

Made with Blender + LuxRender
"Since you can´t understand ... there is no point to taking you seriously."
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Sky Render said:
I have a hard time believing that needing more than 50GB of disc space is a sign of anything but general ineptitude, inefficiency, and excessiveness. Just what does Kojima intend to put on this game disc that requires so much space? I suppose I can hope that this is all just a misunderstanding, and that Kojima didn't actually mean to imply that MGS4 is so bloated in size that it needs to consume 10 times the space of any other game just to meet his standards.
I agree. Most likely this is due to pre-rendered cinematics (using the in-game engine, just like many current games) and a whole lot of uncompressed audio. There's no way they could've made 50GB of actual game data without a budget and development time of biblical proportions.  It's all marketing/PR!

 



FJ-Warez said:
darconi said:
FJ-Warez said:
JoeJ said:
Username2324 said:


P.S. GIF's look horrible

GIF's are a non-lossy format, so, well, you're wrong. :p It's a format that's best used for images with lots of repeated parts since those compress well with the LZW compression scheme. PNG is a similar format, but can do 24 bit color, as opposed to GIF's 8 bit color. Perhaps that's what you're thinking of?

If you had said JPEG, well, then we could have agreed with you since JPEG is a lossy format (like MP3) and achieves compression by throwing away data and approximating the output.

EDIT: Whoops, darconi beat me to it...


Errrr, 24 bits > 8 bits, thats compresion, 8 bits gif takes 1/3 of the space (removing colors) of a normal 24 bits image...


...uh, I think you're a little confused on how compression works...


Are you sure??, a PNG has 8 bits per channel, 3 channels, RGB + Alpha, a gif only has 8 bits, and sometimes 1 bit for alpha + 7 for colors... 256 colors vs 16 millons??? Tell why am I wrong, please...


 Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you said.  You're correct regarding the colors.  The point that I was getting at is that gifs are not always 1/3 of the space as a png.  The end size results are because of how compression algorithms work.  A png file of the same picture can be much less than 3x the size of a converted gif version.    



Wow that is do expensive to do if this game does not sell at least 3.5M within the first 2 months of release i dont see Koakomi doing well financially.



"Like you know"

rudyrsr8 said:
Wow that is do expensive to do if this game does not sell at least 3.5M within the first 2 months of release i dont see Koakomi doing well financially.

 Kanomi will do fine, it's Sony who will feel the impact seeing as they are subsidising the project (that's my assumption.)



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darconi said:
FJ-Warez said:
darconi said:
FJ-Warez said:
JoeJ said:
Username2324 said:


P.S. GIF's look horrible

GIF's are a non-lossy format, so, well, you're wrong. :p It's a format that's best used for images with lots of repeated parts since those compress well with the LZW compression scheme. PNG is a similar format, but can do 24 bit color, as opposed to GIF's 8 bit color. Perhaps that's what you're thinking of?

If you had said JPEG, well, then we could have agreed with you since JPEG is a lossy format (like MP3) and achieves compression by throwing away data and approximating the output.

EDIT: Whoops, darconi beat me to it...


Errrr, 24 bits > 8 bits, thats compresion, 8 bits gif takes 1/3 of the space (removing colors) of a normal 24 bits image...


...uh, I think you're a little confused on how compression works...


Are you sure??, a PNG has 8 bits per channel, 3 channels, RGB + Alpha, a gif only has 8 bits, and sometimes 1 bit for alpha + 7 for colors... 256 colors vs 16 millons??? Tell why am I wrong, please...


Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you said. You're correct regarding the colors. The point that I was getting at is that gifs are not always 1/3 of the space as a png. The end size results are because of how compression algorithms work. A png file of the same picture can be much less than 3x the size of a converted gif version.


Sorry I was not talking about the size of the file, I was talking about the size of the palette and how some colors are removed to make a gif img, the size of the file is kinda of interesting, a gif could be more heavier than a png, but a png is only small when you are making images without many colors... or there is not a big change between them...



By me:

Made with Blender + LuxRender
"Since you can´t understand ... there is no point to taking you seriously."

marketing ploy
its not hard to see what that is.

Im sure the game would be much bigger then a dvd but more then 50 gigs??

Sorry but i dont buy it at all. Tell them to compress a few things and they are set



Owner of all consoles cept DS.....Currently in love with prototype!

What I think might justify the size is 100 multiple endings, with fully rendered cut scenes for all of them (if not FMVs).



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

@Bingoo
I'd understand any average developer...but this is Kojima, I doubt he'd do something like that. Just like you said...compress some stuff. I bet a lot of it is just completely uncompressed.

@LordTheNightKnight
Is it really that hard to believe? If they're developing this thing in 1080p, then it's going to take up a lot of space. Especially if a lot of it is uncompressed. There's also audio...if they're leaving that uncompressed, it's going to take up a helluva lot of space.



PSN: Lone_Canis_Lupus

Lone_Canis_Lupus said:
@Bingoo
I'd understand any average developer...but this is Kojima, I doubt he'd do something like that. Just like you said...compress some stuff. I bet a lot of it is just completely uncompressed.

@LordTheNightKnight
Is it really that hard to believe? If they're developing this thing in 1080p, then it's going to take up a lot of space. Especially if a lot of it is uncompressed. There's also audio...if they're leaving that uncompressed, it's going to take up a helluva lot of space.

Kojima doesn't need it, Sony does...

 

From Kojima (Accoording to a fan who meet him at Comi-con):

 

MGS4 will be 1080. I'm assuming 1080p, but he said 1080. He said Sony is "forcing" them to do it in 1080. He hesitated when he said this. Im thinking he could not find the right word, and chose to say "forcing."

No way it will fit on a DVD9. Wouldn't give me a number as how big the game will be. But went on about how Sony is pushing HD content and in no way will it be possible to fit it on a normal DVD, and BD is totally necessary for MGS4.

Edit: The issue is there, Kojima was pushed to put a lot of HD content (prerendered cuts) in the game, this way, it cannot fit into a dvd...

PR strategy anyone???

 



By me:

Made with Blender + LuxRender
"Since you can´t understand ... there is no point to taking you seriously."