oniyide said: Einsam_Delphin said: oniyide said: No its not desirable, thats pretty much the main reason. Remember 3ds had to have its price cut early on so its not like that system is some kind of phenom. What is most interesting is the whole nobody will buy a Ninty console for 300 bucks when their is a cheaper alternative, again that cheaper alternative had to have an early price cut because people werent buying it for that price. SO it seems Ninty has a image problem where people dont think its products are worth a certain price. And it is a problem because the comp can sell their systems for 400 even 500 and do much better, why that is i wish that is. The 3DS didn't become a thing until after the price cut because that's when the games actually started showing up. so price cut had nothing to do with turnaround? yeah cause people really wanted to play OoT for the 10th time. alright man

Yeah cause I totally said that. lol nope! My point was you can't say Nintendo games aren't desirable just because the the system was struggling at first, since again the 3DS didn't yet have the Nintendo library to be desirable with. People buy Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games, so of course people aren't going to buy a Nintendo console when it's lacking Nintendo games. Once they came though, 3DS starting selling well. Obviously the price cut helped, but it would have done next to nothing without the games.

Soundwave said: Motion controls as a *system seller* may in fact be over though. Just like once upon a time Mortal Kombat almost won the console war for the Genesis, before Nintendo realized their mistake and changed allowed blood in MK2, but by the late 1990s, 2D fighters, while still having a dedicated fanbase no longer moved systems. Nobody bought a Playstation or N64 for Mortal Kombat.  Same goes for the Final Fantasy series, which was once a hugely pivotal turning point for the Playstation brand ... today it's still popular but it isn't going to tip the scales of the console race one way or another. JRPGs had a boom period in the late 90s/early 2000s which has subsided and the genre has largely gone back to being a niche genre.  Kinect isn't moving XBox One's and Wii Sports Club, Wii Fit, Wii Party U, etc. aren't moving Wii Us. It's a novel idea, it's just not something people will buy a new console for anymore, been there, done that (just like Guitar Hero ... after guitar riffing on every Aerosmith track for the 2000th time ... the consumer loses interest).

When we see a good NEW motion control game that is also well advertised we can make that assessment.  

MK did not almost win anything for the Genesis.  Genesis won in one region barely(EU by .25 million).  System seller and popular at 2.67 million on the Genesis but not at 2.79 on PS, 2.49 on PS2 and 2.44 on PS3. How did it sell more on Playstation than on Gensis and become less popular and less a system seller?

Outside of Pokemon, FF, and DQ JRPGs have actually never been terribly big. There are actually no fewer JRPGs today than there were in the 90s/2000s. You just have to look at handhelds to find them.  FF is in decline because the games are not as good quality and there were three games in the same world this gen.  

There have yet to be any Kinect games outside the not advertised at all Xbox Fitness(Can't lie I like it as a workout game). Though even if there were more good ones I'm sure the One's price has far overshot anyone whom might be interested including myself. 

Why pay more for a console that doesn't actually improve the experience?  Why buy a Wii U to play 3/5ths of Wii Sports a 2006 game?  They can get the full experience on the Wii for far cheaper. This is why Just Dance 4 outsold Wii U on Wii and just about every ohter platform.  You sound like Sony not understanding that a bunch of old ports from a cheaper system with better controls and larger library isn't gonna make people buy a Vita.  Maybe if they made a new Wii Sports.  Please don't say Nintendo Land is the new Wii Sports. 

nitekrawler1285 said: Soundwave said: Please don't say Nintendo Land is the new Wii Sports.

Nintendo Land is the new Wii Sports.

*awesomeface.jpg*

nitekrawler1285 said: Soundwave said: Motion controls as a *system seller* may in fact be over though. Just like once upon a time Mortal Kombat almost won the console war for the Genesis, before Nintendo realized their mistake and changed allowed blood in MK2, but by the late 1990s, 2D fighters, while still having a dedicated fanbase no longer moved systems. Nobody bought a Playstation or N64 for Mortal Kombat.  Same goes for the Final Fantasy series, which was once a hugely pivotal turning point for the Playstation brand ... today it's still popular but it isn't going to tip the scales of the console race one way or another. JRPGs had a boom period in the late 90s/early 2000s which has subsided and the genre has largely gone back to being a niche genre.  Kinect isn't moving XBox One's and Wii Sports Club, Wii Fit, Wii Party U, etc. aren't moving Wii Us. It's a novel idea, it's just not something people will buy a new console for anymore, been there, done that (just like Guitar Hero ... after guitar riffing on every Aerosmith track for the 2000th time ... the consumer loses interest).  When we see a good NEW motion control game that is also well advertised we can make that assessment.   MK did not almost win anything for the Genesis.  Genesis won in one region barely(EU by .25 million).  System seller and popular at 2.67 million on the Genesis but not at 2.79 on PS, 2.49 on PS2 and 2.44 on PS3. How did it sell more on Playstation than on Gensis and become less popular and less a system seller? Outside of Pokemon, FF, and DQ JRPGs have actually never been terribly big. There are actually no fewer JRPGs today than there were in the 90s/2000s. You just have to look at handhelds to find them.  FF is in decline because the games are not as good quality and there were three games in the same world this gen.   There have yet to be any Kinect games outside the not advertised at all Xbox Fitness(Can't lie I like it as a workout game). Though even if there were more good ones I'm sure the One's price has far overshot anyone whom might be interested including myself.  Why pay more for a console that doesn't actually improve the experience?  Why buy a Wii U to play 3/5ths of Wii Sports a 2006 game?  They can get the full experience on the Wii for far cheaper. This is why Just Dance 4 outsold Wii U on Wii and just about every ohter platform.  You sound like Sony not understanding that a bunch of old ports from a cheaper system with better controls and larger library isn't gonna make people buy a Vita.  Maybe if they made a new Wii Sports.  Please don't say Nintendo Land is the new Wii Sports.

Well you have Wii Fit U, Wii Party U, Game & Wario, Mario & Sonic Winter Olympics Sochi, and you have Kinect Sports on XBox One coming out in a couple of weeks. My guess is all these are going to be sales duds, how many excuses are we going to keep making for all of them. 

Wii Sports is difficult to sequelize because adding different sports means you're adding more obscure ones that aren't going to be as popular as the basic tennis/golf/bowling trifecta that most people identify with. And if you try to add more modes/features to tennis/golf/bowling people complain that it's becoming too complicated. A lot of people are saying Wii Sports Club isn't as fun with the WM+ because it makes the games more complex. 

And yes, Nintendo Land was supposed to be the Wii U's equivalent to Wii Sports. Nintendo's kinda damned if they do, damned if they don't here, if they launched with Wii Sports 3, then people would be saying "oh what a terrible launch idea, why would anyone buy a new system to play the same game from 6 years ago, why didn't Nintendo come up with something really new?". 

Which is why their next gen will have the same software on both.

When i look at 3ds I see it is truely what the sucessor of ds would look like.
The wiiu was like hey we made to much money doing something that works lets try to go back to gamecube ideas!

ninetailschris said: When i look at 3ds I see it is truely what the sucessor of ds would look like. The wiiu was like hey we made to much money doing something that works lets try to go back to gamecube ideas!

I hear from Nintendo fans that WiiU is nothing like Gamecube? The only comparisons I see are sales.

Einsam_Delphin said: oniyide said: Einsam_Delphin said: oniyide said: No its not desirable, thats pretty much the main reason. Remember 3ds had to have its price cut early on so its not like that system is some kind of phenom. What is most interesting is the whole nobody will buy a Ninty console for 300 bucks when their is a cheaper alternative, again that cheaper alternative had to have an early price cut because people werent buying it for that price. SO it seems Ninty has a image problem where people dont think its products are worth a certain price. And it is a problem because the comp can sell their systems for 400 even 500 and do much better, why that is i wish that is. The 3DS didn't become a thing until after the price cut because that's when the games actually started showing up. so price cut had nothing to do with turnaround? yeah cause people really wanted to play OoT for the 10th time. alright man Yeah cause I totally said that. lol nope! My point was you can't say Nintendo games aren't desirable just because the the system was struggling at first, since again the 3DS didn't yet have the Nintendo library to be desirable with. People buy Nintendo consoles for Nintendo games, so of course people aren't going to buy a Nintendo console when it's lacking Nintendo games. Once they came though, 3DS starting selling well. Obviously the price cut helped, but it would have done next to nothing without the games.

never said they werent desirable, but clearly their is an issue when Ninty has to drop the prices of their systems. So their is an issue of just HOW desirable they actual are. Funny thing is, Wii U has Ninty games and look how its doing, make of that what you will.

The only thing affecting Wii U sales are the horrible choices Nintendo made on it. The thruth is that in home consoles people want:
- The hot new third-party games: nobody wants to see their friends playing the new GTA and know they can't play it.
- Decent graphics: you don't need to be the prettiest one, but it can't be blatantly different like it is.
- Good online
Games sell more on 3DS because 3DS sells more units than the Wii U. 3DS sells more because it is projected to give people what they want from a handheld, while Wii U doesn't do the same for a home console.

Soundwave said: Well you have Wii Fit U, Wii Party U, Game & Wario, Mario & Sonic Winter Olympics Sochi, and you have Kinect Sports on XBox One coming out in a couple of weeks. My guess is all these are going to be sales duds, how many excuses are we going to keep making for all of them.  Wii Sports is difficult to sequelize because adding different sports means you're adding more obscure ones that aren't going to be as popular as the basic tennis/golf/bowling trifecta that most people identify with. And if you try to add more modes/features to tennis/golf/bowling people complain that it's becoming too complicated. A lot of people are saying Wii Sports Club isn't as fun with the WM+ because it makes the games more complex.  And yes, Nintendo Land was supposed to be the Wii U's equivalent to Wii Sports. Nintendo's kinda damned if they do, damned if they don't here, if they launched with Wii Sports 3, then people would be saying "oh what a terrible launch idea, why would anyone buy a new system to play the same game from 6 years ago, why didn't Nintendo come up with something really new?".

I'm not going to make excuses for 8 year old games not selling a console.  They wont and to my knowledge never have.  Especially when those that are significantly worse versions of the same game they bought 8 years ago. Especially when its more expensive and less fun than it was before.  What basically amounts to shitty old ports isn't gonna sell any console. Wii U or otherwise. 

They could have done a new duck hunt/hunting sports, fishing, Kiting, Volley Ball, Cricket, Super Dodge Ball, Pilot Wings would probably work really well with the controller actually, Super Mario Paint Ball, Wii Martial Arts.  None of those adds major complexity over Wii Sports are off the top of my head and would be quick and familiar to get into.  Nintendo just didn't even try.  They just decided to port the exact same games and charge more on a more expensive system to boot.

A game focusing on a HUGE ass intimidating controller that needs explanation to set up and play any of the games is in no way captures the Spirit of or come close to being an equivalent of Wii Sports.  Even most figured Ninendo would launch with Wii Sports Extreme or some such.  They may call this console a Wii U but it in no way has the spirit of the Wii.