Really, Modern Warfare 2 and Smash Bros?!

I'm not saying they're bad games. Not in the slightest. I'm just wondering, how do you get lost in a game with effectively no story. These games are basically competitive multiplayer games, (I know they have campaigns but no-one cares really do they?), I honestly can't imagine how you can get lost in them, consumed by them because there's no characters, world, atmosphere, or storyline to draw you in. I can see you getting excited by them, even getting obsessive if they're really fun and stuff... but I'd say that's a very different reason for gaming than the feeling you get when a good RPG draws you in and you feel like you could walk around in that world, as though you could touch it or taste it, or an action/sandbox game that mirrors society such that you can see it's perspective in the world around you. That's more what I'm thinking about.

On another point, good to see more Final Fantasy love. Oh yeah.

Thank you. I'll definitely check Pandora's Tower  :)

That sounds just like the generic stuff everyone seems to have to say about FF13.

Having experienced all 3 games I can say for sure that it is a genuine FF. The story stretches over 3 games so one shouldn't ahve an opinion about the whole when you only played one of them. It does come together at the end. Also giant plot holes are nothing new to FF. It seems people are measuring FF13 to a different standard, blinded by nostalgia.

As I said, what I am most interested in FF is the world. FF13 has an amazing world with lots of lore behind it and great set pieces. In that regard it's probably closest to FF12. The characters might be hit or miss for some people but they are not more or less shallow than any other FF characters. I didn't like Lighting until the very end of LR.

I can't tell you everything I love about FF13 as that would go to far in this thread but I can tell you this:

The world is as magic as any other FF.

The story is as contrived as any other FF

The characters are as steretypical as any other FF

The battle system is as shallow as any other FF

The game is as linear as any other FF(previous games only gave the illusion of freedom with the world opening up after tens of hours being normal to any FF)

People were going into this game expecting something unachievable and started nitpicking on every detail while ignoring any shortcomings of previous FF games with their rose tinted nostalgia goggles.

That said, FF13 Saga is in my Top 3 of FF games together with FF8 and FF9.

Civilization V
I've logged nearly 600 hours... I sometimes take week to month long breaks, but I always come back. It's an intricate and engrossing game. I've actually learned a lot from this game. Wanting to learn more about historical figures.

Pokemon series
I've logged hundreds of hours on some installments... Pokemon Red was probably one of the first games I ever owned. I can actually remember riding home with my mom with the game in my hands. Back when they were in awesome, but impractical, cardboard boxes. I downloaded Pokemon X off the eShop at midnight so I could play it ASAP. I ended up having to wait like 2 hours for it to download, but I didn't have to drive to Walmart.

Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare
I've logged about 700 hours... played the shit out of its multiplayer for two years. Now its online is the domain of hackers. At the time it was addictive, I got all the way to 10th prestige, and had all 5 gold weapons. I was damn good at the game. No Call of Duty since has captured the magic. Fantastic map designs and balanced weaponry/perks made it the pinnacle of the series.

Zoo Tycoon
I played the first and second installments when I was in grade school. They were addicting and are probably the reason I like intricate strategy games like Civ now. I actually kinda want to play them now... It's a shame the series is dead - the Xbox One game doesn't count.

The Mass Effect series ( my fav). Loved the story of Spec Ops the line and Alan Wake.

I could go into detail about what I dislike about Final Fantasy 13 but it would likely end up feeling like a which hunt. Honestly, the things you've told me simply feel like special pleading. Every time I ask what FF13 fans like about the game they always become super vague... well, it's long winded and overexaggerated for comedic effect, (hell you like FF13, long winding is something you can handle :P ), this video series explains far better than I can why FF13 is such a disappointment. Here's the first part.

Spoony may be a known "hater" for Final Fantasy, but it's largely just for comedy sake. His criticisms of FF13 though are so true it hurts. Perhaps we'll end up agreeing to disagree but for a game to have an amazing world with great lore, it needs to make sense and be consistent. FF13 doesn't do this... as for "great set peices", if I want that I'll play Uncharted. I play Final Fantasy to watch an intricate story unfold in a vibrant world, in FF13 I watched douches mill about for 50 hours in a plot that didn't make sense before the game would even let me play it.

Dark Cloud, don't really need to say anything about it, it's just Dark Cloud

Interesting choices. I also have quite the attachment for Pokémon, I've been playing Pokémon Y though once I beat the Elite 4 the game kinda grinded to a halt for me. It's good but there's very little "end game", hell, the Elite 4 don't even use complete teams. If you have less than 6 Pokémon, you're holding back. Kinda made me feel a little cheated at the end.

If you like Zoo Tycoon, have you tried Roller Coaster Tycoon 3 Platinum Edition. You can get it on Steam and GoG.com for around £15 and it's really worth it. Unfortunately this shitty laptop will groan if I attempt to run it. Platinum Edition allows you to build Water Parks and Safari Parks, which might be right up your ally if you liked Zoo Tycoon... it's a bit of a tone shift but one worth going for if you're wanting something similar to play.

As for Civ 5. Hmmm... I had a major issue with it. It just felt like too many steps backwards, especially with the way the government system worked. Sure combat is improved but when your government is basically a World Of Warcraft style talent tree rather than an actual government simulation with statistical changed and options, it just loses something for me. Personally I think Civilization 4: Beyond The Sword, with the community mod Rise Of Mankind is the purest and best Civ experience you can have and it just blows Civ 5 out of the water for depth and complexity. I highly recommend it if you've not tried it.

The last one... again I still don't get it. Is it the fantasy of being a soldier that allows you to sink into the role or what? I always imagined CoD to be simply an adrenaline rush kind of game. Same as me with Burnout 3 or Need For Speed. I've spent hundreds of hours on them and love them but I can't "get lost in them" because there's no world, characters, or story. It's like pure arcade fun, a completely different feeling. I assumed multiplayer FPSs are much the same, have I got this wrong?

Zelda Ocarina of Time

could play it anyday I spent alot of my time in the game just looking at stuff.

and hitting random trees because I love the world so much.

Does that mod take away the stacking units? Because that's the main reason why I consider Civ 5 to be superior to Civ 4