America isn't the world, how many times must this be said. I didnt ask you for vgchart numbers. I dunno why you are suddenly linking to random numbers from this site. When I ask for numbers I ask for official data. Sources that state GBA was outselling the PSP in absolute numbers the year it launched in and I was expecting you to give me an analysis of this data.

The GBA was on the market for 7 years, first you claim it was killed off prematurely. Now you claim "Gameboy Advance's numbers only dried up long after the DS' arrivial.

Which is the case for pretty much every handheld..."

You are contradicting your own arguments. So what is it lawl. Is it a case for every handheld to be killed off prematurely.


Go and look up when it was discontinued but I dont reckon you have looked up any solid data since all you came up with is vgchartz numbers.

But I'll do the harder work for you, here are the GBA shipments in it's last 2 full years
2006: 8.3m
2007: 4.3m
2008: ~2m

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2007/070426e.pdf#page=21

You should stop defending that gba was killed prematurely, that viewpoint is silly now with this data. 

It fel off a cliff because demand vanished. "legs were cut out from underneath it prematurely" lawl, sales being halved every year, only a few thousand units left to sell for the system in the coming year, some legs Nintendo cut!
 It'd never be able to match the legs of the PSP. It was never able to stay longer than a decade on the market like the PSP.

It kind of was killed prematurely by Nintendo, the DS came out 2005 right? To last another 3ish years is quite impressive.

However if it wasn't for the DS the PSP would have destroyed the GBA and Nintendo's handheld business.

Nintendo was right to act quickly when they did. I still think the DS wasn't 'ready' when Nintendo first showed it, they probably just found out about the PSP and hand their hands forced.

Regardless they're all quality handhelds, I enjoy all of them.

I never claimed it was discontinued early... is your english failing you again or something?  I

What I said from the start, and continue to say... is that When a new system comes out for a manufactuers, the old system's sales plummet drastically.

Generally by >50%.  As also shown by the PS3 and Vita.

That the GBA's sales only dropped to 50% for 2 years after the DS released showed great resilency for a console.

The DS actually held up far better then you'd expect.

Note, you had to quote 06, 07 and 08.  Despite the fact that the DS came out in 04.

So yeah.  Nintendo cut the legs out from the gameboy advance prematurely....

when it realeased the DS.  The GBA didn't get discontinued yet, but the release of the DS greatly lowered it's sales... because why wouldn't it?  It's the new system the new games would be for, and you could play any GBA game on it.

Outside that... Vgchartz numbers are plenty solid... espiecally after a years time.

If you respond to anything in this post.  Answer this one question.  Do you honestly believe, if the VITA released 3 years after the PSP and had backwords compatability with UMD's that the PSP sales would be just as good?  Or even remotely so?

Um yes you did it was killed off prematurely.

"So it is totally fair to say that the reason the PSP will beat the GBA is because it's legs were cut out from underneath it prematurely."

Seems someone else's English is failing today huh? Are you always trying to patronize people you interact with?  And not even being bothered to read what I and the other were discussing.  To disprove me, you claim things you cant back up. I dont care how reliable estimates are, they are still estimates, and I asked real figures, which you failed to provide.

The DS is out of this story. The excuse of new hardware cutting old hardware's leg isn't exclusive to this story, it happens everytime. The evidence that DS didnt dramatically affect GBA's sales is that it went on being produced for 4 years after the DS came out, and the fact that it was on decline. The PS2 still sold great after PS3 came out but the outline was pretty clear. The PS2 peaked and was on the decline, despite outselling everything and doing great numbers. The same with GBA, it had it's peak year, it was never gonna go up. It was dangerous for Nintendo to rely on a handheld in decline, and PSP around the corner. The DS needed to come out.  If you're still going about "but what if DS wasnt released GBA wouldve went on to sell gazillion units!" you can fantasize all you want but Im not into make believes. That same silly logic also applies to the PS2-PS3 transition.

So now you know, platform holders arent gonna wait until the x system sold counter reaches 0 to bring out a new system.

Not sure why you want me to answer that question, like Ive been trying to make it clear, this is a complete different matter.  The Vita never needed to be out in the market within 3-4 years. Did Nintendo plan to release 3DS that soon that it could threathen Sony's handheld hegemony(which it never was unlike the GBA)? No. There was no need for the Vita. There was need for the DS however. And because of that need and Sony's entrance to the market, Nintendo had to launch the DS to counter PSP.  

This is actually pretty funny.

OT: It will most likely happen sometime in the near future. That is, if Sony doesn't discontinue it.

And people, please quit with the stupid "It sold more in less time!", "Sony supported it for longer!", and "I'm going to defend this for as long as I can!" arguments. They are sad.

So yeah... your english is failing you.  It was a legitamite question... and won that appears to be true.

To cut someones legs out prematurely is a very basic English term meaning "To cut somethings foward momentum"

So to use the basketball thing again.  Lebron James getting injured would be "Cutting the legs from underneath the Heat"

Because it would greatly cut the chances of the heat making it far in the playoffs.

Outside which?  the numbers you originally provided?

Gameboy Advance SP's 2003 numbers?   15.3 million.

Gameboy Advance SP's peak year  2004?

15.43  D

When did DS release?  Late 2004.

So it's actually kind of impressive 2004 was still the highest since it had it's christmas season cut out from under it... when Christmas makes up a huge percentage of sales.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Game_Boy_Advance_SP#Sales_information

Without the DS release that year?  Seems obvious.

The huge drop you talk about isn't until the DS already released.   Which is like a drop to 7 million.  Less then you'd expect.

That said, the PSP should beat it and rightfully be ranked ahead of it in sales... (and I like the PSP more, the GBA just being a glorfied pokemon machine to me).

But to suggest it's based soley on the PSP's merits and not based on each company's relative expectations and wants in the area is a pure fantasy.

Were you to switch manufacturers, and Nintendo were to have released the PSP, and Sony the GBA, keeping all other factors like games and support exactly the same...

Seems pretty obvious the sales totals would line up differently.  You more or less admit so when you talk about the GBA.

PSP's peak year was 2008 wasn't it?

Vita didn't show up until well past then, because Sony's bar wasn't set near as highly.

 So in other words... You said it was killed off prematurely because it's forward going momentum was cut by Nintendo themselves. No need to twist and bend words, the message is understood.


Anyway. We're discussing 2 things here, 1. whether new hw decreases sales of old hw which we both agree on, this is historically always the case. 2.    whether gba would have had the legs of the psp if the DS wasn't there, which we dont agree on. My argument is that GBA would've sold more in this hypothetical market, if there was no PSP, which in return would mean no DS from panic reaction Nintendo in the year PSP launched.  But, since the PSP did come out(and would always come out), the DS had to be Nintendo's answer. It isn't Nintendo's fault GBA dropped like a rock, it is ultimately PSP's fault.

All this fantasizing is silly imo, I could make the case for Dreamcast selling more if it wasnt for the PS2. N64 if it wasnt for the PS1. Xbone/PS4 etc etc. Every console has more sales potential but they sold less due to this and due to that.

Turkish.He is basically saying if Nintendo wanted to sell more GBA they couldve. They just focused on DS which wasnt supposed to substitute GB brand but it was such a hit everybody incuding Nintendo left GBA aside.period

We dont know if they wouldve succeeded in that, who knows what couldve happened in that situation. The PSP shining brighter than ever without the DS, negatively impacting GBA sales due to such a wide and clear disparity in tech/graphics perhaps? A no DS situation would've benefited Sony and not Nintendo. The way history played out, GBA sold all it could hope to sell.

Except... You do realize the DS was launched BEFORE the PSP right?

The PSP was revelealed May 11th 2004.

So it's your conention that the DS was designed and released in 5 months... on the basis of a reveal and that maybe the PSP would do well?

Despite the fact that the Gameboy  systems had crushed numerous stronger competitors before.

Development spans don't work like that... the GBA's early replacement was in the works before the DS was released.

If anything, i'd think it seems more likely the DS started design before the GBA, and when they didn't get the touch screen prices down enough, they modified it into the GBA for a stop gap system.

Additionally  the GBA's drop in 2005 was LOWER percentage wise then basically any other console or handheld that had a percentage drop.  Even PS2 i'd gather but i'm too lazy to look it up, when basically every single other system but PS2 shows the same thing, because quite honestly that's enough proof on it's own.

That in of itself if anything shows the GBA had pleny of untapped potnetial.

As for "fantasizing"... it isn't that.  It's projection.

Quite honestly I quite disliked the GBA.

The PSP is the system that actually first got me to like handheld gaming, I more or less resented the GBA because I was basically forced to buy two second hand on ebay to play the pokemon games,  back when the old pokemon games could be played via Pokemon Collisieum.  

Pokemon is actually the only games are the only Gameboy Advance games I own

To me the PSP is my favorite handheld.  On an all systems list, i'd probably peg it 3rd or 4th all time, behind the SNES, NES.  Fighting for the third spot with the Bally Astrocade.   

That said, projection is part of making a list of GOAT.

The basketball terms haven't been used without reason, it's similar to sports.

Bill Russel has more Rings then Jordan...

Jordan is a better player though.

Speculation is part of what makes fans fans.  And true fans of the mediums should look at and accept things for the global truths, not just the personal ones.