By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Microsoft - Further evidence that MS is potentially having hardware issues in cooling.

DeadBigfoot21 said:

Why are sony fans trying so hard to bash microsoft by starting articles/threads with fake info about the xbox?
I see this everywhere, they must be getting paid good money from sony to look for stuff that is not there. All the spec talk is just nonsense when we saw amazing games at E3 despite them saying otherwise.


I'm not sure if the overheating is fake or not, but It's obvious they are having issues with manufacturing that's why places like Asia won't see consoles till late 2014, and that launch units will be harder to come by. Everyone came to the "Let's bash MS!" train when they showed their whole intentions with DRM. MS had a very good press conference at E3 overall with lots of great exclusives, and the only two downsides were 1) Being $100 more expensive and 2) Not changing their stance on DRM, which Sony took advantage of in their conference. In the end It's the loss of those that aren't willing to buy the system because there will certainly be great exclusives, as there will be with the PS4 and Wii U as well.



It's just that simple.

Around the Network

Look at the size of the thing! There are also vents everywhere. They more than likely made it to specifically target any RRoD like issues that may occur. Misleading thread title. This is nowhere near evidence. Why was the PS3 made so big? Imagine how many more YLOD's may have occurred if it was smaller? I understand where you're coming from but at least change the thread title, it just looks like you have an agenda otherwise.



Mistershine said:
From the 5 billion transistors it appears they are using either 6t or 8t esram, neither of which produce much heat according to B3D. The consensus there seems to be yield issues alone, which is apparently AMD's problem, not Microsoft's. I think the size is a combination of aesthetic and aural requirements.

IBM's problem (ESRAM designer), or Globalfoundries' problem (manufacturer).



Chris Hu said:

It should be a lot smaller with the first redesign especially if they skip the 22nm process (which they really should) and wait for 14nm chips for the first redesign.  

There are no plans for a high performance 22nm or 14nm process by Globalfoundries. I wouldn't expect any process shrinks ever. Or any price cuts for that matter.



Soleron said:
Chris Hu said:

It should be a lot smaller with the first redesign especially if they skip the 22nm process (which they really should) and wait for 14nm chips for the first redesign.  

There are no plans for a high performance 22nm or 14nm process by Globalfoundries. I wouldn't expect any process shrinks ever. Or any price cuts for that matter.


32nm chips will become obsolte eventually if it has a long life cycle like the 360 it will have at least one redesign.  Even the Wii got a redesign.  Also a die shrink is not always necessary for a redesign the PS3 super slim is pretty much the same hardware that was in the last version of the regular slim just rearanged and turned into a top loader.



Around the Network
superchunk said:
kowenicki said:
So this is evidence of issues?

or evidence of a desire to absolutely prevent issues....?

Take your pick. Very different.

Or perhaps they want it to look like AV equipment, which are all about this size.

Either way it isn't "EVIDENCE" of anything whatsoever

Bogus title, pure conjecture.

Ta much.

I'd definitely pick prevention as they recognize a significant risk.

...and I said it was conjecture and my assumptions multiple times.

Calm down Kowenicki.

I think Superchunks point is that, given similar architectures, Microsoft is taking precautionary measures with the size of its console where Sony is not, indicating the increased likelihood of PS4 failures...interesting conjecture.



starcraft - Playing Games = FUN, Talking about Games = SERIOUS

Chris Hu said:
Soleron said:
Chris Hu said:

It should be a lot smaller with the first redesign especially if they skip the 22nm process (which they really should) and wait for 14nm chips for the first redesign.  

There are no plans for a high performance 22nm or 14nm process by Globalfoundries. I wouldn't expect any process shrinks ever. Or any price cuts for that matter.


32nm chips will become obsolte eventually if it has a long life cycle like the 360 it will have at least one redesign.  Even the Wii got a redesign.  Also a die shrink is not always necessary for a redesign the PS3 super slim is pretty much the same hardware that was in the last version of the regular slim just rearanged and turned into a top loader.

They won't be obsolete if there's nothing to replace them that's cheaper.



ethomaz said:

Machiavellian said:

Speak for yourself, I still have a YLOD 60GB PS3 as a door stop.  Sony may not have had as many YLOD as MS but they did have their fair share of them.

Well... every console... not... every equipment have a failure rate close to %5... the big issue here is the 30% of the X360.


Sony YOLD was not 5%.  There was a study done in the UK where the YOLD was happening just as much as MS RROD.  I know, people like to dismiss things all the time just like a lot of people dismissed the RROD issue when it first started to gain tractions.  Hardware wise only Nintendo has a good track record with me, Sony not so much since with the PS2, I faced that CD rom prolem a lot.



Machiavellian said:

Sony YOLD was not 5%.  There was a study done in the UK where the YOLD was happening just as much as MS RROD.  I know, people like to dismiss things all the time just like a lot of people dismissed the RROD issue when it first started to gain tractions.  Hardware wise only Nintendo has a good track record with me, Sony not so much since with the PS2, I faced that CD rom prolem a lot.

I don't know... I never saw a YOLD but RROD every friend mine had it

I have a friend that bought four 360 (the first three RROD) and my PS3 friends have stille the first PS3 model (the fat 60GB).



Chris Hu said:

It should be a lot smaller with the first redesign especially if they skip the 22nm process (which they really should) and wait for 14nm chips for the first redesign.  

It's not clear whether the PS4/XbOne APU chips are 32nm or 28nm. Currently, signs point to a 32nm fab proccess. This is a solid conjecture by Superchunk.

AMD will be moving to 28nm for Steamroller Q4 2013/Q1 2014, and then to 22nm or 20nm for Excavator sometime in 2015. Going from current 32nm (or 28nm which wouldn't help the case in point) to 22nm or 20nm in two years wouldn't enable a drastic slimmer redesign. It's not like PS360 going from 90nm to 45nm(and 40nm for PS3 RSX) which enabled slimmer designs.  Again, Superchunk may be on to something.

For reference, Intel will be on 14nm fab process second half next year with Broadwell, and AMD will be in 22nm or 20nm for Excavator sometime in 2015. It's not clear (or been discussed by AMD) where they will be after Excavator. We will have to wait till after Excavator (2015 or later) to see a drastically slimmer XbOne if it comes down to components and these poor yield and over heating issues are true. However, I suppose Microsoft can do some reworkings when it comes to cooling for the current chipset (again assuming this rumors are true.)

Edit: As Soleron pointed out, it's not clear if GF will have these available. Maybe a manufacturer change can enable these.



e=mc^2

Gaming on: PS4 Pro, Switch, SNES Mini, Wii U, PC (i5-7400, GTX 1060)