leave it to kowenicki to make this microsoft vs sony, how childish

I'm still a firm believer that it will change the console gaming market for the better like it has with PC. Not seeing why you're laughing at our hope? All the sluaghter of late, we need the hope. Hope is our friend.

Hope.

Personally, I look at everything from a business standpoint.  I neither praise or condemn because there are a lot to the issue besides what gamers want.  In a perfect world gamers would be able to get all their games free or for pennies.  Gamers talk about how the publisher are greedy but they do not recognize their own greed.

Used games used to be a very niche thing that turned into a billion dollar industry.  When I go to Gamestop, they push you to buy the used game over the new.  I joined the power up club and I get used game points.  On my birthday, I received a 20% off a any used game instead of new.  It use to be that only Gamestop sold used games but now you can purchase them in grocery stores.  While the used game market is great for consumers and retailers who see those games, it kills developers and publishers who spent millions to make that game.

People point to steam saying that well we can get games cheaper thats why we accept the fact we cannot sell our games but then again isn't that the reason Steam can go that route.  Usually those good deals are actual deals which last a very limited time.  Publishers feel they can still sell games that no longer sell for cheap and still get paid and those games cannot be traded or sold to someone else.

People have used other media like DVDs, CDs and books.  DVDs cannot really be used because the creators make the most of their money at the box office so DVD subsidize their profits.  CDs have had some digital growth problems until Itunes came along.  Books on the other hand really never have this problem as most people probably purchase new and the cost to create the material is no where close to video games.  Actually if you look at it, Video Games are more dependant on retail sells than the other media.  DVDs has the box office.  CDs creators have their concerts where they make their money.  Books more on retail as well but the cost is much lower.

So to sum this all up, there needs to be a balance to the 2nd hand sell now that it has compromised the creators ability to make a profit.  If everybody gets what they want besides the creators, well the system cannot continue.  I am not saying MS  way is right or wrong, its just a way where we might see many different scenerios that come into play to solve this problem.

Hmm that's true. However, they would have to have places like GameStop sell passes or something similar for those who don't connect to the Internet at all. I think a small activation fee (like you stated) wouldn't be too outrageous. And for those of you who bash me and call me anti-consumer, I'll explain why I think a small fee would be ok. A friend of mine's roommate buys used games from GameStop, plays them, and then returns them within 7 days to get a full refund. He did this with Bioshock Infinite for sure (don't know what else). While this isn't the norm, it happens a lot I'm sure. From that exchange neither the publisher nor GameStop got anything out of the purchase. 

So in saying that, I believe that a small fee is ok as long as Internet is not required for it (I don't have Internet half the time at my parents so that would suck). No fee is definitely better for the consumer and is much more attractive, but I understand the point of an activation fee and would be ok with it as long as it is not too outrageous. 

I agree, but like you said there needs to be a balance.

Just about every one of the latest MS policies is designed to charge the customer more. Costs have already gone up this gen...Day1 DLC, Season Pass & Online Pass, map packs, expansion packs that are so minute on additions that you can hardly justify calling them expansion packs.

We really need to ask ourselves why are costs skyrocketing like this? Why is $60 or $70 not enough to profit from when a game sells over 1 - 2 million?

I mean look at Square Enix...their games sold reasonable well Hitman, Tomb Raider, cant remember the other one....but then they still didnt make a profit? And when you look at the actual game they got mediocre to high reviews. Why on earth did these games cost so much? Whose the cause of this?

There are bigger issues here. It seems as if the publishers and manufacturers are passing on the buck here. They need to look at their own processes and ask themselves why do our games costs so much to develop and distrubute?

Theres two options here: either downscale your development and reduce costs, this does NOT mean a lower quality title. Independent small developers and indie developers are proving that good quality games can be made with smaller bugdets. Hell even if the big guys just cut costs a little bit there budgets will still far exceed those of smaller developers.

The other option would be to increase the initial cost of the game. The problem here is that consumers probably won't buy games if the initial cost is too high. So really the only option is the first.

But now we find ourselves in a situation where the main issue isnt been addressed, instead publishers and manufactures are aiming at profiting off markets they were never ever meant to profit from. Creating DRM policies that are so skewed and stringent that it adversely impacts the consumer experience in multiple ways. This is ridiculous. This is why people are upset.

People will speak with their wallets. And yeah at the end of the day MS is running a business but that doesnt mean you intentionally screw over your consumers just to make more money. So many other companies in mulitple other industries have decent relations with their consumers and still profit. So i dont even find this "Well they a business they just need to make money" argument even remotely valid.

Not to mention, some publishers and at times manufacturers are just outright greedy with no explanation whatsover.

no fee is obviously better but if there is to be one the rumoured £35 including the cost of game is too much, a simple £2.99 fee people could lve with

i recently got hold of enslaved and red faction armaggeddon on ps3 for for £3 each with all this new DRM how much will older titles cost? will DRM be cheaper over time i dunno, i simply dont like the sound of it TBH