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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Would the Wii U dying be a good thing for Nintendo and gamers?

I think Wii U is not lost and it's very premature to start digging its grave. What Nintendo needs to is come up with A NEW EXCITING peripheral and bundle it with Wii U (like Wii Fit was, but no I don't mean Wii Fit U) since the peripheral they envisioned would carry this console has not yielded the expected results.



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Navane said:
Soundwave said:
I would be OK with a Nintendo-Sony alliance, Nintendo driving the handheld and Sony maybe being the driver of the console side, but both supplying software and having equal amounts of input into hardware design.

I think that would yield a console better than the PS2 or Super NES even, so I can't see how that would be bad for consumers.

One obvious flaw I can point out is that Sony and Nintendo have drastically different images. To me, it'd appear to be mixing oil and water together.


I don't really see it being an issue. They have differences sure, but that's part of what would make them work great together -- they both bring something to the equation that the other is lacking and would immediately make the other better I think. 



mutantclown said:
I think Wii U is not lost and it's very premature to start digging its grave. What Nintendo needs to is come up with A NEW EXCITING peripheral and bundle it with Wii U (like Wii Fit was, but no I don't mean Wii Fit U) since the peripheral they envisioned would carry this console has not yielded the expected results.


Wii Sex. With new "toy" controller. I'm joking, but that actually probably would outsell Wii Fit U (old idea, people have moved on).



What lesson would it's failure teach them, exactly?



TheLastStarFighter said:
What lesson would it's failure teach them, exactly?


That betting on a controller to carry a platform is great when you can catch lightning in a bottle, but it sure sucks when you don't.

You actually have to do other things right (like get 3rd party support, create a moderately modernized hardware, have a strong online service, good OS, great library of games without droughts, appeal to hardcore players since casuals are unreliable without a controller gimmick, try new franchise ideas, marketing has to be good, etc.).

I would say that would probably be a lesson learned.



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With the PS4 and Xbox likely being in the $400-500 range and still possibly selling at a loss, theres no way Nintendo could put out a console like that. Nintendo systems have always been known for being affordable and family friendly. While I doubt Wii U will win this gen, it will still make a profit and have a place in the market with Nintendo fans, families and as a secondary console. It doesnt need to sell like Wii to be a success, 40-50 million sold is reasonable while getting 20-25% marketshare, let MS/Sony fight for the mainstream market of shooters/racing/sports gamers.



When the herd loses its way, the shepard must kill the bull that leads them astray.

RolStoppable said:
Navane said:

I agree, but as I looked up sales numbers for the Gamecube, I'm actually astonished that Nintendo didn't cut off its Gamecube console at early on and try again. Then again, they didn't have the same amount of revenue earned now, but I can't believe what an utter failure the system was sales-wise. Nintendo may or may not have considered it a failure as it sold ten-million less than the N64, but even that sold terribly.

Looking at the sales number further, Nintendo has consistently sold less systems as each console generation passes. It wasn't until they released the Wii did those sales numbers jump dramatically. But it seems Nintendo has adopted a console strategy that's trying to leech off the Wii user-base, while attracting the hard-core gamer back. It would appear to be a solid strategy in an initial thought, but obviously they tapped that well dry. So it seems that what Nintendo has left are those hardcore faithful to keep the system aflot until they can either release new software in hopes to boost sales, or somehow create a different marketing strategy to dig a new well (most likely both).

It seems that their handheld console business is what they've done consistently well at, but it makes no sense to me why Nintendo can't achieve the same results with their home console business.

1) Considering how the video games market works, it's not really an option to pull the plug on a console, if a company plans to stay in this business. By default, the new system would be surrounded by questions regarding its longevity. Consumers would be hesitant to invest into the hardware, if it could be discontinued within two years. There's no other option than to ride it out for four to five years. By the way, Iwata once said that Nintendo expected to sell about 50m GCs in its lifetime, so its safe to assume that the console was considered a failure. They also had the money to start over again quickly, but that isn't a good idea for the aforementioned reason.

2) Indeed, the Wii U was supposed to retain the Wii audience while winning back the hardcore (whoever those people are). It's a sort of strategy we've seen fail all too often when it comes to games. You know, when a game is supposed to be a sequel to a popular game, but isn't much like the previous game at all. The company in question is trying to take advantage of an established fanbase and sell to a bigger amount of people. Most of the time a big chunk of the fans is lost while the new people who the company wants to attract won't give the product a serious look, because they are put off by the name alone (they didn't care about the previous entry, so why should this one be any different). So at the moment the Wii U is pretty much selling only to the people who buy every Nintendo console. This can change with more and new games in the future, but the damage is already done.

3) The main difference between home consoles and handhelds is that Nintendo has rarely faced a competitor in the handheld market that was serious about it. Additionally, third parties are pretty much required to beat Nintendo, but since most third parties have never been serious about handhelds, Nintendo has never encountered as tough of a challenge in the handheld market as in the home console space. Hence why they came out on top in the handheld market every single time.

Meanwhile, in the home console market they have two big competitors nowadays. Companies that have been willing to lose billions on toys and courted third party developers to the best of their abilities (at least most of the time), to the point that third parties have come to expect incentives for developing for a platform. This basically leaves Nintendo with two options as a console manufacturer:

1. Make a system that plays to their own strengths and "sacrifice" the hardcore (whoever those people are). There's quite a big amount of people who can live without the so-called hardcore content. Nintendo has the IPs and talent to operate highly profitable with such a strategy, especially because most of the rest of the industry can't or doesn't want to sell to such people. It's going to secure Nintendo's spot in the long term.

2. Make a system that caters to third parties and thus becomes much like their competitors' consoles. Even if Nintendo succeeded at that, the profit margins would be thin, because the competition is so fierce.

One of those strategies is clearly better than the other, but for the eighth generation Nintendo went with the bad strategy, even though in the seventh generation they made it a clear point to avoid just that.

With respect to your second point there (from the bottom), I do think if Nintendo had offered a fairly modern chip (lets say 1.2 TFLOP GPU) and really leveraged that full year headstart, they really could've pushed Sony out of the market in a lot of ways. Sony is in massive debt and having to start say 10 million units behind Nintendo with Nintendo also having a pricing advantage would probably be the death knell for Sony.

Microsoft is Microsoft, they'll always have money to burn, so you kinda just tolerate that, but I think Nintendo probably could've carved out a strong no.2 spot for themselves at a minimum this generation, but they just couldn't resist following the Wii formula once again, even though all the tea leaves were telling them that blue ocean audience has moved on.



RolStoppable said:
Soundwave said:

With respect to your second point there (from the bottom), I do think if Nintendo had offered a fairly modern chip (lets say 1.2 TFLOP GPU) and really leveraged that full year headstart, they really could've pushed Sony out of the market in a lot of ways. Sony is in massive debt and having to start say 10 million units behind Nintendo with Nintendo also having a pricing advantage would probably be the death knell for Sony.

Microsoft is Microsoft, they'll always have money to burn, so you kinda just tolerate that, but I think Nintendo probably could've carved out a strong no.2 spot for themselves at a minimum this generation, but they just couldn't resist following the Wii formula once again, even though all the tea leaves were telling them that blue ocean audience has moved on.

What exactly should the console have been like? Comparable processing power and RAM to other eighth generation consoles doesn't need explanation, but what kind of controller would be standard and how much would it cost at retail? Still though, if Sony got all the same third party games, I don't think Nintendo could have pushed Sony out of the market. That's because with all things being equal, people will choose the brand they trust. Hence why Microsoft couldn't beat Sony in Japan and Europe, despite having a few advantages.

Nintendo didn't follow the Wii formula, that's the entire problem. There are virtually no important similarities between the Wii and Wii U.


I genuinely do think the Wii U tablet is a neat device, but all things considered, I think it simply was the wrong idea at the wrong time and is too cost prohibitive of a controller with a whole bunch of issues (ie: having 2 per console is going to be a rarity).

I think a compartively specced Nintendo platform with a full year headstart and the Wiimote + Pro controller as the main controllers would beat Sony.

It would be like the PS2/GCN all over again, only difference being the PS2 would belong to Nintendo this time and Sony would be in the role of the GameCube.



People starting these threads in the Nintendo fortum should be permanently banned. This is just provocation and offensive.



RolStoppable said:
Soundwave said:

I genuinely do think the Wii U tablet is a neat device, but all things considered, I think it simply was the wrong idea at the wrong time and is too cost prohibitive of a controller with a whole bunch of issues (ie: having 2 per console is going to be a rarity).

I think a compartively specced Nintendo platform with a full year headstart and the Wiimote + Pro controller as the main controllers would beat Sony.

It would be like the PS2/GCN all over again, only difference being the PS2 would belong to Nintendo this time and Sony would be in the role of the GameCube.

So how much would it cost? $350 without a game?

The main problem that remains though is that you assume Nintendo would have gotten every third party multiplatform game with such a console. Also, for its first year the console would have shared its multiplatform games with the 360 and PS3, thus many of the Wii U's current problems would exist in a similar way for this hypothetical Nintendo console. Expensive, not enough exclusive content, people holding out to see what Sony and Microsoft will bring to the table.

I think $350 would be reasonable, sure. By the time the PS4/720 come out, they could comfortably slide it down $299.99 and be probably $100, even $200 cheaper.

A 7770 AMD GPU is 1.2 TFLOP and is like $80-$90 retail. Slap 4 overclocked Broadway cores to that and you have a system that could basically run any PS4/720 game in 720p at least. It wouldn't be able to fit in a tiny little box like Nintendo would want (it would maybe have to be the size of the original NES for instance -- the horror!) and it would consume more electricity, but who cares. Power consumption could be brought down over the years anyway with die shrinks.

Any scenario is going to have some challenges, that's the nature of competetion. But I think this type of system would've secured Nintendo a much more comfortable future than where they're at now, where they're stuck with an expensive controller that the general public is not responding to in the same way as the Wiimote (which was a predictable result -- you're pushing your luck if you think you could win the lottery twice).