I don't hate Sony, I just don't like their style of games, which usually heavily stresses cinematics. I like maximum freedom and action in my game, not "enter corridor -> watch cutsene -> rinse and repeat" that many Sony games seem to adhere to. Call me ADD, but I simply do not possess the patience to sit through endless cutscenes. If you must use cutscenes to convey your story, I expect them to be limited in my games, and they'd better be damn interesting, or offer some sort of interactive or "chose your own adventure" type quality (Mass Effect, Dragon Age). Granted, Sony obviously isn't the only perpetrator of this but they seem to use it more than most developers. I never grew up with Sony games, so franchises like God of War, Jak and Dexter, Sly, etc don't hold any meaning for me. While Little Big Planet seems fun, it seems like a poor immitation of Mario.

I also felt Sony's arrogance in the mid 2000s was getting annoying and their launch price of $600 is still absurd to me (though in all fairness, Nintendo's current arrogance is approaching that level). I actually might have gone for a PS3 instead of a 360 if only Sony's machine wasn't so expensive. Of course now it's a good price, but at this point, I have all the gaming I need and have no need for a PS3, which still only has about 3 or 4 exclusive games I would even care about anyway.

Finally, what's with the shapes for button labels? Could never get use to that.. "Press triangle to shoot!" Just doesn't sound right :P

As a PC fan, from the outside looking in, Sony isn't the problem, it's Sony fans that are the problem. Ever since the "OMG Nintendo is soooo kiddy!" phase of PS1 vs N64, there's been a lot of arrogance and entitlement by Sony fans.

Hell, even I stayed away from Sony consoles just because I didn't want to be associated with arrogant Sony fans.

What do you think sonys launch lineup for PS1 was? Sony had no game studios back then...they didn't have the sales to make case for exclusives. They were just rounding up 3rd party companies and financially supporting them to get their games on to playstation. Some games like Battle Arena Toshinden had to sign exclusive deals, hence why the Saturn version had to be different and was 6 months late to the party. Same thing with Wipeout and Destruction derby.

Here is a clip which talks about sony's mentality for getting exclusive games using tactics which today Sony fans accuse Microsoft of moneyhating. (6-6:20 minute mark)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=6u9EmmPbyhQ#t=360s

It all fair and frankly I don't fault Sony for doing this at all. It comes down to money, and when Sony entered the game industry they were willing to spend more than Sega or Nintendo ever imagined. Good for them. Their E3 conference was flashier, their advertising budgets were massive. I remember reading in Gamepro that Sony's marketing budget for 1996 holiday season was 100 million while Segas was 15.

However I do think that toe to toe, Sega's game develpment talent runs circles around Sony's own in house stuff up until the end of dreamcast. But Sony had the 3rd parties in the bag since day on on PS1 and that's why they were successful...

you forgot NSanity, Proclus, Sales2099(MLD), Man-Bear-Pig, SlimeBeast, DirtyP(can't remember full name), Ji99saw(can't remember the name is correct)

i believe that Whiplash, JayWood and LostPlanet are #Team360 aswell for the most part

there are some others that i can't really remember at the moment but whatever..

I was, on purpose, not trying to list all of them

it didn't say anything about Sony moneyhatting for games to come earlier than on Saturn

ive seen that video numerous times and i watched it again just to see what you were talking about

is this video the "source" of where you think Sony moneyhatted all those games and made sure that they released 1st on PS instead of Saturn?

At this point Im not sure if you are aware of what moneyhatting is or why you are asking for links which say "Sony moneyhatted games so they don't get to the saturn". All you have to do is use common sense.

In 1994-1995 sony needs games but have no studios to make them - sony pays 3rd party studios to make them some games. You know, like microsoft when they are moneyhatting. They buy some games/studios outright but some studios are allowed to make their games on other platforms but only after a certain time period. You know, like buying exclusivity, like Microsoft. Toshinden, Wipeout and Destruction Derby were all released on the Saturn but 6 months to a year later. These were the big heavy hitters on PS1 for the 1995 holiday season.

Is this any different than what Microsoft did with Tales of Vesperia or any times exclusive?

I'm lost. After reading this thread in its entirety, I still have no clue. About anything! My brain hurts.., where's Dr Kawashima when you need him?

what's your complete definition of moneyhatting?

so was Toshinden, Wipeout and Destruction Derby the only games that came out later on Saturn?

Sony said in that video that the Saturn just simply didn't have many games when it came out and it sounds like everybody was flocking to the PlayStation ove the Saturn from the start judging by what they were saying about the retailers  not having enough PS consoles to last through the holiday season. Like would somebody know if all those games were planned to even release on the Saturn?

like look at stuff like Star Ocean 4. We knew that game was supposed to be coming to the PS3 but later it was said that they couldn't release it on ps3 for certain reasons then it finally came out a year later.

but how many games came out later on Saturn though because it sounds like the Saturn was pretty much in dead water from the start

doesn't seem like Sega fans would get mad because of Destruction Derby, Toshinden and Wipeout

I don't hate Sony. I own a PS1, PS2 and PSP. I just prefer Nintendo.