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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - The Official Legend of Zelda Thread: EoW Trailer Shows Off Still World, Swordfighter Form

 

Best Zelda news from the June Nintendo Direct?

The Legend of Zelda: Echoes of Wisdom 6 75.00%
 
Four Swords on NSO 0 0%
 
Hyrule Edition Switch Lite 2 25.00%
 
Total:8

My favorite improvement playing Wind Waker HD? The camera! I don't have to press up to look down or left to look right anymore!!



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cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:

I think you're really missing the big picture. I don't think a single game, especially a game that sold 4.6 million units and is adored by critics and fans, can doom a system. Gamecube did poorly mostly because of its competition: the PS2. It built on the huge install base from PS1, featured an avalanche of must-have titles, and featured DVD playback. 

You're placing the blame unfairly on Wind Waker.


@ bolded

That's exactly my point right there you just said it, Zelda for GC should have been by all means the most anticipated next gen title at the time, and up to the the point of WW reveal it probably was, afterall it was coming off one of the most well known game amongst gamers at the time called Ocarina of Time.

Now I might have just exaggerated a bit on WW impact on GC sales, but it did play a major role in not helping the GC.

But Ocarina came out five years earlier. The most recent console Zelda was Majora's Mask, a game that sold LESS than Wind Waker.

I don't think Wind Waker was the most anticipated sixth-gen title at the time, either. Games like Metal Gear Solid 2, Final Fantasy X, and Super Mario Sunshine were probably higher on that list.

In any event, I believe strongly that the sales of Gamecube influenced the sales of Wind Waker much more than the sales for Wind Waker influenced the sales of Gamecube. I just don't think a realistic-looking Zelda based off the mechanics of Ocarina would have convinced PS2 owners to abandon ship, anymore than Wind Waker did.



cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:
cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:

Stumbled across this over at Kotatu: http://kotaku.com/the-internets-2001-hate-for-one-of-the-most-beautiful-1441105533

The editors retrieved some of more venomous comments about the original Wind Waker art direction from 2001.

 


I know that there are many wind waker fans here but like it or not it is one of the main reasons why the GC failed, it single handedley brought down the GC and almost nintendo. WW is to GC is the same as a $599 price tag on the ps3 or what a lack of games and an uninteresting gamepad is to the wiiU.

I don't think nintendo would ever make a big mistake like that again, but then again the wiiU is on a dangerous road right now.

I think you're really missing the big picture. I don't think a single game, especially a game that sold 4.6 million units and is adored by critics and fans, can doom a system. Gamecube did poorly mostly because of its competition: the PS2. It built on the huge install base from PS1, featured an avalanche of must-have titles, and featured DVD playback. 

You're placing the blame unfairly on Wind Waker.


@ bolded

That's exactly my point right there you just said it, Zelda for GC should have been by all means the most anticipated next gen title at the time, and up to the the point of WW reveal it probably was, afterall it was coming off one of the most well known game amongst gamers at the time called Ocarina of Time.

Now I might have just exaggerated a bit on WW impact on GC sales, but it did play a major role in not helping the GC.

Did the 64 win?

It had arguably the best game of all time.  



Veknoid_Outcast said:

Stumbled across this over at Kotatu: http://kotaku.com/the-internets-2001-hate-for-one-of-the-most-beautiful-1441105533

The editors retrieved some of more venomous comments about the original Wind Waker art direction from 2001.

So called hardcore gamers. They are simply one of the worst crowd out there. 



irstupid said:
cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:
cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:

Stumbled across this over at Kotatu: http://kotaku.com/the-internets-2001-hate-for-one-of-the-most-beautiful-1441105533

The editors retrieved some of more venomous comments about the original Wind Waker art direction from 2001.

 


I know that there are many wind waker fans here but like it or not it is one of the main reasons why the GC failed, it single handedley brought down the GC and almost nintendo. WW is to GC is the same as a $599 price tag on the ps3 or what a lack of games and an uninteresting gamepad is to the wiiU.

I don't think nintendo would ever make a big mistake like that again, but then again the wiiU is on a dangerous road right now.

I think you're really missing the big picture. I don't think a single game, especially a game that sold 4.6 million units and is adored by critics and fans, can doom a system. Gamecube did poorly mostly because of its competition: the PS2. It built on the huge install base from PS1, featured an avalanche of must-have titles, and featured DVD playback. 

You're placing the blame unfairly on Wind Waker.


@ bolded

That's exactly my point right there you just said it, Zelda for GC should have been by all means the most anticipated next gen title at the time, and up to the the point of WW reveal it probably was, afterall it was coming off one of the most well known game amongst gamers at the time called Ocarina of Time.

Now I might have just exaggerated a bit on WW impact on GC sales, but it did play a major role in not helping the GC.

Did the 64 win?

It had arguably the best game of all time.  

Did the GC outsell the 64?



My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



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green_sky said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:

Stumbled across this over at Kotatu: http://kotaku.com/the-internets-2001-hate-for-one-of-the-most-beautiful-1441105533

The editors retrieved some of more venomous comments about the original Wind Waker art direction from 2001.

So called hardcore gamers. They are simply one of the worst crowd out there. 

Ha yea I read that earlier too.

Reading that though has cemented in me that the next Zelda is going to look just like the tech demo they showed for Wii U or very similar.  I just can't imagine a company basically repeated history to a dime.  Imagine if the next Zelda looks like Wind Waker again.  To have twice shown these realistic tech demo's and then going the anime route would shock me.   Could you imagine the internet outrage if the Wii U Zelda was too look as mature people say "kiddy" again. 

Especially considering they decided out of all their games to redo Wind Waker in HD.  I can't imagine them doing same/similar art style for both Wii U games.  

So to those "mature" people out there.  At least you have that to look forward too.  The next installment in the Zelda series is going to be a more realistic art style.  How realistic is anyones guess, but at minimum more realistic than Wind Waker.

Will it please people?  Hell no.  Heck just look at recent 3DS game.  People bitched and complained about the art change that did mid development.

Behold the treasonous Nintendo making Link "goofier" as one article titles.

[spoiler]

[/spoiler]



cyberninja45 said:
irstupid said:
Did the 64 win?

It had arguably the best game of all time.  

Did the GC outsell the 64?

You placing a lot of sales on Zelda which has never been a huge system seller.

64 sold what 10 million more than the gamecube.

How many zelda's have sold 10 million?  'hint answer is none

Wind Waker sold only 3 million less than the best selling Zelda game ever (ocarina, or TP if you join GC/Wii sales).  It sold over a million more than the previous Zelda.

So let me ask you this.  Did Wind Waker lose 3 million fans of the Zelda series or did it retrieve 1 million of the fans back.

1998 - Ocarina of Time - 7.6 million

2000 - Majora's Mask - 3.36 million

2002 - Wind Waker - 4.6 million

Looks like Wind Waker saved a dying franchise from those numbers.  And as you pointed out, GC had smaller userbase.



Veknoid_Outcast said:
cyberninja45 said:
Veknoid_Outcast said:

I think you're really missing the big picture. I don't think a single game, especially a game that sold 4.6 million units and is adored by critics and fans, can doom a system. Gamecube did poorly mostly because of its competition: the PS2. It built on the huge install base from PS1, featured an avalanche of must-have titles, and featured DVD playback. 

You're placing the blame unfairly on Wind Waker.


@ bolded

That's exactly my point right there you just said it, Zelda for GC should have been by all means the most anticipated next gen title at the time, and up to the the point of WW reveal it probably was, afterall it was coming off one of the most well known game amongst gamers at the time called Ocarina of Time.

Now I might have just exaggerated a bit on WW impact on GC sales, but it did play a major role in not helping the GC.

But Ocarina came out five years earlier. The most recent console Zelda was Majora's Mask, a game that sold LESS than Wind Waker.

I don't think Wind Waker was the most anticipated sixth-gen title at the time, either. Games like Metal Gear Solid 2, Final Fantasy X, and Super Mario Sunshine were probably higher on that list.

In any event, I believe strongly that the sales of Gamecube influenced the sales of Wind Waker much more than the sales for Wind Waker influenced the sales of Gamecube. I just don't think a realistic-looking Zelda based off the mechanics of Ocarina would have convinced PS2 owners to abandon ship, anymore than Wind Waker did.

Majora's Mask is considered a follow up to OOT as much as people consider Other M a follow to corruption, not saying that MM is the same quality as Other M though. Yes SMS gets placed in the same bracket as  WW in every way.

NO I don't think MGS 2 was as anticipated as Zelda probably a final fantasy if I remember correctly.

@ bolded this goes strongly against the common theory that software influences hardware sales are you sure that is your stance on it.



My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



irstupid said:
cyberninja45 said:
irstupid said:
Did the 64 win?

It had arguably the best game of all time.  

Did the GC outsell the 64?

You placing a lot of sales on Zelda which has never been a huge system seller.

64 sold what 10 million more than the gamecube.

How many zelda's have sold 10 million?  'hint answer is none

Wind Waker sold only 3 million less than the best selling Zelda game ever (ocarina, or TP if you join GC/Wii sales).  It sold over a million more than the previous Zelda.

So let me ask you this.  Did Wind Waker lose 3 million fans of the Zelda series or did it retrieve 1 million of the fans back.

1998 - Ocarina of Time - 7.6 million

2000 - Majora's Mask - 3.36 million

2002 - Wind Waker - 4.6 million

Looks like Wind Waker saved a dying franchise from those numbers.  And as you pointed out, GC had smaller userbase.


As I pointed out in another post OOT and MM are as different as Metroid Prime and Other M. Let me put it another way did you consider Mario to be a dying franchise because of this?

2009- New Super Mario Bros Wii - 27.12 million

2010- Super Mario Galaxy 2 - 7.07 million

I want you to seriously answer that question.

Admittedly back on the nes and snes zelda was not much of a system seller, it was game you bought because you already have the console and it was a good game, popular but  not a system seller at the time. But after OOT it was a game people would have bought a console for because it built its reputation as a must have game.



My 3ds friendcode: 5413-0232-9676 (G-cyber)



cyberninja45 said:
irstupid said:
cyberninja45 said:
irstupid said:
Did the 64 win?

It had arguably the best game of all time.  

Did the GC outsell the 64?

You placing a lot of sales on Zelda which has never been a huge system seller.

64 sold what 10 million more than the gamecube.

How many zelda's have sold 10 million?  'hint answer is none

Wind Waker sold only 3 million less than the best selling Zelda game ever (ocarina, or TP if you join GC/Wii sales).  It sold over a million more than the previous Zelda.

So let me ask you this.  Did Wind Waker lose 3 million fans of the Zelda series or did it retrieve 1 million of the fans back.

1998 - Ocarina of Time - 7.6 million

2000 - Majora's Mask - 3.36 million

2002 - Wind Waker - 4.6 million

Looks like Wind Waker saved a dying franchise from those numbers.  And as you pointed out, GC had smaller userbase.


As I pointed out in another post OOT and MM are as different as Metroid Prime and Other M. Let me put it another way did you consider Mario to be a dying franchise because of this?

2009- New Super Mario Bros Wii - 27.12 million

2010- Super Mario Galaxy 2 - 7.07 million

I want you to seriously answer that question.

Admittedly back on the nes and snes zelda was not much of a system seller, it was game you bought because you already have the console and it was a good game, popular but  not a system seller at the time. But after OOT it was a game people would have bought a console for because it built its reputation as a must have game.

Ocarina and Majoras are not as different as those two games.

AND you wouldn't know the difference until you played it or read a review.  Ocarina and Mask look the same, on same console, play for all practical purposed the same, and so on.  

If a person loved Ocarina then UNLESS they read some review/preview that explained the differences or played it at a friends house then there is absolutely zero reason to assume they aren't exactly the same.

Galaxy and New super mario bros a 2 year old could tell them apart

I would compare Majora's/Ocarina to Metroid 1/3.  

Metroid 1 is more open world, less linear, less story driven.  Metroid 3 is less open world, more linear and more story driven.   

Majora's mask is more open world, less linear, less story driven.  Ocarina is less open world, more linear and more story driven.