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Forums - Nintendo Discussion - Wii U hacked and CPU clock speed revealed, apparently.

Those of you that keep making sensationalized statements based only on the clock speed number don't understand that this CPU is a totally different architecture than what you're familiar with. The WiiU CPU is a RISC processor, the other consoles use a CISC processor. The difference is that a RISC uses significantly less complex instructions, meaning there is a lot less processing overhead when crunching numbers. RISC processors are also designed to do more with each clock cycle (better efficiency). This provides a huge boost per clock cycle in the amount of computations that can be done, especially for gaming tasks such as physics and AI. This is why, though the CPU has less raw clock speed than the 360, it could theoretically be a bit faster at the tasks it's asked to do when code is optimized for the architecture. Coupled with the fact that the GPU is much faster and can take on some additional tasks, plus there is a separate DSP, and the fast interconnects referenced by z101, this gives it a significant leg up over the current gen in future *optimized* games (which none of these ports were).

Keep in mind that the WiiU is most likely about 2x more powerful than the current gen with optimized code (based on total power including the GPU), it is certainly a step up. The next consoles from MS/Sony will be even more powerful, but I don't think the gap isn't going to be anywhere near what it was between the Wii & PS360.



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That Zelda demo is still the most impressive thing I've seen the console do, and I think it's impressive enough. I don't think I've seen anything that looks as good on the PS360. So I think it'll be fine.



Train wreck said:
Teriol said:
i can write anything on internet... so i don't believe in this "hacker" lol

So if this 'hacker' revealed that the Wii U had a super fast CPU that was miles better than what the PS360 had, would you be saying the same?  I honestly doubt it.

if he say the wiiu has a super  6.0 Ghz procesor someday i stay in my position (don´t believe him) because i believe more in the developers who are doing games for the system, they say the cpu is a little slow not a lot and a lot others have price the wiiU very good so until someone more oficial  write  about the real performance of the wiiU cpu, that day i believe about  the specs.



34 years playing games.

 

Nem said:
JGarret said:
What I find more interesting than the (even more disappointing than I thought) numbers, is the thing has apparently been hacked already.

 

Taking a console apart and measuring the hardware does not equal that its security has been hacked. Hold your horses there.

To know these numbers they had to take the part off of the Wii U and connect it to a PC. Also, lets not forget that this isnt exactly the most trustworthy source.

It's a 100% trustworthy source. The work of Marcan lead to the PS3 being hacked, you remember fail0verfl0w? He was resonsible for most of that. He was also responsible for most of the original Wii hack.

It has nothing to do with "taking it apart and connecting it to a PC".

Don't talk about what you don't understand.



Did anyone actually read any of his later tweets?

"It's worth noting that Espresso is *not* comparable clock per clock to a Xenon or a Cell. Think P4 vs. P3-derived Core series."

"The Espresso is an out of order design with a much shorter pipeline. It should win big on IPC on most code, but it has weak SIMD."

"And I'm sure it's not an "idle" clock speed. 1.24G is exactly in line with what we expected for a 750-based design."

"So yes, the Wii U CPU is nothing to write home about, but don't compare it clock per clock with a 360 and claim it's much worse. It isn't."

So, if you are not familiar with CPU architecture, "lolz, the number is lower wii u sux rofl" comments may be a bit misplaced



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timmah said:
Those of you that keep making sensationalized statements based only on the clock speed number don't understand that this CPU is a totally different architecture than what you're familiar with. The WiiU CPU is a RISC processor, the other consoles use a CISC processor. The difference is that a RISC uses significantly less complex instructions, meaning there is a lot less processing overhead when crunching numbers. RISC processors are also designed to do more with each clock cycle (better efficiency). This provides a huge boost per clock cycle in the amount of computations that can be done, especially for gaming tasks such as physics and AI. This is why, though the CPU has less raw clock speed than the 360, it could theoretically be a bit faster at the tasks it's asked to do when code is optimized for the architecture. Coupled with the fact that the GPU is much faster and can take on some additional tasks, plus there is a separate DSP, and the fast interconnects referenced by z101, this gives it a significant leg up over the current gen in future *optimized* games (which none of these ports were).

Keep in mind that the WiiU is most likely about 2x more powerful than the current gen with optimized code (based on total power including the GPU), it is certainly a step up. The next consoles from MS/Sony will be even more powerful, but I don't think the gap isn't going to be anywhere near what it was between the Wii & PS360.

There is so much bullshit in your first paragraph that I don't know where to start.



curl-6 said:
Ah, the Megahertz Myth. I remember this old fallacy from back in the 90s, and I can't believe people STILL think clock speed = power.

Each Wii U core takes up no more than 1/3 of the area of a 360 core. It is therefore not faster per-clock, unless a miracle happened at IBM. Performance = clock speed * performance per clock (approximately, yes it's a tautology).

To use an example from the 90s, would you rather have a 600MHz Pentium III or a 1.6GHz Pentium 4? The Pentium III was faster per-clock, but the difference is so big that you'd obviously get the P4.



keroncoward said:

I have a Toshiba Laptop with a 1.5ghz processor and its a lot faster than my previous Dell Laptop with a 2.8ghz processor. Clock Speed does not matter anymore in this day and age. Archetecture is more important.

Without reading the hole thread,.... THIS!



Kynes said:
timmah said:
Those of you that keep making sensationalized statements based only on the clock speed number don't understand that this CPU is a totally different architecture than what you're familiar with. The WiiU CPU is a RISC processor, the other consoles use a CISC processor. The difference is that a RISC uses significantly less complex instructions, meaning there is a lot less processing overhead when crunching numbers. RISC processors are also designed to do more with each clock cycle (better efficiency). This provides a huge boost per clock cycle in the amount of computations that can be done, especially for gaming tasks such as physics and AI. This is why, though the CPU has less raw clock speed than the 360, it could theoretically be a bit faster at the tasks it's asked to do when code is optimized for the architecture. Coupled with the fact that the GPU is much faster and can take on some additional tasks, plus there is a separate DSP, and the fast interconnects referenced by z101, this gives it a significant leg up over the current gen in future *optimized* games (which none of these ports were).

Keep in mind that the WiiU is most likely about 2x more powerful than the current gen with optimized code (based on total power including the GPU), it is certainly a step up. The next consoles from MS/Sony will be even more powerful, but I don't think the gap isn't going to be anywhere near what it was between the Wii & PS360.

There is so much bullshit in your first paragraph that I don't know where to start.

Wow, great argument. People like you are the reason I quit posting on this site full of people who don't have a clue how to debate & disagree in a civil manner years ago. I'm wondering why I came back.



timmah said:
Those of you that keep making sensationalized statements based only on the clock speed number don't understand that this CPU is a totally different architecture than what you're familiar with.

No. It's a very similar architecture to Gamecube and Wii. It's also used in servers we have performance data for. We are VERY familiar with it.

The WiiU CPU is a RISC processor, the other consoles use a CISC processor.

Nope they're both RISC.

The difference is that a RISC uses significantly less complex instructions, meaning there is a lot less processing overhead when crunching numbers. RISC processors are also designed to do more with each clock cycle (better efficiency). This provides a huge boost per clock cycle in the amount of computations that can be done, especially for gaming tasks such as physics and AI.

This was true in the 1980s. Now it is not, because instruction complexity isn't much of a factor in efficiency any more. The overhead for x86 vs ARM, estimated by Intel, is 10% of die area. The difference between the Wii U and 360 dies is a LOT more than 10%. Try 300%. And even then a 10% difference can easily be swamped by better or worse design choices by each CPU.

This is why, though the CPU has less raw clock speed than the 360, it could theoretically be a bit faster at the tasks it's asked to do when code is optimized for the architecture.

Yes. But the clock speed disparity is so huge that the Wii U CPU cannot be faster no matter how much better you might care to speculate it is per clock.

Coupled with the fact that the GPU is much faster and can take on some additional tasks, plus there is a separate DSP, and the fast interconnects referenced by z101, this gives it a significant leg up over the current gen

Yes. The GPU is faster. The Wii U has different strengths and weaknesses to 360/PS3 for sure.

in future *optimized* games (which none of these ports were).

No. What we see now is what we get. Optimisation cannot produce the kind of leap you are imagining, and third parties will not be putting in the effort to do so because the easy route is just to stick to PS3/360 for another year and then jump to PS4/720.

They told us the Cell would eventually be optimised for and be amazingly better. The Cell was actually suited to optimisation as well, being something brand new (unlike Wii U). We didn't see any leap of that kind, especially not versus the competition.