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Forums - Politics - What can be done with Isreal? Realistically!

Mr Khan said:
jonnybmk said:
Rath said:
jonnybmk said:
If Palestine became a "state", they would, along with the rest of the Muslim world, still want to annihilate all of the Jews and Christians that exist in the world (including all other "infidels").

Make no mistake, Islam does not take prisoners and does not negotiate.

A Palestinian state is not going to stop the march of Islam's attempt to control the world and murder those who stand in its way. This is not some peaceful, innocent religion. It's a religio-political force that has somehow found a way to be "offended" by everyone else and is placated by governments across the globe.

"Don't offend the Muslims!"

To think otherwise is naive at best.

You are really, really Islamophobic aren't you?


No. I'm a realist.

Facts did this for me.

Don't worry though, Mr. Kahn doesn't agree with my point of view and I will soon be on vacation.

It's not a matter of point of view. I warned Roma for intense anti-Israeli comments. Hate is not tolerated here, period.

And here's the thing: If the Palestinians tried peace, that would not stop Israel from just taking more and more of their land in the West Bank. Violence doesn't work, peace doesn't work, they're basically fucked. Wouldn't you hate someone who put you in that position, where there was nothing you could do, whether you picked up a gun or a protest sign, but sit back and wait for the day that they hustle you off your land?


I would probably hate them.

But Muslims will always hate the Jews and Christians and everyone that's not a Muslim. That is my point. The United States could give Texas to Palestine and the Jews would still be hated by Muslims.

Muslims have more innocent blood on their hands than the Jews ever will.



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Mr Khan said:
MrBubbles said:
Mr Khan said:
NightDragon83 said:
The bigger question is what can be done with the Palestinians? Realistically!

These people are essentially castaways from their own lands, and they are nothing but pawns used against Israel by their own leaders and fellow Muslims in a never ending quest to eradicate the Jewish population from the face of the Earth.

I would love to see the world unite behind Israel and tell the Palestinians and the Muslim population in general that they need to shape up or ship out. Unfortunately this will never happen, as most of the world in their twisted viewpoint thinks that Israel is the problem, and that if they were to just go away or at the very least be "contained" by the rest of the world, then there would magically be peace in the most tumultuous region in the world.

See, i think just the opposite. I think what the world needs is a solidarity-style total boycott of Israel until an accord is reached. Israel knows that they have it made in the position they're in right now, and they're abusing it as they continue to strangle the life out of the West Bank. They need someone to bully them into peace.


and what of all these groups that refuse to even accept israel at all.... i mean they teach children to kill jews on the childrens television programming in the palestinian territories.  or even then outside terrorists passing through the territories to attack them.   i cant imagine any concession from israel actually making them safe and changing everyones mind.

(i do think there could be some unilateral actions by israel towards peace, but that really only bolsters international support and does nothing to solve the problems with the palestinians as far as i can see)

That's the beauty of it. Israel doesn't have to change anyone's mind. People really don't get just how much impossibly stronger Israel is from anyone in the region right now. The only countries in the world with a shot at stopping the Israeli military, if for some reason they had to fight them, would be Turkey, Russia, Brazil, India, China, Germany, America, France, Italy, or Britain.  Israel would just piss all over the entire middle east if for some reason they allied with the intent of stopping Israel, so a reasonable solution wouldn't weaken Israel's position, and if the Palestinians tried to push further, Israel would be perfectly capable of pushing back.

Someone bigger than the two parties has to force them into an objective peace, and that will be the end of it.


withdrawing from gaza didnt help them.   in theory they withdraw completely to 67 lines, give half of jerusalem to palestinians, stop the blockade on gaza,  give palestinians control over the west bank border with jordan....does it matter if they can crush a military...if they have to deal with what they are dealing with from gaza now on a larger scale and with increased firepower since it would be far easier to get weapons from iran and whichever arab countries are also supplying them?   people dont suddenly unlearn that jews are filth that deserve to be killed and are still occupying territory they feel is theirs.

then israel has to retake all of this and reimplement all of their controls.   so say they can do that ....  but how many people die in the process on both sides?   it seems logical to expect that to happen. was it worth it?



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MrBubbles Review Threads: Bill Gates, Jak II, Kingdom Hearts II, The Strangers, Sly 2, Crackdown, Zohan, Quarantine, Klungo Sssavesss Teh World, MS@E3'08, WATCHMEN(movie), Shadow of the Colossus, The Saboteur

jonnybmk said:
If Palestine became a "state", they would, along with the rest of the Muslim world, still want to annihilate all of the Jews and Christians that exist in the world (including all other "infidels").

Make no mistake, Islam does not take prisoners and does not negotiate.

A Palestinian state is not going to stop the march of Islam's attempt to control the world and murder those who stand in its way. This is not some peaceful, innocent religion. It's a religio-political force that has somehow found a way to be "offended" by everyone else and is placated by governments across the globe.

"Don't offend the Muslims!"

To think otherwise is naive at best.


How about we kick you off your property, take it for ourselves and see if you get "offended".



jonnybmk said:
I have a question for the people in here that have really good backgrounds on this stuff:

Are Muslims nations/societies free? Free in the way that we think of being "free"?

Some. Turkey arguably tilts more in the opposite direction, where Turkish society has elements that try to repress Islam more than a Muslim group oppressing others. The United Arab Emirates is fairly tolerant (they would have to be: 75% of their society is immigrants, and they have large Christian and Hindu populations, though still majority Muslim). Indonesia has done pretty good since they got rid of Suharto, and Malaysia's making strides.

Forewardness or backwardness really has nothing to do with a country's religious background. Germany, the birthplace of protestant Christianity, had militant monarchism and then, of course, Nazism. Most of Catholic Europe embraced Fascism, and Orthodoxy has been perceived to have an "anti-democratic" tradition. It's all about economic development: the more developed you are, the more tolerant and free you are. There's a reason that the rise of democracy in Western Europe coincides with the post-Columbus era, when Europe really began to pull ahead of the rest of the world. One can look at the Russian Empire, which was given a chance at democracy and fell to Communism, while their second chance at democracy is (sort of) sticking

Of course, we see the Muslim world "abuse" the freedom of democracy, by voting in the restrictions of Islam, but that happened all over the world as well. The French Revolution of 1848 was defeated by the fact that the freshly-enfranchised peasants, totally under the sway of the Catholic Church, voted themselves back into monarchism (a la Louis Napoleon III)

In time, freedom will grow there as well. Part of the problem is much of the wealth in the Middle East is plundered by the upper class (the nature of an extraction-based economy).



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

I think Israel is a terrorist country. They've never hesitated about bombing and killing defenceless civilians. They break so many international laws and conventions it's not even funny, but they have the American bully behind them, so they think they can do whatever they want. And the Americans fund Israel's wars, which I think was the real reason behind 9/11. You allow and help them to kill the Muslims, so you got a punch as well. As long as the US supports Israel, you can't really complain about the Muslims hating you. It's war down there, and if you support one side as strong as you do, you are a part of it.
I reckon the Jews absolutely deserve all the hatred and violence they receive, cause the Israeli and the Muslims are totally worth each other and you can't say that one side is better than the other. There are no good guys and bad guys there. I think all the Muslims terrorists are beasts, make no mistake about it. I'd feel much safer in general if the population of Arabs and Muslims in Europe wasn't growing like it is, but hey, we can't be killing them just because of that.
At the end of the day, the Jews just took from the British the land that the Muslims owned and lived in for what, 2000 years? That doesn't seem legit to me and no wonder they want to throw the Jews out.

What is incredible about the Jews is that they've never learned anything from their history. No matter when and where they went, they were pissing everyone out and it ended up in them being killed or at least thrown out. Egypt, Rome, Italy, France, Spain, Germany (other countries and nations in between as well) and now it's the Muslims' turn. Guess it's just they way they roll. They are lucky that Iran or some other Muslim country can't turn their country from desert to nuclear desert. Yet.

Plus it's not like Israel is even trying to be a democratic country like Europe or US, Canada, etc. They have total censorship and violate human right on a daily basis. Maybe if they tried to be and not just pretend to be civilised, I'd change my opinion. No reason to do it so far. They seem to be something like China. Evil that the West tolerates. Only China seems to be a lot less evil as of late.



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fordy said:
jonnybmk said:
If Palestine became a "state", they would, along with the rest of the Muslim world, still want to annihilate all of the Jews and Christians that exist in the world (including all other "infidels").

Make no mistake, Islam does not take prisoners and does not negotiate.

A Palestinian state is not going to stop the march of Islam's attempt to control the world and murder those who stand in its way. This is not some peaceful, innocent religion. It's a religio-political force that has somehow found a way to be "offended" by everyone else and is placated by governments across the globe.

"Don't offend the Muslims!"

To think otherwise is naive at best.


How about we kick you off your property, take it for ourselves and see if you get "offended".


If Palestine was a state, would the violence end? Would Muslims suddenly decide that Jews shouldn't be annihilated? 



Mr Khan said:
jonnybmk said:
I have a question for the people in here that have really good backgrounds on this stuff:

Are Muslims nations/societies free? Free in the way that we think of being "free"?

Some. Turkey arguably tilts more in the opposite direction, where Turkish society has elements that try to repress Islam more than a Muslim group oppressing others. The United Arab Emirates is fairly tolerant (they would have to be: 75% of their society is immigrants, and they have large Christian and Hindu populations, though still majority Muslim). Indonesia has done pretty good since they got rid of Suharto, and Malaysia's making strides.

Forewardness or backwardness really has nothing to do with a country's religious background. Germany, the birthplace of protestant Christianity, had militant monarchism and then, of course, Nazism. Most of Catholic Europe embraced Fascism, and Orthodoxy has been perceived to have an "anti-democratic" tradition. It's all about economic development: the more developed you are, the more tolerant and free you are. There's a reason that the rise of democracy in Western Europe coincides with the post-Columbus era, when Europe really began to pull ahead of the rest of the world. One can look at the Russian Empire, which was given a chance at democracy and fell to Communism, while their second chance at democracy is (sort of) sticking

Of course, we see the Muslim world "abuse" the freedom of democracy, by voting in the restrictions of Islam, but that happened all over the world as well. The French Revolution of 1848 was defeated by the fact that the freshly-enfranchised peasants, totally under the sway of the Catholic Church, voted themselves back into monarchism (a la Louis Napoleon III)

In time, freedom will grow there as well. Part of the problem is much of the wealth in the Middle East is plundered by the upper class (the nature of an extraction-based economy).


Could I walk down the streets of Tehran wearing an American flag tshirt with a Holy Bible in my hand and not be murdered for it based on Muslim "religious" laws?



jonnybmk said:


I would probably hate them.

But Muslims will always hate the Jews and Christians and everyone that's not a Muslim. That is my point. The United States could give Texas to Palestine and the Jews would still be hated by Muslims.

Muslims have more innocent blood on their hands than the Jews ever will.


That's a pretty broad generalisation, since:

1. During the middle ages, the middle eastern area was very tolerant towards all religions. Jews, Christians and Muslims were all living together.

2. The Islamic faith includes Jewish and Christian holy doctrines as well as their own. They are all essentially part of the same family of monotheistic belief. Chritianity branched from Judaism, and Islam branced from both of those. It's merely a continuation of the same story, but with different perspectives at key points.

The Muslims I've met in real life just want to live their life happily like the rest of us. Their leaders denounce all forms of violence from all sides. These are the silent majority that the media refuse to acknowledge.



Scisca said:
I think Israel is a terrorist country. They've never hesitated about bombing and killing defenceless civilians. They break so many international laws and conventions it's not even funny, but they have the American bully behind them, so they think they can do whatever they want. And the Americans fund Israel's wars, which I think was the real reason behind 9/11. You allow and help them to kill the Muslims, so you got a punch as well. As long as the US supports Israel, you can't really complain about the Muslims hating you. It's war down there, and if you support one side as strong as you do, you are a part of it.
I reckon the Jews absolutely deserve all the hatred and violence they receive, cause the Israeli and the Muslims are totally worth each other and you can't say that one side is better than the other. There are no good guys and bad guys there. I think all the Muslims terrorists are beasts, make no mistake about it. I'd feel much safer in general if the population of Arabs and Muslims in Europe wasn't growing like it is, but hey, we can't be killing them just because of that.
At the end of the day, the Jews just took from the British the land that the Muslims owned and lived in for what, 2000 years? That doesn't seem legit to me and no wonder they want to throw the Jews out.

What is incredible about the Jews is that they've never learned anything from their history. No matter when and where they went, they were pissing everyone out and it ended up in them being killed or at least thrown out. Egypt, Rome, Italy, France, Spain, Germany (other countries and nations in between as well) and now it's the Muslims' turn. Guess it's just they way they roll. They are lucky that Iran or some other Muslim country can't turn their country from desert to nuclear desert. Yet.

Plus it's not like Israel is even trying to be a democratic country like Europe or US, Canada, etc. They have total censorship and violate human right on a daily basis. Maybe if they tried to be and not just pretend to be civilised, I'd change my opinion. No reason to do it so far. They seem to be something like China. Evil that the West tolerates. Only China seems to be a lot less evil as of late.


i have this strange suspicion you are just a troll from all the ignorance and hate in your post.   i certainly hope that you are a troll anyways... 



"I like my steaks how i like my women.  Bloody and all over my face"

"Its like sex, but with a winner!"

MrBubbles Review Threads: Bill Gates, Jak II, Kingdom Hearts II, The Strangers, Sly 2, Crackdown, Zohan, Quarantine, Klungo Sssavesss Teh World, MS@E3'08, WATCHMEN(movie), Shadow of the Colossus, The Saboteur

jonnybmk said:
fordy said:
jonnybmk said:
If Palestine became a "state", they would, along with the rest of the Muslim world, still want to annihilate all of the Jews and Christians that exist in the world (including all other "infidels").

Make no mistake, Islam does not take prisoners and does not negotiate.

A Palestinian state is not going to stop the march of Islam's attempt to control the world and murder those who stand in its way. This is not some peaceful, innocent religion. It's a religio-political force that has somehow found a way to be "offended" by everyone else and is placated by governments across the globe.

"Don't offend the Muslims!"

To think otherwise is naive at best.


How about we kick you off your property, take it for ourselves and see if you get "offended".


If Palestine was a state, would the violence end? Would Muslims suddenly decide that Jews shouldn't be annihilated? 

Depends on where the borders are drawn. 

The majority are indifferent towards an Israeli state, but when their land is taken, that's when they get pissed, like any reasonable person would...

The radical movements are from a collective of these people who see it as a bastion to their suffering.