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Forums - Gaming - Did the Wii U force Sony to cut how much power the PS4 will have?



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Scisca said:

MS has no chance in Japan, cause the Japanese buy Japanese products and games. It's the same in the US - Americans buy X-box, because it's American. In Europe we just choose the best offer, that's why the PS3 dominates the 360. If the next gen X-box is better than Wii U/PS4 it will easily win in Europe.

Europe is the only market in which the best one actually wins.


I wouldn't really say we pick the best offer, it's more to do with the huge diversity in Europe then anything, you need to be more broad in approach to do well in Europe.



I don't really mind too much. So as long as I can pay ~$400 for it with a game, then I'll be happy. But I won't get it till a year after it launches.



e=mc^2

Gaming on: PS4 Pro, Switch, SNES Mini, Wii U, PC (i5-7400, GTX 1060)

Nem said:
Kresnik said:
I'd actually been wondering for a while if Sony were going to side with Nintendo on the power front next generation.

Basically, this gen we had PS3 > 360 (but only slightly) >>> Wii. Nearly all multi-plats were developed for the HD twins.

Next gen, what if it was Xbox >>> PS4 > Wii-U. Where would the third parties go then? Would they go straight to the most powerful, or would the hang back with PS4/Wii-U provided there was sufficient market share there?

Or would, in fact, Xbox even go that much more powerful? What if all 3 consoles were just a minor increment more powerful than the HD twins? Wii-U would join the HD race; Sony would clean up and make a more approachable and multi-tasking console; Microsoft might be able to put some power aside for Kinect.

Idk. Will be interesting to see how it plays out anyway.


I'm glad other people are realising that. Its what i've been saying ever since the Wii U was first unveiled. The graphical difference between the 3 cant be huge, otherwise they cant compete in price.

And the scenario you described with the Xbox out of the loop, could happen aswell with the Playstation Orbis out of the loop if it turned out too powerful. Sont doesnt have money for that battle, so Sony has to stick to Nintendo. Its the only chance they have to compete with price and still be more powerful than the WiiU. Wether that power is significant or not is something were gonna see.

Microsoft aims at the same croud Nintendo does (the living room), so its garanteed they will ship with kinect for that end. The difference here is, microsoft can also make a powerful system with that and sell it at a huge loss cause umm... they have the money for that.


You put into words what I was thinking



We need moar Zelda, now!

We need moar Unchartedzz!

We need less DLCs.

Scisca said:

MS has no chance in Japan, cause the Japanese buy Japanese products and games. It's the same in the US - Americans buy X-box, because it's American. In Europe we just choose the best offer, that's why the PS3 dominates the 360. If the next gen X-box is better than Wii U/PS4 it will easily win in Europe.

Europe is the only market in which the best one actually wins.

It is not anywhere near the same in the US. The Wii and PS3 combined for over 60 million hardware sales in the US. 360 has sold about half that. In Japan, 360 has sold less than 2 million units. It has a 7% marketshare, compared to Sony's 22/23% marketshare in the US, and the Wii's 40%. Americans are willing to buy Japanese products. Actually, more of them are willing to buy Japanese products than American products.

Japan is still an enormous market, and as long as Nintendo and Sony are splitting over 90% of the console market there and leaving the scraps for Microsoft, I cannot see a situation in which Microsoft becomes the market leader. I won't say 'never,' but it would have to win by an outrageously large margin in both America and Europe.

It's an interesting perspective to take that Europe picks the best console. I agree that the Wii was the best console this gen, but I'm not sure that's the most reliable method for determining that.



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JEMC said:
M.U.G.E.N said:

now if only I could understand what this means :D

Yeah, me too. But then there's wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Through-silicon_via

And then 2 more things:

joeorc said:

http://www.i-micronews.com/news/Sony-wide-IO-memory-Playstation-Vita,9334.html

Earlier this year Masaaki Tsuruta, CTO of Sony Computer Entertainment, indicated that there will likely be a 3D stack incorporating TSV technology in the next generation console. Sony's target of no more than 50ms latency even for 8k x 4k resolution at 300fps, clearly points to the need for a highly integrated TSV-based package although Tsuruta warned "We will have to work with a lot of third-party partners to make these things happen."

He can't really be talking about the PS4. Impossible unless he's talking about displaying the simplest of the graphics.

Not even a GTX680 in SLI could display graphics at 8k x 4k at 300fps. Unless that "fps" doesn't mean "frames per second", ofc.

joeorc said:

Sony plans to use TSV for its next gaming station CPU/GPU

 
Sony Computer Entertainment is planning on a much longer shelf life for its next generation PlayStation gaming console with a strategy that appears to be based around refreshing the platform over its lifetime with a series of high profile, cutting edge technology including TSV interconnects base packaging.
Masaaki Tsuruta, CTO of Sony Computer Entertainment, says that the company is working on a system-on-chip (SoC) to underpin the product for "seven to 10 years". The PlayStation 3 will be at least seven years old by the time its successor arrives, but is generally considered to have lasted longer than was originally expected. A firm launch for the fourth generation console - not to be called PlayStation 4 - was pushed out again late last year. Its designed-in longevity is largely a matter of economics. 

The Cell Broadband Engine that powered the PS3 cost $400m to develop; the main SoC for the incoming console is likely to be a 3D stack incorporating thru-silicon-via technology and could be the first $1bn hardware design project. “We have to look at two things,” Tsuruta-san says, “return-on-investment (ROI) and turnaround time (TAT).” The ROI issue, given the further costs of bringing a new PS to market (software, marketing, etc), means that Sony will be looking at a number of years and revs of the machine's insides.

If that is true, I feel sorry for them because they have learned nothing.

1. Probably video playback.

2. Sony knows what they are doing much more than we do as far as money is concerned.



JoeTheBro said:
JEMC said:

<snip>

1. Probably video playback.

2. Sony knows what they are doing much more than we do as far as money is concerned.

1-I don't think so. TV manufacturers are now starting to ship the first 4K TVs. That's 3840 x 2160 or 4K x 2K. Why do they need something for 8K x 4K? And why do they need 300fps for video playback? Even for 3D films that's more than necessary.

2-Given their financial situation, I'm not so sure about that.



Please excuse my bad English.

Former gaming PC: i5-4670k@stock (for now), 16Gb RAM 1600 MHz and a GTX 1070

Current gaming PC: R5-7600, 32GB RAM 6000MT/s (CL30) and a RX 9060XT 16GB

Steam / Live / NNID : jonxiquet    Add me if you want, but I'm a single player gamer.

The thing about the Japanese market is that Microsoft went all out to win a foothold at the start of this generation and it still did little good. I would love to know how much money they spent because it wasn't just generic exclusives they were buying. They seriously pulled in some big names. It just went nowhere. It will be interesting to see if they give up pouring resources into Japan or just consider it a lost cause.

Even with those paid exclusives, the other consoles had far and away more games that the Japanese like. There is little reason for the average gamer to wedge another huge console under their TV when it doesn't really have that much of what they're looking for.



the_dengle said:
Scisca said:

MS has no chance in Japan, cause the Japanese buy Japanese products and games. It's the same in the US - Americans buy X-box, because it's American. In Europe we just choose the best offer, that's why the PS3 dominates the 360. If the next gen X-box is better than Wii U/PS4 it will easily win in Europe.

Europe is the only market in which the best one actually wins.

It is not anywhere near the same in the US. The Wii and PS3 combined for over 60 million hardware sales in the US. 360 has sold about half that. In Japan, 360 has sold less than 2 million units. It has a 7% marketshare, compared to Sony's 22/23% marketshare in the US, and the Wii's 40%. Americans are willing to buy Japanese products. Actually, more of them are willing to buy Japanese products than American products.

Japan is still an enormous market, and as long as Nintendo and Sony are splitting over 90% of the console market there and leaving the scraps for Microsoft, I cannot see a situation in which Microsoft becomes the market leader. I won't say 'never,' but it would have to win by an outrageously large margin in both America and Europe.

It's an interesting perspective to take that Europe picks the best console. I agree that the Wii was the best console this gen, but I'm not sure that's the most reliable method for determining that.

I take a different approach to these calculations. I wouldn't divide the market like this: Wii+PS3 vs. X360. I think it's PS3 vs. X360 and the Wii forms a totally different market, that there was no American competition on until the Kinect. The Wii has never been an alternative to the PS360. But I have to agree, you guys are less anti-Japanese, then they are anti-US when it comes to consoles.

When it comes to Europe, we just calculate the offers without being biased and go for what's more attractive. When it comes to my country for example, Sony is the only company that treated the market and gamers seriously and from the start has given us by far the best product. Second was MS, the worst offer came from Nintendo and it is totally reflected in the sales, where it's PS3>X360>>>>Wii and PSP>>>>>>>>DS.



Wii U is a GCN 2 - I called it months before the release!

My Vita to-buy list: The Walking Dead, Persona 4 Golden, Need for Speed: Most Wanted, TearAway, Ys: Memories of Celceta, Muramasa: The Demon Blade, History: Legends of War, FIFA 13, Final Fantasy HD X, X-2, Worms Revolution Extreme, The Amazing Spiderman, Batman: Arkham Origins Blackgate - too many no-gaemz :/

My consoles: PS2 Slim, PS3 Slim 320 GB, PSV 32 GB, Wii, DSi.

Scisca said:

I take a different approach to these calculations. I wouldn't divide the market like this: Wii+PS3 vs. X360. I think it's PS3 vs. X360 and the Wii forms a totally different market, that there was no American competition on until the Kinect. The Wii has never been an alternative to the PS360. But I have to agree, you guys are less anti-Japanese, then they are anti-US when it comes to consoles.

When it comes to Europe, we just calculate the offers without being biased and go for what's more attractive. When it comes to my country for example, Sony is the only company that treated the market and gamers seriously and from the start has given us by far the best product. Second was MS, the worst offer came from Nintendo and it is totally reflected in the sales, where it's PS3>X360>>>>Wii and PSP>>>>>>>>DS.

Apart from the whole "Wii doesn't count" thing you've got going on, which I object to, I don't know what you're talking about here. Wii is the market leader in all three major regions, including Europe.