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Forums - Politics Discussion - Russia condemns United States for human rights record...Russia condemns us..What's next? China condemning the U.S as well?

spurgeonryan said:

 

"The U.S. claim on the role of absolute leader in the sphere of human rights is unsustainable and is not confirmed by practical realities," Itar-Tass quoted the Foreign Ministry's human rights envoy Konstantin Dolgov as saying to lawmakers.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/22/us-russia-usa-humanrights-idUSBRE89L14O20121022

 

Well it's true, though.  It's what many other world leaders think as well.  We torture people in our prison camps without trial or due process.  We have more incarcerated citizens per capita than any other nation on earth.  We're 50th in life expectancy, and in the bottom 30% in infant mortality.  We drop drone missles that routinely miss their target, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in the process.

We may be overall 'better' than China or Russia, but we have nothing to brag about.



 

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sperrico87 said:
spurgeonryan said:

 

"The U.S. claim on the role of absolute leader in the sphere of human rights is unsustainable and is not confirmed by practical realities," Itar-Tass quoted the Foreign Ministry's human rights envoy Konstantin Dolgov as saying to lawmakers.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/22/us-russia-usa-humanrights-idUSBRE89L14O20121022

 

Well it's true, though.  It's what many other world leaders think as well.  We torture people in our prison camps without trial or due process.  We have more incarcerated citizens per capita than any other nation on earth.  We're 50th in life expectancy, and in the bottom 30% in infant mortality.  We drop drone missles that routinely miss their target, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in the process.

We may be overall 'better' than China or Russia, but we have nothing to brag about.

Great job: nice try at having it both ways.

(And we are not *remotely* like China *or* Russia--if you believe otherwise, you clearly don't read much  or ever get outside your self-reinforcing bubble.)



ECM said:
sperrico87 said:
spurgeonryan said:

 

"The U.S. claim on the role of absolute leader in the sphere of human rights is unsustainable and is not confirmed by practical realities," Itar-Tass quoted the Foreign Ministry's human rights envoy Konstantin Dolgov as saying to lawmakers.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/22/us-russia-usa-humanrights-idUSBRE89L14O20121022

 

Well it's true, though.  It's what many other world leaders think as well.  We torture people in our prison camps without trial or due process.  We have more incarcerated citizens per capita than any other nation on earth.  We're 50th in life expectancy, and in the bottom 30% in infant mortality.  We drop drone missles that routinely miss their target, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent civilians in the process.

We may be overall 'better' than China or Russia, but we have nothing to brag about.

Great job: nice try at having it both ways.

(And we are not *remotely* like China *or* Russia--if you believe otherwise, you clearly don't read much  or ever get outside your self-reinforcing bubble.)

So you believe we are the world leader in championing human rights? 



 

i can't claim to be very well educated on russian current affairs... what human right violates are we to be concerned about?



ECM said:
Great job: nice try at having it both ways.


(And we are not *remotely* like China *or* Russia--if you believe otherwise, you clearly don't read much  or ever get outside your self-reinforcing bubble.)

A good place to look would be here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA

Specifically, go to the Controversies tab, though here's a snippet:

"Areas of controversy about inappropriate, often illegal actions include experiments, without consent, on human beings to explore chemical means of eliciting information or disabling people. Another area involved torture and clandestine imprisonment. There have been attempted assassinations under CIA orders and support for assassinations of foreign leaders by citizens of the leader's country, and, in a somewhat different legal category that may fall under the customary laws of war, assassinations of militant leaders."

There's quite a few things that go beyond that and it's just what's come out in the public eye, but it's pretty safe to say that no country is 'clean'. There's little doubt that every country has done a lot of very questionable things. The CIA has one hell of a record, simply put, but so does the (defunct) KGB, the Russian equivalent. Everyone is plenty dirty, when you get down to ideologies.



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kitler53 said:
i can't claim to be very well educated on russian current affairs... what human right violates are we to be concerned about?

Unfair trials, government pushing into freedoms of speech and what not, opponents of the presidency getting jailed and dying in prison, etc. Sort of thing that's been going on for a while.



Hate me all you want, disagree with me all you want, but I absolutely agree with Russia on this, the U.S is the king of double standards when it suits their needs.

I'll end my involvement in this thread right now.



Haters just wish they were the United States.



"Everything we hear is an opinion, not a fact. Everything we see is a perspective, not the truth." -My good friend Mark Aurelius

sperrico87 said:
spurgeonryan said:

 

"The U.S. claim on the role of absolute leader in the sphere of human rights is unsustainable and is not confirmed by practical realities," Itar-Tass quoted the Foreign Ministry's human rights envoy Konstantin Dolgov as saying to lawmakers.

 

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/22/us-russia-usa-humanrights-idUSBRE89L14O20121022

 

.  We're 50th in life expectancy, and in the bottom 30% in infant mortality.  

just wanted to respond to this part. those numbers are highly misleading. First off why calculate infant mortality significantly different than most countries. if we were to calculate based off the way say Germany does, then we are inline with Norway for infant mortality, and norway has one of the lowest in the world. Thats because many countries have "size" or "weight" requirements for it to be considered a "live" birth. the US on the other hand, a baby that shows any sign of life whatsoever is counted as a live  birth. Also the US has a much higher rate of pre-term babies born than most other countries. Those babies die at 30x the rate than our average, and account for over half of all our baby deaths.

As for life expectancy, again very misleading, we have pretty high homocide rate, and accidental deaths. if you control for those to factors alone, it greatly increases our life expectancy.To further that point, we drive a lot more than most countries, all that driving costs us many lives, that otherwise wouldnt have ended if we didnt drive cars so much (also all that driving means we get less exercise from things like walking and biking). Lastly we have food. a whole lot of food. A whole lot of unhealthy food. this causes many people to eat very unhealthy, and obviously this often causes death. If other countries stuffed their faces with cake as much we do, they life expexency would go way down. A better measurement would control for these factors, or we could look at survival rates from diseases or injuries. Which we lead the world in many of those.



homer said:
Haters just wish they were the United States.


No, no we don't.