By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - Microsoft - Did Microsoft just make Nintendo's Wii U tablet irrevelant?

happydolphin on 13 June 2012
thx1139 said:
h2o1977 said:
There is no way that the smart glass is going to beat Nintendo Wii U..
It sounds interesting but it has a long way to go, in order to compete with Nintendo.

People just dont understand shades of grey and competition.

SmartGlass doesnt need to beat Wii U. It is competition and from what we have seen the uses of the Wii U except for whats being done with Zombie U (And even that can be done, just maybe not as effieciently) can be done with SmartGlass.  Most of the games that Nintendo has shown so far make use of the Wii U screen as a screen for an extra player or for informational purposes. Things that SmartGlass can do quite well. Some examples this gen.

Just Dance series on Wii doesnt really know that you are dancing when you shake the Wii Mote and Dance Central tracked full body movement with Kinect. People playing Just Dance still had fun.

Most of the games in Wii Sport only relied on using the Wii Mote as a motion controlled switch.  You didnt need to make the actions like the real sport to play.  People still had fun.

Not to mention that no one is speaking about what SmartGlass features that the Wii U controller doesnt have.

1) SmartGlass is multi-touch. Yes Nintendo says they dont need it.  We will see.  We will see how many people expect pinch and zoom and it never works.
2) Xbox 360 can handle up to 4 SmartGlass devices.  Wii U can handle 2.
3) SmartGlass works with the devices people already know.
4) SmartGlass devices will be more powerful devices with developers more experienced with the platform.
5) SmartGlass will have a much larger install base and that will appeal to publishers when it comes to decisions about building in features common to both platforms or to provide special features for the larger install base.

Good post.

@bold. I agree with that, and hinted on it in my last post to you. However, I wouldn't blame h2o, I would blame OP and the thread title.

1) I agree, and I think Nintendo said they don't need it because they just don't want to up the HW costs, as an excuse. Multi-touch is an added value to smartglass that's for sure.

2) It's debatable as to how this will affect bandwidth and image broadcasting. If it does support 4 devices it will most likely be programmatically limiting the visual output the controllers will receive, if the WiiU's 2 padlet and downing of framerate limitations are any indicator.

3) That doesn't matter. The Wii is a product people know, and Nintendo is a brand the mass recognizes. This is a non-issue.

4) Yes, but at the same time this requires interoperability and/or specific experience of various devices. This leads to increased development complexity imho. Unless the MS API does it for you automatically, in which case this is not an argument. On the flipside, the con to this is that some devices will not support all features due to missing HW pieces (in HW differences, kind of like for Android). Talk about consumer confusion...

5) I guess, then again the WiiU has the advantage of being a new console, with all the marketing involved in the launch of a new console, as well as the sourrounding SW purchasing culture that revolves around launch period into the 1st and 2nd years of the console. So it's again debatable since by that time it's likely that the WiiU will already be catching up to a 40M install base.



Around the Network
VicViper on 13 June 2012

 

Picture of Wii U's netflix.

To me smart glass will be great for this, but nothing much else.

You cant add important game stuff in it, since not everyone will use it.



happydolphin on 13 June 2012
VicViper said:

Picture of Wii U's netflix.

To me smart glass will be great for this, but nothing much else.

You cant add important game stuff in it, since not everyone will use it.

This will be smartglass' main use, but "nothing" is a big word. Read me and jedi's exchange for an idea of what's possible with SG.



VicViper on 13 June 2012
happydolphin said:

This will be smartglass' main use, but nothing is a big word. Read me and jedi's exchange for an idea of what's possible with SG.


Sure, bad word indeed. It'll have it's uses - if done well, could even be some great stuff. But I really have my doubts it'll happen much stuff besides the obvious.

Just adding to my previous post:



happydolphin on 13 June 2012

^OMFG. Super seamless.



Around the Network
thx1139 on 13 June 2012
happydolphin said:
thx1139 said:
h2o1977 said:
There is no way that the smart glass is going to beat Nintendo Wii U..
It sounds interesting but it has a long way to go, in order to compete with Nintendo.

People just dont understand shades of grey and competition.

SmartGlass doesnt need to beat Wii U. It is competition and from what we have seen the uses of the Wii U except for whats being done with Zombie U (And even that can be done, just maybe not as effieciently) can be done with SmartGlass.  Most of the games that Nintendo has shown so far make use of the Wii U screen as a screen for an extra player or for informational purposes. Things that SmartGlass can do quite well. Some examples this gen.

Just Dance series on Wii doesnt really know that you are dancing when you shake the Wii Mote and Dance Central tracked full body movement with Kinect. People playing Just Dance still had fun.

Most of the games in Wii Sport only relied on using the Wii Mote as a motion controlled switch.  You didnt need to make the actions like the real sport to play.  People still had fun.

Not to mention that no one is speaking about what SmartGlass features that the Wii U controller doesnt have.

1) SmartGlass is multi-touch. Yes Nintendo says they dont need it.  We will see.  We will see how many people expect pinch and zoom and it never works.
2) Xbox 360 can handle up to 4 SmartGlass devices.  Wii U can handle 2.
3) SmartGlass works with the devices people already know.
4) SmartGlass devices will be more powerful devices with developers more experienced with the platform.
5) SmartGlass will have a much larger install base and that will appeal to publishers when it comes to decisions about building in features common to both platforms or to provide special features for the larger install base.

Good post.

@bold. I agree with that, and hinted on it in my last post to you. However, I wouldn't blame h2o, I would blame OP and the thread title.

1) I agree, and I think Nintendo said they don't need it because they just don't want to up the HW costs, as an excuse. Multi-touch is an added value to smartglass that's for sure.

2) It's debatable as to how this will affect bandwidth and image broadcasting. If it does support 4 devices it will most likely be programmatically limiting the visual output the controllers will receive, if the WiiU's 2 padlet and downing of framerate limitations are any indicator.

3) That doesn't matter. The Wii is a product people know, and Nintendo is a brand the mass recognizes. This is a non-issue.

4) Yes, but at the same time this requires interoperability and/or specific experience of various devices. This leads to increased development complexity imho. Unless the MS API does it for you automatically, in which case this is not an argument. On the flipside, the con to this is that some devices will not support all features due to missing HW pieces (in HW differences, kind of like for Android). Talk about consumer confusion...

5) I guess, then again the WiiU has the advantage of being a new console, with all the marketing involved in the launch of a new console, as well as the sourrounding SW purchasing culture that revolves around launch period into the 1st and 2nd years of the console. So it's again debatable since by that time it's likely that the WiiU will already be catching up to a 40M install base.

Like I mentioned before the word "irrevelant" is harsh.  The real change between this generation and last is that the Wii U will be introduced into a market with a competitor that has a machine basically as powerful as the Wii U and with many of the same capabilities (and in some ways more) for devices that people already have.

Last generation Nintendo was able to introduce a console far less powerful than competitors, but had a compelling capability that was not present on the competitions consoles until 4 years later.  Nintendo doesnt get this 4 year head start this time and the Wii U will be drastically underpowered compared to the Xbox Next and PS4.

This all leaves the Wii U as a console that I feel will wilt in the market quicker than the Wii did.  Look at the Wii. It had 3 great years, but since Kinect and Move hit the market the Wii sales have plummeted.  I find it very doubtful that the Wii U has an initial couple of years like the Wii had. Sure the Nintendo faithful will purchase a Wii U sight unseen, but dont expect the market from the rest of consumers to jump on board like they did with the Wii and SmartGlass is one of the reasons.



Its libraries that sell systems not a single game.

endimion on 13 June 2012
happydolphin said:
endimion said:
TheProphet said:
Poor Microsoft. It only has billions and billions of dollars, a profitable pc business it stole from Apple. Of course it needs to drive Sony and Nintendo out of business, after all they only invented the game industry.


yeah because Microsoft wasn't incoporated before apple and didn't publish games before sony.....

The post you answered to was kind of dumb, but your reply is even dumber. You tackled nothing of what he actually said and simply shifted the goalposts.

 

Good job, your previous posts just lost all their credibility (not that they had any in the first place). The WiiU pad not comfortable? It's more comfortable to hold a 360 controller and a padlet?

Why do some of us even argue with people like you, such a waste of time.

and you my friend are very annoying and disrespectful..... as much as i hate some brands fir personal reasons and beliefs (nintendo not being one of them i litteraly grew up with the brand).... I try to keep to a minimum the bashing of the people under their wings ...

second thank you at 29 going on 30 I have no need of recognition of my posts on a VG website to feel confortable about my integrity and credibility.... I was just answering a dumb post with a sarcastic one if you feel like the entire structure of my intelect seat on one post good for you....

 

second I never argued the confort of one over the other but the mere fact that the argument of number of hands against smartglass was dumb because to effectively and confortably use the WiiU tablet part with touch you also have to free one of your 2 hands from one side or the other from the "mechanical" part of the said pad.... then I merely argued that it would even be easier to use a separate tablet while having both hands on the pad buttonswith XB pad or for that matter any pad just becauseit's a physical fact I can have at least 4 fingers free at any moment on a pad but the only way I can touch a tablet with this would be with a separate tablet device........ did not say it was more confortable.... I even said lets not go there because of the ridicule of that line of argument....

and for the X time I'm part of the group that said that smartglass was a great add on and anybody saying it wasn't is either a moron with no clue or somebody with a lack of imagination.... but that it wasn't in anyway a killer app for thw WiiU pad.... I like to compare it to the bonus content on Blu Ray (smartglass) more than to the WiiU pad....

So before starting insulting and/or attacking people you know nothing about with argument that have little to no value beside being disrespectful and childish.... read properly.... there is a reason I bother reading every single page of a post before posting (I'll admit in most cases not all)

and while I think you have realy lame tacticts to achieve your own little auto satisfaction over actually trying to make the argument go forward I do agree 100% on the post above the one insulting me about iPads tablets with overlayed thumbstick being nowhere close to a pad..... you can't have the accuracy of laser (I pretty sure that is a laser sensor on the 360 pad not sure on the other) on a touch screen meant for fat highly innacurate human fingers... it's like comparing a surgical scalpel and a butcher knive and say both cut in the same way....



happydolphin on 13 June 2012
thx1139 said:

Like I mentioned before the word "irrevelant" is harsh.  The real change between this generation and last is that the Wii U will be introduced into a market with a competitor that has a machine basically as powerful as the Wii U and with many of the same capabilities (and in some ways more) for devices that people already have.

Last generation Nintendo was able to introduce a console far less powerful than competitors, but had a compelling capability that was not present on the competitions consoles until 4 years later.  Nintendo doesnt get this 4 year head start this time and the Wii U will be drastically underpowered compared to the Xbox Next and PS4.

This all leaves the Wii U as a console that I feel will wilt in the market quicker than the Wii did.  Look at the Wii. It had 3 great years, but since Kinect and Move hit the market the Wii sales have plummeted.  I find it very doubtful that the Wii U has an initial couple of years like the Wii had. Sure the Nintendo faithful will purchase a Wii U sight unseen, but dont expect the market from the rest of consumers to jump on board like they did with the Wii and SmartGlass is one of the reasons.

I'm not saying you aren't right, but I just want to know which point this is tackling, points 3 & 5? About the WiiU vs the smartglass' installbase?

Also, you mention smartglass as a reason why people would not buy a WiiU, but I really do not see it, honestly. It could maybe skim off a minor fraction of marketshare, but if even kinect could not make such great headways into the casual market, I fail to see how smartglass is a stronger contender to be completely honest.

Even then, at this point, we're veering off discussion topic because I think the actual topic of Smartglass versus WiiU padlet truly has been covered, mostly in favor of WiiU, and mostly in favor of a change in thread title.

I'd love to discuss this topic, but we would really be going off-topic honestly.



happydolphin on 13 June 2012
endimion said:

and you my friend are very annoying and disrespectful..... as much as i hate some brands fir personal reasons and beliefs (nintendo not being one of them i litteraly grew up with the brand).... I try to keep to a minimum the bashing of the people under their wings ...

second thank you at 29 going on 30 I have no need of recognition of my posts on a VG website to feel confortable about my integrity and credibility.... I was just answering a dumb post with a sarcastic one if you feel like the entire structure of my intelect seat on one post good for you....

 

second I never argued the confort of one over the other but the mere fact that the argument of number of hands against smartglass was dumb because to effectively and confortably use the WiiU tablet part with touch you also have to free one of your 2 hands from one side or the other from the "mechanical" part of the said pad.... then I merely argued that it would even be easier to use a separate tablet while having both hands on the pad buttonswith XB pad or for that matter any pad just becauseit's a physical fact I can have at least 4 fingers free at any moment on a pad but the only way I can touch a tablet with this would be with a separate tablet device........ did not say it was more confortable.... I even said lets not go there because of the ridicule of that line of argument....

and for the X time I'm part of the group that said that smartglass was a great add on and anybody saying it wasn't is either a moron with no clue or somebody with a lack of imagination.... but that it wasn't in anyway a killer app for thw WiiU pad.... I like to compare it to the bonus content on Blu Ray (smartglass) more than to the WiiU pad....

So before starting insulting and/or attacking people you know nothing about with argument that have little to no value beside being disrespectful and childish.... read properly.... there is a reason I bother reading every single page of a post before posting (I'll admit in most cases not all)

and while I think you have realy lame tacticts to achieve your own little auto satisfaction over actually trying to make the argument go forward I do agree 100% on the post above the one insulting me about iPads tablets with overlayed thumbstick being nowhere close to a pad..... you can't have the accuracy of laser (I pretty sure that is a laser sensor on the 360 pad not sure on the other) on a touch screen meant for fat highly innacurate human fingers... it's like comparing a surgical scalpel and a butcher knive and say both cut in the same way....

I'm sorry, I reread my gripe to you and it was pretty damn rude.

But I know using a 360 controller and a tablet is possible, it is just much more inconvenient.

1) You need to lay the tablet somewhere, odds are you will place it on your lap or beside you on the couch. You will twich, turn and bend everytime you need to use it. Now compare that with holding one device the hold time and having it right at reach exactly the moment you need it.

2) This does not take into account non-touch gaming interactions that involve the WiiUpad, such as what was shown in zombiU. You need the buttons and the pad at the same time for that. Sniper is the main argument here, but the uses are basically limitless.

I do find a sense of satisfaction in truth, so having misunderstood your sarcasm, I found dissatisfaction in how your post bended logic to fit your love for a company. But that's my fault for failing to read your sarcasm. But to be totally fair, it wasn't even funny, nor was it really meaningful in light of what he said. Basically you didn't even disprove him while being sarcastic.

Nobody's perfect, so I'll be less of a bad person, and you try to make posts that address what people are saying rather than what they aren't saying.

Again, sorry.



endimion on 13 June 2012
thx1139 said:
happydolphin said:
thx1139 said:
h2o1977 said:
There is no way that the smart glass is going to beat Nintendo Wii U..
It sounds interesting but it has a long way to go, in order to compete with Nintendo.

People just dont understand shades of grey and competition.

SmartGlass doesnt need to beat Wii U. It is competition and from what we have seen the uses of the Wii U except for whats being done with Zombie U (And even that can be done, just maybe not as effieciently) can be done with SmartGlass.  Most of the games that Nintendo has shown so far make use of the Wii U screen as a screen for an extra player or for informational purposes. Things that SmartGlass can do quite well. Some examples this gen.

Just Dance series on Wii doesnt really know that you are dancing when you shake the Wii Mote and Dance Central tracked full body movement with Kinect. People playing Just Dance still had fun.

Most of the games in Wii Sport only relied on using the Wii Mote as a motion controlled switch.  You didnt need to make the actions like the real sport to play.  People still had fun.

Not to mention that no one is speaking about what SmartGlass features that the Wii U controller doesnt have.

1) SmartGlass is multi-touch. Yes Nintendo says they dont need it.  We will see.  We will see how many people expect pinch and zoom and it never works.
2) Xbox 360 can handle up to 4 SmartGlass devices.  Wii U can handle 2.
3) SmartGlass works with the devices people already know.
4) SmartGlass devices will be more powerful devices with developers more experienced with the platform.
5) SmartGlass will have a much larger install base and that will appeal to publishers when it comes to decisions about building in features common to both platforms or to provide special features for the larger install base.

Good post.

@bold. I agree with that, and hinted on it in my last post to you. However, I wouldn't blame h2o, I would blame OP and the thread title.

1) I agree, and I think Nintendo said they don't need it because they just don't want to up the HW costs, as an excuse. Multi-touch is an added value to smartglass that's for sure.

2) It's debatable as to how this will affect bandwidth and image broadcasting. If it does support 4 devices it will most likely be programmatically limiting the visual output the controllers will receive, if the WiiU's 2 padlet and downing of framerate limitations are any indicator.

3) That doesn't matter. The Wii is a product people know, and Nintendo is a brand the mass recognizes. This is a non-issue.

4) Yes, but at the same time this requires interoperability and/or specific experience of various devices. This leads to increased development complexity imho. Unless the MS API does it for you automatically, in which case this is not an argument. On the flipside, the con to this is that some devices will not support all features due to missing HW pieces (in HW differences, kind of like for Android). Talk about consumer confusion...

5) I guess, then again the WiiU has the advantage of being a new console, with all the marketing involved in the launch of a new console, as well as the sourrounding SW purchasing culture that revolves around launch period into the 1st and 2nd years of the console. So it's again debatable since by that time it's likely that the WiiU will already be catching up to a 40M install base.

Like I mentioned before the word "irrevelant" is harsh.  The real change between this generation and last is that the Wii U will be introduced into a market with a competitor that has a machine basically as powerful as the Wii U and with many of the same capabilities (and in some ways more) for devices that people already have.

Last generation Nintendo was able to introduce a console far less powerful than competitors, but had a compelling capability that was not present on the competitions consoles until 4 years later.  Nintendo doesnt get this 4 year head start this time and the Wii U will be drastically underpowered compared to the Xbox Next and PS4.

This all leaves the Wii U as a console that I feel will wilt in the market quicker than the Wii did.  Look at the Wii. It had 3 great years, but since Kinect and Move hit the market the Wii sales have plummeted.  I find it very doubtful that the Wii U has an initial couple of years like the Wii had. Sure the Nintendo faithful will purchase a Wii U sight unseen, but dont expect the market from the rest of consumers to jump on board like they did with the Wii and SmartGlass is one of the reasons.


while I agree with your last post on many things.... I don't consider the SG a real competitor of the WiiU.... basically I desagree with the thread title.....

but you rose an interesting point..... people already have more device like smartphone or tablets than nintendo or any console will have in install base.... which if really well integrated with XB could be a big advantage for win 8 in the future and the next box.... but I doubt SG on current XB will help much beside being a great beta test for MS

now @happydolphin....

I know you don't like me but just for info.... and I appologize in advance if you thinkI'm attacking you...

connectivity of your device with SG will be done via Wi-Fi I suppose over your WLAN or directly to the XB via Wi-Fi in any case data transfer rate will be at very high speed and a non issue.... there is absolutely no way it will do a loop outside of your network it is useless unsecure and retarded to do it.... it's like if in a company their internal phone system was going on the main phone line to the dispaching server and back to the company.... 

I don't know what you keep trying to say about geolocation.... but I have seen apps on cellphone doing augmented reality over buildings while you walk in the streets updating live ( a little like the demo on WiiU when he is jumping in parachute and going all around the room with the tablet).... so not saying that SG will be able as well or that dev will use it or even if the tech I'm talking is using a combination of GPS, gyros or a shape recognition software that track the frame of a building..... but pretty sure it is technically doable on any tablet/smartphone with a gps tracker and gyros....

then 40M by 2013 I doubt it by 2014 too.... you forget one big thing 2008 happened.... I doubt we'll see sales spiking especially with casual like it happened before.... and with nextbox/PS4 being more than just consoles .... people will have to make a choice... I personally doubt the gap between all 3 consols will be as clear cut.... so if SG is working well it has already the install base over any device.... so i t could be a big plus for the launch of the next XB.... so not sure it will be a non issue.... but we'll see until SG is not launched and we haven't seen anything in games e can't really judge....

so yeah I say it again SG is not competing with WiiU concept right now IMHO.... but in the future it might be a big contender for next gen..... only the future will tell