By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close

Forums - General Discussion - At $400 billion, Apple is worth more than Greece

ebw said:
disolitude said:
Man, looking at this Microsoft is seriously undervalued right now compared to some of its peers on a P/E or FCF basis...


I don't agree Microsoft is undervalued.  Its P/E of 10 is about on par with other slow-growth stocks like Exxon.  Their core business of Windows sales is stagnating (Windows licensing has fallen short of expectations for the last year or so).

Apple's price is high but is still undervalued: its P/E has been stuck at 15 even though it continues to grow at a ridiculously fast rate.  Compare that to Amazon's P/E of 100.


What you just said doesn't support your argument that microsoft isn't undervalued and Apple is.

Its true that microsofts price to earnings ratio is about 10, and Apples was 15, but the lower that number the better the stock. Microsofts stock returned 1/3 more value per stock than Apples...hence it is undervalued. Both companies are somewhat undervalued, but Microsoft more so than Apple.

Also, your statement of their core business stagnating...check out Microsofts latest earnings. Windows is down only 6% and this is 3 years in to Windows 7 and just before Windows 8 launch which only has marketshare to gain as Windows 7 pretty much remains unchallenged in the desktop world. Besides, Microsoft revenue is fairly evenly divided amongst all divisions and Windows division is now actually 3rd in overall revenue.  



Around the Network
Jumpin said:
Steve Jobs never took credit away from anyone; in his letters to stockholders he would always say how great a team that Apple had, and that it was the best in the world. The only complaint I think can be had against him was his personal philanthropic record. Apple also made more millionaires than any other company ever has.

Just to re-iterate from earlier, saying Apple is worth more than Greece is silly- GDP and Market Cap are completely unrelated - one is a revenue expenditure, the other is a cost. Greece's GDP is simply how much the populace spent in a 1 year period. You can't buy Greece for 400 billion, you can't even buy all the residential homes in Athens for 400 billion - you can buy Apple for that price though (if everyone sold their stock) - if everyone in Greece sold their assets and the state sold its resources and national treasures (Ancient ruins, park lands, etc...) if that occurred, at least several trillion would be required - far more than what is required to buy any company.

This. Happy you pointed it out, as soon as I read the title impying Greece could be bought for $400B I jumped on my chair. Heck, I'm Mr. Nobody, but if I ever found a way to buy Greece for that sum, any bank with enough money would be glad to lend it to me, I could repay the debt with princely interests and keep trillions profits for myself even reselling Greece at fire sales prices.



Stwike him, Centuwion. Stwike him vewy wuffly! (Pontius Pilate, "Life of Brian")
A fart without stink is like a sky without stars.
TGS, Third Grade Shooter: brand new genre invented by Kevin Butler exclusively for Natal WiiToo Kinect. PEW! PEW-PEW-PEW! 
 


Why is apple at 400 billion?



 

 

Take my love, take my land..

The only fact that we consider a private company worth more than country, means that our system of values is flawed.



freebs2 said:
The only fact that we consider a private company worth more than country, means that our system of values is flawed.


Only people who know nothing of economy consider that Apple is worth more than Greece.



Around the Network

Funny in a sick way, but why is Greece so bad right now anyway?



           

How's accusing a company of faulty products trolling while calling Greece useless is not? @_@

The difficulties we face right now have nothing to do with our value or worth; and Austria and Argentina, well respected countries are not too far off. Seriously people, the hate...



disolitude said:
Man, looking at this Microsoft is seriously undervalued right now compared to some of its peers on a P/E or FCF basis...


It's because people are all about growth.

People see Microsoft and don't really see a strong path to future growth.  Though I do agree microsoft is undervalued, if anything due to their diversity.

Apple is a lot like Nintendo.  Huge based off "innovations" and putting things in a way customers actually want it... but with little stableness behind it.   Meaning that it can be pretty volitile and go bad fast if they start making the wrong moves. 



If this is a serious and respected forum where moderators try to prevent bashing against a company, I expect them to show exactly the same sensitivity and do the same when bashing a country.



Kasz216 said:
disolitude said:
Man, looking at this Microsoft is seriously undervalued right now compared to some of its peers on a P/E or FCF basis...


It's because people are all about growth.

People see Microsoft and don't really see a strong path to future growth.  Though I do agree microsoft is undervalued, if anything due to their diversity.

Apple is a lot like Nintendo.  Huge based off "innovations" and putting things in a way customers actually want it... but with little stableness behind it.   Meaning that it can be pretty volitile and go bad fast if they start making the wrong moves. 

It's hard to compare Apple to Nintendo anymore. Seven years ago? Maybe. But now they have profitable divisions in their Mac line, iPhone, iPad, iPod, iTunes Store, and now they're going after school textbooks. Within the year, they're going to start pursuing the smart television market. That is beginning to turn into a pretty well-rounded set of offerings.

Microsoft is definitely more diverse but much of that diversity struggles to earn them any money and a few divisions are giant moneypits. Their "real" money comes from Windows and Office with the Xbox line starting to come around. They're in more danger over the next ten years than Apple. Microsoft's main money makers (outside of Xbox) aren't only saturated, they're in decline. And they will face real competition from iOS/Android over the next few years. In short, if people stop buying computers and start replacing them with tablets (which Microsoft has ZERO stake in at this point), Microsoft could be royally and utterly fucked.

Not that I think they will, but it is a real possibility. Best case scenario is that Microsoft's core businesses will remain stable in the next decade. There is almost zero space for growth.




Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/