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Forums - Politics Discussion - Obama breaks free trade agreement a second time, Canada thoroughly pissed!

Boutros on 17 September 2011
yo_john117 said:
Boutros said:
I wish we would stop exporting fresh water and electricity *evil laugh* Oh and maple syrup!

Canada exports electricity to the US? 0_o

Yes a lot.

Canada is producing too much electricity so it would go to waste anyway. So they export electricity mostly during the night.



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oldschoolfool on 17 September 2011
Joelcool7 said:
oldschoolfool said:
well,the purpose of these products being made in the U.S. is so that more money can go into the american economy.America is in an economic crisis and I honestly don't think Canada is all that big of a concern. I mean I think I can live without canadian bacon and maple syrup. lol


Umm The United States exports more then 248.8 billion dollars to Canada each year. By far the biggest market for American goods infact no other country comes even close with Mexico being the second biggest buyer of American goods at 163.3 billion dollars. Without Canada the US economy would loose a huge amount of their gross domestic product. China on the other hand only buys 91.9 billion dollars worth of products from the US almost 1/3rd of what Canada spends on American products. Infact Canada imports more products from the United States then the entire European Union combined!

As for imports there you are right American's buy more Chinese products then Canadian. However Canadian products bought by Americans account for 276.5 billion dollars a year. The majority of what Canada exports to the United States is raw materials like lumber,steel, oil etc...etc... While the majority of what the US imports from China are manufactured goods.

In total cross border trade between Canada and the US is around 525.3 billion dollars a year, almost 100 billion dollars more then the US trade with China.

I know your Canadian bacon and Maple Syrup thing was a joke, at least I sure hope it was.

Long story short the United States sells more to Canada then it buys. So if free trade were to go out the window and Canada put tariffs on everything coming into Canada. The US would loose billions and billions of dollars in trade, millions of American's would be out of work and the American economy would be in even more danger.

If Obama is worried about jobs then he needs to worry about trade. Because its Canada that keeps these people employed and Canadian trade that accounts for such a huge hunk of the US's trade income. Heck the Presidents entire Job plan only costs slightly more then what the US would loose if NAFTA were to be abolished.

*** Also yes a huge hunk of America's electriciity comes from Canada, if free trade were abolished then a huge hunk of the US would go dark***

I don't think it would be all that bad. I think you probably exaggerating alittle. America could just increase trade with with some other country like china. provide a link if you can,to prove those numbers,I think there alittle skewed. You make it sound as if canada is the only think holding america afloat,I think that's far from the case.The problem is alot of people are out of work and it's all about trying to create and find jobs in AMERICA. so if raw materials and products can be made in America,then I say more power to President obama. I like President obama,he's doing the best he can. He was put in a tough situation,that was started bye the previous administration.



yo_john117 on 17 September 2011
Boutros said:
yo_john117 said:
Boutros said:
I wish we would stop exporting fresh water and electricity *evil laugh* Oh and maple syrup!

Canada exports electricity to the US? 0_o

Yes a lot.

Canada is producing too much electricity so it would go to waste anyway. So they export electricity mostly during the night.

Wow I guess you learn something new everyday.



Mr Khan on 17 September 2011

An effort to support the American economy demands purchasing of American products to support the American economy

how mortifying.



Monster Hunter: pissing me off since 2010.

Silver-Tiger on 17 September 2011
NiKKoM said:
What's canada going to do about it ? Have Justin Bieber and Celine Dione sing a duet?


Hey, don't give them ideas!



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Joelcool7 on 17 September 2011
oldschoolfool said:
Joelcool7 said:
oldschoolfool said:
well,the purpose of these products being made in the U.S. is so that more money can go into the american economy.America is in an economic crisis and I honestly don't think Canada is all that big of a concern. I mean I think I can live without canadian bacon and maple syrup. lol


Umm The United States exports more then 248.8 billion dollars to Canada each year. By far the biggest market for American goods infact no other country comes even close with Mexico being the second biggest buyer of American goods at 163.3 billion dollars. Without Canada the US economy would loose a huge amount of their gross domestic product. China on the other hand only buys 91.9 billion dollars worth of products from the US almost 1/3rd of what Canada spends on American products. Infact Canada imports more products from the United States then the entire European Union combined!

As for imports there you are right American's buy more Chinese products then Canadian. However Canadian products bought by Americans account for 276.5 billion dollars a year. The majority of what Canada exports to the United States is raw materials like lumber,steel, oil etc...etc... While the majority of what the US imports from China are manufactured goods.

In total cross border trade between Canada and the US is around 525.3 billion dollars a year, almost 100 billion dollars more then the US trade with China.

I know your Canadian bacon and Maple Syrup thing was a joke, at least I sure hope it was.

Long story short the United States sells more to Canada then it buys. So if free trade were to go out the window and Canada put tariffs on everything coming into Canada. The US would loose billions and billions of dollars in trade, millions of American's would be out of work and the American economy would be in even more danger.

If Obama is worried about jobs then he needs to worry about trade. Because its Canada that keeps these people employed and Canadian trade that accounts for such a huge hunk of the US's trade income. Heck the Presidents entire Job plan only costs slightly more then what the US would loose if NAFTA were to be abolished.

*** Also yes a huge hunk of America's electriciity comes from Canada, if free trade were abolished then a huge hunk of the US would go dark***

I don't think it would be all that bad. I think you probably exaggerating alittle. America could just increase trade with with some other country like china. provide a link if you can,to prove those numbers,I think there alittle skewed. You make it sound as if canada is the only think holding america afloat,I think that's far from the case.The problem is alot of people are out of work and it's all about trying to create and find jobs in AMERICA. so if raw materials and products can be made in America,then I say more power to President obama. I like President obama,he's doing the best he can. He was put in a tough situation,that was started bye the previous administration.

Source , the US sells more products to Canada then any other country by far. I didn't scew the numbers without Canada the US would be out over 248.8 Billion dollars a year. That is a hell of alot of lost business, is Canada keeping the US alive? Maybe not but without Canada the US would really be in a far worse situation economically. Also yah I did make a mistake.

"Long story short the United States sells more to Canada then it buys: thats wrong the US imports more then it sells, my bad I haven't slept in over a day.

But no ending the free trade agreement would definatly not give more american's jobs. Infact they would loose more jobs then this job plan will create. Also as I said Canada imports more American products then the entire European Union combined. EU combined imports fronm the US are $239.8 billion. While Canada is  248.8 billion meaning trade with Canada creates more jobs in the US and gains the US more reveniew then all of the EU combined.

However the US does import more products from the EU then Canada. But since Obama is talking about jobs imports don't really matter now do they? American's buying more products from Europe benefits the European economies more then it does the American.

 



-JC7

"In God We Trust - In Games We Play " - Joel Reimer

 

Joelcool7 on 17 September 2011
Mr Khan said:
An effort to support the American economy demands purchasing of American products to support the American economy

how mortifying.


Yes at the same time damaging the economy be hurting trade relations with the US's largest trading partner. Parliament in 2009 considered terminating the free trade agreement. If American's purchase American products but Canada stops , more jobs in America will be lost then if America stood by its international obligations and used Canadian products.

Also considering the US is trying to sign more trade deals to incourage other countries to trade with it, backstabbing Canada and showing the world that the US does not stick to its trade agreements is going to hurt their ability to find new trading partners.

Which country is going to want to sign a free trade agreement with the United States if they continue to back stab their trading partners. If Canada the US's largest trading partner was to terminate NAFTA, no country on earth would even consider signing another trade agreement with the US.

Also Canada took the US to international court over the softwood lumber violation. The court ruled that the US had violated NAFTA and ordered them to repay Canada. Can you imagine the damage that will be caused to the US's trading image if Canada were to terminate the agreement with the support of the International court?

The US benefits from NAFTA hugely, Canada is the largest trading partner for the US. Backstabbing your largest trading partner is not going to gain jobs.



-JC7

"In God We Trust - In Games We Play " - Joel Reimer

 

MARCUSDJACKSON on 17 September 2011
NiKKoM said:
What's canada going to do about it ? Have Justin Bieber and Celine Dione sing a duet?

no! NO!! ANY THING BUT THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!



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chapset on 17 September 2011

2010 : U.S. trade in goods with Canada

NOTE: All figures are in millions of U.S. dollars on a nominal basis, not seasonally adjusted unless otherwise specified. Details may not equal totals due to rounding.

Month Exports Imports Balance
January 2010 17,226.5 21,653.8 -4,427.3
February 2010 18,540.4 21,233.1 -2,692.6
March 2010 22,184.4 24,316.3 -2,131.9
April 2010 20,962.6 23,656.7 -2,694.1
May 2010 21,366.6 23,658.1 -2,291.5
June 2010 22,341.9 24,771.8 -2,429.9
July 2010 19,633.1 21,294.9 -1,661.8
August 2010 21,210.3 23,452.4 -2,242.2
September 2010 21,784.1 23,028.5 -1,244.4
October 2010 22,148.2 23,440.6 -1,292.4
November 2010 21,054.6 22,902.0 -1,847.5
December 2010 20,652.3 24,239.2 -3,586.9
TOTAL 2010 249,105.0 277,647.5 -28,542.5

in 2010 249,105,000,000$ export and 277,647,500,000$ import, that's a lot of justin biebers lol

(http://www.census.gov/foreign-trade/balance/c1220.html#2010)

by comparaison with china:

Table 1: China's Trade with the United States, 2001-10 ($ billion)
Notes: *Calculated by USCBC. US exports reported on a free-alongside-ship basis; imports on a general customs-value basis.
Source: US Department of Commerce; US International Trade Commission (ITC)
  2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010
US exports 19.2 22.1 28.4 34.7 41.8 55.2 65.2 71.5 69.6 91.9
  % change* 18.3 14.7 28.9 22.2 20.5 32.0 18.1 9.5 -2.6 32.1
US imports 102.3 125.2 152.4 196.7 243.5 287.8 321.5 337.8 296.4 364.9
  % change* 2.2 22.4 21.7 29.1 23.8 18.2 11.7 5.1 -12.3 23.1
Total* 121.5 147.2 180.8 231.4 285.3 343.0 386.7 409.2 366.0 456.8
  % change* 4.5 21.2 22.8 28.0 23.3 20.2 12.8 5.8 -10.6 24.8
US balance -83.0 -103.1 -124.0 -162.0 -201.6 -232.5 -256.3 -266.3 -226.8 -273.1

https://www.uschina.org/statistics/tradetable.html

the us export 90,900,000,000 and import 364,900,000,000 with china so yeah the US export around 160 billions more to Canada then they did to China that's a lot of butter on a stick and a lot of jobs lost if they stop trading with Canada



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HappySqurriel on 17 September 2011

Protectionism hurts all economies, but tends to disproportionately impact the country that is imposing the protectionist measures ...

Right now Canada is looking to increase trade with their existing trading partners, and enter into new free trade agreements. If successful, they should be able to compensate for the lost trade from the US due to protectionist measures in a relatively short period of time. In contrast, the protectionist measures taken by the US government could encourage reciprocation from several trading partners at the same time (resulting in further damage to the US economy).