Lame, both would have been awesome to have. Oh well there's still plenty of content but those are 2 things I really wanted.

I just can say that playing Nurburgring at night was out of expectations.

And one of the best parts of GT5 are Weather Effects (Rain ans Slow).

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So true! Nothing like driving one of the finest premium cars on Nurburgring night time with mah G27... BONER!

its time for next Xbox...

I was already disappointed with GT5 that time of day and weather were reserved for a couple of tracks. More varied game play over fancier graphics any time. I would be happy with GT4 style graphics if that would mean it could run in 1080p60 with all tracks featuring dynamic time, cloud cover and weather.

I mostly played Sarthe and Nurburgring online in GT5, since the dynamic weather (with tire grip on real) made it a lot more interesting with pit strategy and tire choices. Shitting bricks when you're in the lead in the final lap by taking a gamble on riding out the rain while the pack is quickly catching up after changing their tires.
And tons of fun when its getting dark and you hear the people cursing that chose a concept car with no headlights :)

We need next gen for more real time weather change!

I dont think next gen is the issue.

I believe the issues for both GT5 and Forza 4 were and are time. With a bigger team and or time these things will all be possible. Its a case of either half doing something or not at all for either company. 

I think its all possible. Just takes alot more time to perfect all the things. 

How long would we all have to wait for GT5 or Forza 4 if they implemented it all perfectly?

Or how much framerate are we willing to go down to?

Did GT5 really suffer from dropping to 48FPs at night? I dont think that much at all. But I guess Turn 10 dont want less than 60, so thats that.

Partially agree. Given enough time for development, CPU and GPU power and graphics RAM available should be enough, but I fear main RAM could be not (unified RAM could help XB360 to manage things more flexibly, but once you reach a given level of detail and graphics quality, successive version will have equal or better ones, so you won't get back the RAM you allocated for them). Even considering consoles have very light OS compared to PCs, main RAM in current gen consoles is really small and already was even for 2005-2006 standards.

Anyway, what's for sure is that we can't blame Turn 10.

True, it's more the graphics war that's the issue. Polygon counts and 3D swaying trees are getting too much attention.

Last gen had more racing games with day/night racing transitions and weather effects. The same happened to rally games, last gen had way more variation in road surfaces and environments. Now we just have the extremely pretty but very limited Dirt.

And yes, GT5 would not have been out until the ps4 if they had made 1000 premium cars, day/night/weather for all tracks and damage that doesn't make the cars look like they're made of wax. Hopefully PD won't try to achieve too much again for GT6.

Personally I don't mind having less detail, much rather then dropping frame rate or resolution. So what the cars don't have 100.000 polygons while you're racing. Put 32 cars with 5.000 polygons on the track instead. Put a little less detail in the tracks as well so we can have some more, faster loading tracks. It's a shame screenshots are still the most important thing to come from games.

Anyway despite lacking some nice to haves forza 4 will no doubt be one of, if not the pretiest 720p60 racer this gen.

well you all forget the SIMULATION part I'm all for day and night rain sun ice etc..... but I want a SIM first if this means only day light with perfect implementation I'd rather have that.... than the last gen BS in racing game that had great whether daylight changes but nothing close to simulation beside forza.....