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Forums - General Discussion - Are there any religions or cults that you just do not understand? With in reason.

Player1x3 said:

http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4191117

Maybe you read it more carefully and see what points i actualy adressed, especially the 2nd one.

You: to even suggest that catholicism caused this is totally ignorant of what actually happened. If anything, Hitler created the adoration of himself, which Christianity in any form would consider idolatry.      

sapphi_snake: Catholics are responsable for the anit-jewish sentiment that existed in Germany and Europe  (MEANING: CAtholics are responsible for the growth of anti semetisam in Germany and europe (I was only adressing the part about germany) 

Me: Posts a link of a view of catholic church on german anti semetism

sapphi_snake: The Holocaust is basically the the culmination of the persecution of Jews that the Pope ordered in the Middle Ages. (Meaning: Holocaust is connected to midle ages persecution

Me: Posts a link that shows Holocaust had nothing to do with christinity

Dude, you just don't get it. Give it up.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

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padib said:

To be truthful though, and here is where I read up on this (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_antisemitism#Expulsions_from_France_and_England), even this claim above is not completely fair. Anti-semitism was a sentiment shared by many societies and groups within societies. An example from my link above is royalty (motivated by greed). To blame it all on the ignorant Chritians of the time is very one-sided.

And why do you think they chose Jews, and not aby other category of people?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

padib said:

Good question. Apart from ignorant religious influences, in my crappy opinion I believe it's

1) pre-existing ethnic anti-semitism. (it predates Christianity, as the wikipedia on anti-semitism lists as item 1 at the top)
2) The known frugality of the Jewish people. (associate this to the concept of greed whether in the protagonists or antagonists of the scenario mentioned).

Other things that come to mind (to expand on 1):
1a) The restrictions caused by the mosaic law and their general "keeping it in the family" probably caused a level of animosity in neighboring regions.
1b) Their considering themselves the cherished nation of God doesn't help other nations, especially when God's plan for humanity in Judaism is misunderstood (by both Jews and non-jews).

I'm well aware of point 1. Point 2 however is a stereotype invented by Christians regarding Jews. Throughout the Middle Ages Jews were constantly banished from several places (you yourself presented links of that), thus the only way they could ear a living was through giving out loans, selling goods and other similar economical activities. Except at that time such activities were viewed negatively back then. And since these activities would bring jews lots of money, and since they were typically much more educated than Christians which lead to greater success in life on a professional level, Christians have typically been jealous of Jews from thre Middle Ages to contemporary times.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
padib said:

Good question. Apart from ignorant religious influences, in my crappy opinion I believe it's

1) pre-existing ethnic anti-semitism. (it predates Christianity, as the wikipedia on anti-semitism lists as item 1 at the top)
2) The known frugality of the Jewish people. (associate this to the concept of greed whether in the protagonists or antagonists of the scenario mentioned).

Other things that come to mind (to expand on 1):
1a) The restrictions caused by the mosaic law and their general "keeping it in the family" probably caused a level of animosity in neighboring regions.
1b) Their considering themselves the cherished nation of God doesn't help other nations, especially when God's plan for humanity in Judaism is misunderstood (by both Jews and non-jews).

I'm well aware of point 1. Point 2 however is a stereotype invented by Christians regarding Jews. Throughout the Middle Ages Jews were constantly banished from several places (you yourself presented links of that), thus the only way they could ear a living was through giving out loans, selling goods and other similar economical activities. Except at that time such activities were viewed negatively back then. And since these activities would bring jews lots of money, and since they were typically much more educated than Christians which lead to greater success in life on a professional level, Christians have typically been jealous of Jews from thre Middle Ages to contemporary times.

You honestly think that stereotype was invented by Christians? Did you know Christians also killed the dinosaurs?



huaxiong90 said:
Killiana1a said:

Yeah, I am familiar with it. You ever see, hear or read of this story in Afghanistan?

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,2007415,00.html

Girl had her nose cut off by fundamentalist muslims because she ran away from a pre-arranged, pedophiliac marriage to some bearded pervert whose family gets off on mutilating teenage brides.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, hold on...did you just use the TALIBAN to judge Muslims?!

Dude...you can't be serious.

Yes I did and yes I am serious.

Name me one country at least 50% Muslim whose borders are near a non-Muslim majority country where there is no conflict. Pakistan vs. India, Abu Sayyaf in the Phillippines, Muslims and Europeans in general, Muslims threatening to kill cartoonists in the Netherlands and the United States (we have one in hiding who is from Seattle) over a draw Mohammed day, Chechens vs. Russia, Israel, the Middle East where Sunnis and Shias have been killing each other for centuries over the succession to Mohammed, and on.

Lets face it, Muslims do not get along with their neighbors even if they are Muslim then it breaks down into a Sunni vs. Shia conflict.

Every religion has it's wackos, Christianity is no exception with the FLDS and Warren Jeffs, Timothy McVeigh, Catholic priests molesting altar boys, and on. This being said, there is no level of intersect warfare in Christianity to the extent of Sunnis vs. Shia (only dictators get these nuts to stop killing each other. *Saddam* cough *Hussein*).

I don't understand Islam, nor will I ever submit to it. Do I have a problem? If so, then please show me where a country of majority Muslims is living in perfect harmony with the other religions residing within it.

The obvious answer is Indonesia, but considering the persecution of Ahmadis and the terrorist actions of Jemaah Islamiyah, I would not consider this a valid answer.



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Player1x3 said:
sapphi_snake said:
padib said:

Good question. Apart from ignorant religious influences, in my crappy opinion I believe it's

1) pre-existing ethnic anti-semitism. (it predates Christianity, as the wikipedia on anti-semitism lists as item 1 at the top)
2) The known frugality of the Jewish people. (associate this to the concept of greed whether in the protagonists or antagonists of the scenario mentioned).

Other things that come to mind (to expand on 1):
1a) The restrictions caused by the mosaic law and their general "keeping it in the family" probably caused a level of animosity in neighboring regions.
1b) Their considering themselves the cherished nation of God doesn't help other nations, especially when God's plan for humanity in Judaism is misunderstood (by both Jews and non-jews).

I'm well aware of point 1. Point 2 however is a stereotype invented by Christians regarding Jews. Throughout the Middle Ages Jews were constantly banished from several places (you yourself presented links of that), thus the only way they could ear a living was through giving out loans, selling goods and other similar economical activities. Except at that time such activities were viewed negatively back then. And since these activities would bring jews lots of money, and since they were typically much more educated than Christians which lead to greater success in life on a professional level, Christians have typically been jealous of Jews from thre Middle Ages to contemporary times.

You honestly think that stereotype was invented by Christians? Did you know Christians also killed the dinosaurs?

Learn a little bit of history, kid.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Killiana1a said:

Yes I did and yes I am serious.

Name me one country at least 50% Muslim whose borders are near a non-Muslim majority country where there is no conflict. Pakistan vs. India, Abu Sayyaf in the Phillippines, Muslims and Europeans in general, Muslims threatening to kill cartoonists in the Netherlands and the United States (we have one in hiding who is from Seattle) over a draw Mohammed day, Chechens vs. Russia, Israel, the Middle East where Sunnis and Shias have been killing each other for centuries over the succession to Mohammed, and on.

Lets face it, Muslims do not get along with their neighbors even if they are Muslim then it breaks down into a Sunni vs. Shia conflict.

Every religion has it's wackos, Christianity is no exception with the FLDS and Warren Jeffs, Timothy McVeigh, Catholic priests molesting altar boys, and on. This being said, there is no level of intersect warfare in Christianity to the extent of Sunnis vs. Shia (only dictators get these nuts to stop killing each other. *Saddam* cough *Hussein*).

I don't understand Islam, nor will I ever submit to it. Do I have a problem? If so, then please show me where a country of majority Muslims is living in perfect harmony with the other religions residing within it.

The obvious answer is Indonesia, but considering the persecution of Ahmadis and the terrorist actions of Jemaah Islamiyah, I would not consider this a valid answer.

Turkey?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Killiana1a said:

Yes I did and yes I am serious.

Well then that is a very fallacious comparison. While I will never understand some Muslims, none of us are nearly inhumane enough to employ the nonsensical version of Sharia law they did.

Name me one country at least 50% Muslim whose borders are near a non-Muslim majority country where there is no conflict. Pakistan vs. India, Abu Sayyaf in the Phillippines, Muslims and Europeans in general, Muslims threatening to kill cartoonists in the Netherlands and the United States (we have one in hiding who is from Seattle) over a draw Mohammed day, Chechens vs. Russia, Israel, the Middle East where Sunnis and Shias have been killing each other for centuries over the succession to Mohammed, and on.

Jordan? Turkey? Kazakhstan? Those countries are bordered by non-Muslim countries, and they tend to get along, not to mention there's significant numbers of Christians in those countries. Hell, even in Malaysia the non-Muslim residents have no issues, and the Malaysian government has no real trouble on its borders with Thailand, aside from the Malay Pattani insurgents within Thailand.

Palestine-Israel is more of a political issue than anything else even though it has major religious undertones, and this is something I can assure you as a Palestinian myself. And a VERY big one too. So that's not valid.

Lets face it, Muslims do not get along with their neighbors even if they are Muslim then it breaks down into a Sunni vs. Shia conflict.

I just gave you examples of countries. And even Sunni-Shia conflicts were almost non-existant in this century until the Iranian Revolution. However, Yemen has no real conflicts between the Sunnis and Zaydi Shia there.

But I firmly agree that immigrants to European countries need to learn to integrate to their surrounding culture, rather than drive our name into the ground and let the right wing media take advantage of them.

Every religion has it's wackos, Christianity is no exception with the FLDS and Warren Jeffs, Timothy McVeigh, Catholic priests molesting altar boys, and on. This being said, there is no level of intersect warfare in Christianity to the extent of Sunnis vs. Shia (only dictators get these nuts to stop killing each other. *Saddam* cough *Hussein*).

All colonized/invaded territories end up sparking conflicts that are difficult to resolve. This happened in just about all African countries, this happened in Palestine (yes, Muslims, Christians and Jews were living side by side with no real issues), this happened in India...literally everywhere. Tensions between the Sunni Iraqis, Kurds, and Shia have existed according to my father who studied med school there, but I personally think if the Iraq war hadn't happened, maybe Kurdish, Sunni Iraqi, and Shia leaders could've united in starting a rebellion to oust Saddam Hussein, sort of like how in Egypt the Muslims and Coptics joined hands in the revolution.

I don't understand Islam, nor will I ever submit to it. Do I have a problem? If so, then please show me where a country of majority Muslims is living in perfect harmony with the other religions residing within it.

No real Muslim would force you to. However, please do not let the media poison your view of Muslims to the point of where you'd make sweeping generalizations. I have debated many people who have issues with Islam, and it's always the same rhetoric.

Are we a clean people? Far, far, very far from that. We're in complete disarray, and have no organization or unity whatsoever. In other words, we're our own worst enemy. But that does NOT give anybody a right to make Muslims an exception to any form of freedom.

The obvious answer is Indonesia, but considering the persecution of Ahmadis and the terrorist actions of Jemaah Islamiyah, I would not consider this a valid answer.

Indonesia's okay, but they're not the best examples of progressive Muslim countries. Malaysia, Turkey, and Qatar are much better examples. Seriously, if only more Muslims can emulate the model of Erdogan, Mahathir Mohammad, and Emir Hamad bin Khalifa Al Thani. Of course neither country is perfect, but what country in the world is?



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lolita said:
Yay, no one said Paganism or Wicca! ...Well unless they forgot about it or just said all religions.

One cult (refuse to call it religion) I don't get is scientology. It was made up by a sci fi author who wanted to make a religion to become rich. What a bastard to take advantage of people. Sorry but no matter how "stupid" people are, it's still an ugly act to pull off. Only a selfish jerk would do such a thing.

My problem with it isn't so much that people believe in it, but how they steal from them and often break off families. I wonder how the hell it's even allowed/legal.

There might be some sub sects of certain religions I don't understand but it's not all that important.


I'll be honest that Wicca does confuse me more than most religions. It's such a contrived religion. It was completely invented in the 1920's based on erroneous research. But while I don't understand it I realise that unlike dangerous cults it's a rather benign religion.

Paganism is a broad term, but religions such as Druidism I understand much more than Wicca. They're based on ancient beliefs that made up the human understanding of the world at the time.



padib said:
Sapphi, can you get me some links/articles on it pls? I still can't find items online about it (jewish money-business in the middle-ages).

Even if it is a stereotype, doesn't make it less true. I'm half lebanese and it's a stereotype of us, like the jews, that we are strong on merchandising. Doesn't make it bad, doesn't make it untrue, no blame required. You seem to want to blame Christians at any occasion you find, what's up with that?

Off-topic, but let me guess...you're a Maronite Catholic?



Rockstar: Announce Bully 2 already and make gamers proud!

Kojima: Come out with Project S already!