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Forums - Microsoft - Morphological Anti-Aliasing refined on Xbox 360- 3x faster than PS3 Cell

mendozahotness said:
ethomaz said:

No it was 10%... now is ~3%.

Less than 1%

Can you show any link about that... because MLAA costs less than SSAA to GPU but a I see tests showing a HD 6870 with no AA performing 15% better than the same HD 6870 with MLAA.

Less than 1%? I say impossible.

Any graphic filter costs GPU performance... my 3% is optmistic at all.

Use Cell to MLAA is better choice because all gpu horse power is free to graphics.

I prefer physics on CPU too... unless you have two GPUs (one for graphics other for physics).



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d21lewis said:

*pretends to see difference in the pics*

That is so fucking awesome!!  I totally know what you're talking about!


How do you not see that?



ethomaz said:
mendozahotness said:
ethomaz said:

No it was 10%... now is ~3%.

Less than 1%

Can you show any link about that... because MLAA costs less than SSAA to GPU but a I see tests showing a HD 6870 with no AA performing 15% better than the same HD 6870 with MLAA.

Less than 1%? I say impossible.

Any graphic filter costs GPU performance... my 3% is optmistic at all.

Use Cell to MLAA is better choice because all gpu horse power is free to graphic

 OK we get what your saying, which is usually biased. You really don't even have to comment cause we already know it's going to be sniper flaming, hating or twisting the story. Everytime I see a post from you it's the same thing different MS thread.  You seem to know everything and never show links to prove your backup story. So why ask for any links from anyone else? His info maybe wrong, maybe right but I wouldn't accept anything you say and nor will most people that pay attention to your posts.

Sorry but it just gets redundant. Every single thread with good news about xbox, you got to come and start a issue or post some bait. This is just my opinion. In most cases you are making no sense.

I know I piss a few people off myself but I don't go out looking for every single PS3 article and try to nock it with anything I can.  Most times it just insults and random posts that are borderline flame material but as close as you can get without getting banned.

Sorry if it's offensive but it's nonstop, all the time, 24/7 with every MS article.  I'm not trying to flame or start a non-stop back and forth thing. So this will be the only post from me. Just feel as maybe you should just stay off the MS forums for some time and give it a break.  

THIS IS ONLY A OPINION AND SHOULD BE TAKEN AS SUCH. I WON'T PUSH THE ISSUE ANYMORE.

I'm trying to keep this as clean as possible without stepping over the line. Sorry if it does. I'm not name calling or trying to flame, just stating how I see it.



bannedagain said:

YA, YA, YA. Sure, we get what your saying, which is always biased. You really don't even have to comment cause we already know it's going to be sniper flaming, hating or twisting the story. Everytime I see a post from you it's the same thing different MS thread.  You seem to know everything and never show links to prove your backup story. So why ask for any links from anyone else? His info maybe wrong, maybe right but I wouldn't accept anything you say and nor will anyone that pays attention to your posts.

Sorry but it just gets redundant. Every single thread with good news about xbox, you got to come and start a issue or post some nonsense. This is just my opinion. In most cases you are making no sense.

I know I piss a few people off myself but I don't go out looking for every single PS3 article and try to nock it with anything I can.  Most times it's just insults and random posts that are not flamming but close as you can get without getting banned.

Sorry if it's offensive but it's nonstop, all the time, 24/7 with this guy.  I'm not trying to flame or start a non-stop back and forth thing. So this will be the only post from me. Just feel as maybe you should just stay off the MS forums for some time and give it a break.

THIS IS ONLY A OPINION AND SHOULD BE TAKEN AS SUCH. I WON'T PUSH THE ISSUE ANYMORE.

Ok. You can think anything about me... but I'm not creating history or flaming.

10 seconds on google for find one of articles I read before.

http://www.hardocp.com/article/2010/11/02/amd_morphological_aa_performance_iq_review/7

HD 6870 / HD 6850 noAA

HD 6870 / HD 6850 MLAA

It's 2560x1600... here we talking in 1280x720 but there are GPU power use to make MLAA... less than 1%? No... more than that.

To Microsoft/360 is good because some games uses 2xMSAA... so 2xMLAA will release some more GPU to graphics... but for games that use 100% of the GPU for graphics that have no use... a better alternative would be to have it done by the CPU but someone told me that the 360 CPU can't handle that.



ethomaz said:

Ok. You can think anything about me... but I'm not creating history or flaming.

To Microsoft/360 is good because some games uses 2xMSAA... so 2xMLAA will release some more GPU to graphics... but for games that use 100% of the GPU for graphics that have no use... a better alternative would be to have it done by the CPU but someone told me that the 360 CPU can't handle that.


The ATI implementation and a console implementation is apples/oranges. The former is pretty much a hack whereas the latter is built into the game code. The actual method used to reproduce the effect is likely different too.

Why would they move a 'graphics effect' off the GPU? It's the Sony solution which is backwards here. It is quite possible that they can fit it into the GPU frame without much if any performance penalties depending on how it is scheduled.



Tease.

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Squilliam said:
ethomaz said:

Ok. You can think anything about me... but I'm not creating history or flaming.

To Microsoft/360 is good because some games uses 2xMSAA... so 2xMLAA will release some more GPU to graphics... but for games that use 100% of the GPU for graphics that have no use... a better alternative would be to have it done by the CPU but someone told me that the 360 CPU can't handle that.


The ATI implementation and a console implementation is apples/oranges. The former is pretty much a hack whereas the latter is built into the game code. The actual method used to reproduce the effect is likely different too.

Why would they move a 'graphics effect' off the GPU? It's the Sony solution which is backwards here. It is quite possible that they can fit it into the GPU frame without much if any performance penalties depending on how it is scheduled.

So a HD 6870 has penalties and the R500 X360 GPU no? For me the Sony method puting the MLAA on Cell is better than leave with GPU on consoles.

My first question was if Microsft could put it on CPU and someone said it's not possible... so the best way to Microsoft was optimising it for GPU... that's great but could be better.

The games on 360 uses the tri-core 360 CPU for what? Physics only? So if microsoft could put this element in the CPU the GPU would be free to work only with graphics.

MLAA is lighter than MSAA and SSAA... but few games uses AA on 360 (or PS3) because of the low power of the GPU... I wanted a implementation without graphics penalties... the Cell on PS3 done it better.



ethomaz said:

So a HD 6870 has penalties and the R500 X360 GPU no? For me the Sony method puting the MLAA on Cell is better than leave with GPU on consoles.

My first question was if Microsft could put it on CPU and someone said it's not possible... so the best way to Microsoft was optimising it for GPU... that's great but could be better.

The games on 360 uses the tri-core 360 CPU for what? Physics only? So if microsoft could put this element in the CPU the GPU would be free to work only with graphics.

MLAA is lighter than MSAA and SSAA... but few games uses AA on 360 (or PS3) because of the low power of the GPU... I wanted a implementation without graphics penalties... the Cell on PS3 done it better.

Im not actually sure what you're trying to say. It is clear however you don't really know what you're talking about so discussing this with you isn't going to achieve anything.



Tease.

Squilliam said:
ethomaz said:

Ok. You can think anything about me... but I'm not creating history or flaming.

To Microsoft/360 is good because some games uses 2xMSAA... so 2xMLAA will release some more GPU to graphics... but for games that use 100% of the GPU for graphics that have no use... a better alternative would be to have it done by the CPU but someone told me that the 360 CPU can't handle that.


The ATI implementation and a console implementation is apples/oranges. The former is pretty much a hack whereas the latter is built into the game code. The actual method used to reproduce the effect is likely different too.

Why would they move a 'graphics effect' off the GPU? It's the Sony solution which is backwards here. It is quite possible that they can fit it into the GPU frame without much if any performance penalties depending on how it is scheduled.

Come on, you can do better than that!

As we know the Cell is closer in architecture to stream processors such as those you find in GPUs than to  more traditional CPU designs. The SPUs were supposed form day one to be able to bring some of the weight of graphical elaboration - as the memory access indicates - and originally even a Cell-only graphical approach was considered.

This approach - which is not Sony's, the Cell being a Sony/IBM/Toshiba venture - is actually not backwards at all. I'm ready to place a bet that in 5-10 years the CPU/GPU divide will be filled by "farms of simple stream cores smaller set of complex cores" architectures. We'll see a dimished interest in feature matrices expressed in terms of specific APIs (the abomination that is "a direct3D 11 feature") and a return to wider and deeper programmbility of graphical elaboration.

Of course this would require you survive 5 to 10 years to the terrible perils of your godforsaken land if we want to check on the bet...



"All you need in life is ignorance and confidence; then success is sure." - Mark Twain

"..." - Gordon Freeman

WereKitten said:
Squilliam said:
ethomaz said:

Ok. You can think anything about me... but I'm not creating history or flaming.

To Microsoft/360 is good because some games uses 2xMSAA... so 2xMLAA will release some more GPU to graphics... but for games that use 100% of the GPU for graphics that have no use... a better alternative would be to have it done by the CPU but someone told me that the 360 CPU can't handle that.


The ATI implementation and a console implementation is apples/oranges. The former is pretty much a hack whereas the latter is built into the game code. The actual method used to reproduce the effect is likely different too.

Why would they move a 'graphics effect' off the GPU? It's the Sony solution which is backwards here. It is quite possible that they can fit it into the GPU frame without much if any performance penalties depending on how it is scheduled.

Come on, you can do better than that!

As we know the Cell is closer in architecture to stream processors such as those you find in GPUs than to  more traditional CPU designs. The SPUs were supposed form day one to be able to bring some of the weight of graphical elaboration - as the memory access indicates - and originally even a Cell-only graphical approach was considered.

This approach - which is not Sony's, the Cell being a Sony/IBM/Toshiba venture - is actually not backwards at all. I'm ready to place a bet that in 5-10 years the CPU/GPU divide will be filled by "farms of simple stream cores smaller set of complex cores" architectures. We'll see a dimished interest in feature matrices expressed in terms of specific APIs (the abomination that is "a direct3D 11 feature") and a return to wider and deeper programmbility of graphical elaboration.

Of course this would require you survive 5 to 10 years to the terrible perils of your godforsaken land if we want to check on the bet...

By offloading the workload to the Cell processor they need to use additional buffers in order to bring the Cell into play. This isn't nearly as memory and bandwidth efficient to doing all of the processing on one locum. Sure theres always room for specialisation especially given power constraints where in many designs <25% of all transistors are active at any one point in time as performance per watt becomes the paramount metric. So whether the SPUs were meant for these tasks or not doesn't matter. In this instance MLAA may run better on the Xbox 360 given the respective architectures than the PS3.



Tease.

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