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Forums - Nintendo - Metroid: Other M - The Black Sheep....or so we thought

Kenryoku_Maxis said:
Phoeniks.Wright said:

Sure, I didn't play it, but looking at the videos, and you can find ones where the guy just plays, no commentary, I saw 3 things which just shouldn't be here: an over-reliance on missiles, it's almost as if it was the standard beam it's used that much; the cutscenes with the characterisation of Samus. The quicker they get rid of this and forget about it, the better. And finally, you're exploring a metallic hub ship or whatnot. It is boring, very boring. In metroiod and the prime games, I'm actually exploring a planet, which offers such diverse locations, I was in awe when I played them, especially prime 1. Here, it's just "meh, some slightly different metal pieces".

I also don't think the entire series is crap, just that this game is horrible, and it looks that it's not going to get much better from this.

You rely on Missiles a LOT more in games like Metroid II, Fusion and Prime than in Other M.  You can actually beat nearly every boss just with charge beam, aside from probably the Queen Metroid (which takes a Super Bomb) and MB, which does focus on missiles.

Heck, you can even defeat Nightmare and Phantoon with just Charge Beams.  It'll take longer, but you can.

And while I've said dozens of times that Other M could have been more open ended and allow for more exploration, its not as bad as you guys make it out to be.  Each area is very distinct and each Sector mimics the same areas as in Super Metroid.  The only 'Metalic' focused areas are Main Sector and Sector 0.  Hell, I could even argue there's more 'metalic' style areas in Prime and Fusion than in Other M.

I still contend that you can't call a game crap without having played it.

About the relying on missiles, don't know about metroid 2, never played it, remember in fusion using them quite a bit, so fair enough on that bit, but not as much as you say in Prime. Although you have to recognise that since in MOM you can recharge your missiles to a certain amount, if not fully, when you want to, the designers clearly intended their systematic use, not so much as a power up from regular beams.

But coming to the main point, the problem still is that the game world in MOM is uninteresting. You explore a ship. Baby bottle shaped at that, if the implicit message is anything to go by. Whose interiors look like some uninspiring, cliched metallic surfaces. The different environments are just an illusion, since everything takes place on that ship. I am not in the least exploring the Metroid universe with this game. And going back to the ship environments, because it's all created, why do they go back to the usual fire/ice/grass world again? Why this complete lack of creativity? I've seen this stuff in prime 1, and it was done much better then. So why not make some new areas, instead of recycling old ones?

And another thing which lets me say that this game is crap, relative to other Metroid games, is the complete thrashing of Samus' character. Who does Sakamoto think he is to tell me what she should be like? It really ruins the game, knowing that I'm playing some lost child with a hell of a lot of issues, than as what she should be: a pretty badass bounty hunter.



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Phoeniks.Wright said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
Phoeniks.Wright said:

Sure, I didn't play it, but looking at the videos, and you can find ones where the guy just plays, no commentary, I saw 3 things which just shouldn't be here: an over-reliance on missiles, it's almost as if it was the standard beam it's used that much; the cutscenes with the characterisation of Samus. The quicker they get rid of this and forget about it, the better. And finally, you're exploring a metallic hub ship or whatnot. It is boring, very boring. In metroiod and the prime games, I'm actually exploring a planet, which offers such diverse locations, I was in awe when I played them, especially prime 1. Here, it's just "meh, some slightly different metal pieces".

I also don't think the entire series is crap, just that this game is horrible, and it looks that it's not going to get much better from this.

You rely on Missiles a LOT more in games like Metroid II, Fusion and Prime than in Other M.  You can actually beat nearly every boss just with charge beam, aside from probably the Queen Metroid (which takes a Super Bomb) and MB, which does focus on missiles.

Heck, you can even defeat Nightmare and Phantoon with just Charge Beams.  It'll take longer, but you can.

And while I've said dozens of times that Other M could have been more open ended and allow for more exploration, its not as bad as you guys make it out to be.  Each area is very distinct and each Sector mimics the same areas as in Super Metroid.  The only 'Metalic' focused areas are Main Sector and Sector 0.  Hell, I could even argue there's more 'metalic' style areas in Prime and Fusion than in Other M.

I still contend that you can't call a game crap without having played it.

About the relying on missiles, don't know about metroid 2, never played it, remember in fusion using them quite a bit, so fair enough on that bit, but not as much as you say in Prime. Although you have to recognise that since in MOM you can recharge your missiles to a certain amount, if not fully, when you want to, the designers clearly intended their systematic use, not so much as a power up from regular beams.

But coming to the main point, the problem still is that the game world in MOM is uninteresting. You explore a ship. Baby bottle shaped at that, if the implicit message is anything to go by. Whose interiors look like some uninspiring, cliched metallic surfaces. The different environments are just an illusion, since everything takes place on that ship. I am not in the least exploring the Metroid universe with this game. And going back to the ship environments, because it's all created, why do they go back to the usual fire/ice/grass world again? Why this complete lack of creativity? I've seen this stuff in prime 1, and it was done much better then. So why not make some new areas, instead of recycling old ones?

And another thing which lets me say that this game is crap, relative to other Metroid games, is the complete thrashing of Samus' character. Who does Sakamoto think he is to tell me what she should be like? It really ruins the game, knowing that I'm playing some lost child with a hell of a lot of issues, than as what she should be: a pretty badass bounty hunter.

Well, we can't really compare this to anything because its more based on your opinion, which is entirely subjective.

For example, I agree they didn't tell the story well and Samus character should have been handled different;y.  Howeve,r I felt every area of the game was disinct (Plant life for Sector 1, Ice area for Sector 2, Manga Zone for Sector 3, Futuristic SciFi area for Sector 0 and 1).  And, like with Metroid Fusion, I like that they actually went to a new location besides just 'a planet like Zebes'.  Kind of like I like the world of SR388 as well, which is a combination of straight caverns/plant life and very SciFi Chozo Ruins.

Also, the developers added the feature of refilling your missiles because you don't pick up refills of missiles (or energy) in Other M.  But as I said, you literally can kill everything except like 2 bosses with just the standard beam weapons.  Compare this to something like Metroid Prime where specific enemies and most obsses required missiles.  In all honesty, the use of missiles is better in Prime (because they actually have a use).



Six upcoming games you should look into:

 

  

I hope this game crosses 1 million so all the haters can melt into a screaming pool of hate, disbelief and indignation like a wicked witch in water.



Tag - "No trolling on my watch!"

ClaudeLv250 said:

I hope this game crosses 1 million so all the haters can melt into a screaming pool of hate, disbelief and indignation like a wicked witch in water.


No, we won't. Even if it does, it would be a slow crawl, still making it clear it didn't have legs, and it won't magically change the fact that it didn't make the series more popular, but make Samus a laughing stock.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

Kenryoku_Maxis said:
Phoeniks.Wright said:

About the relying on missiles, don't know about metroid 2, never played it, remember in fusion using them quite a bit, so fair enough on that bit, but not as much as you say in Prime. Although you have to recognise that since in MOM you can recharge your missiles to a certain amount, if not fully, when you want to, the designers clearly intended their systematic use, not so much as a power up from regular beams.

But coming to the main point, the problem still is that the game world in MOM is uninteresting. You explore a ship. Baby bottle shaped at that, if the implicit message is anything to go by. Whose interiors look like some uninspiring, cliched metallic surfaces. The different environments are just an illusion, since everything takes place on that ship. I am not in the least exploring the Metroid universe with this game. And going back to the ship environments, because it's all created, why do they go back to the usual fire/ice/grass world again? Why this complete lack of creativity? I've seen this stuff in prime 1, and it was done much better then. So why not make some new areas, instead of recycling old ones?

And another thing which lets me say that this game is crap, relative to other Metroid games, is the complete thrashing of Samus' character. Who does Sakamoto think he is to tell me what she should be like? It really ruins the game, knowing that I'm playing some lost child with a hell of a lot of issues, than as what she should be: a pretty badass bounty hunter.

Well, we can't really compare this to anything because its more based on your opinion, which is entirely subjective.

For example, I agree they didn't tell the story well and Samus character should have been handled different;y.  Howeve,r I felt every area of the game was disinct (Plant life for Sector 1, Ice area for Sector 2, Manga Zone for Sector 3, Futuristic SciFi area for Sector 0 and 1).  And, like with Metroid Fusion, I like that they actually went to a new location besides just 'a planet like Zebes'.  Kind of like I like the world of SR388 as well, which is a combination of straight caverns/plant life and very SciFi Chozo Ruins.

Also, the developers added the feature of refilling your missiles because you don't pick up refills of missiles (or energy) in Other M.  But as I said, you literally can kill everything except like 2 bosses with just the standard beam weapons.  Compare this to something like Metroid Prime where specific enemies and most obsses required missiles.  In all honesty, the use of missiles is better in Prime (because they actually have a use).

For the missiles, I will replay the games eventually to see how it was done, but I dson't believe most bosses and enemies needed to be defeated by them, just made it much easier.

But saying that because I find it uninteresting makes it just an opinion is somewhat cutting it short, I didn't come to this conclusion just like that. First, sure every area is distinct, but I've seen these exact same themed distinct areas in Prime, in 2001, 10 years before MOM. In the meantime, we had prime 2, which was very much not a Zebes like planet, and prime 3 even went as to have 4 or 5 different planets, with still different themes. I am complaining that they have been incredibly lazy on the content side, since they're just recycling themes from a previous game, and so you get the completely justifiable reaction of "been there, done that". 10 years for recycled content. And that isn't good.

As for the Samus character, it isn't how it was handled that's the problem, but what they've turned her into that's atrocious. All characterisation of her should have not happened, and even worse with what they did.



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"As for the Samus character, it isn't how it was handled that's the problem, but what they've turned her into that's atrocious."

But handling it compounded the problem, as she's both offensive and boring.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs

Phoeniks.Wright said:
Kenryoku_Maxis said:
Phoeniks.Wright said:

About the relying on missiles, don't know about metroid 2, never played it, remember in fusion using them quite a bit, so fair enough on that bit, but not as much as you say in Prime. Although you have to recognise that since in MOM you can recharge your missiles to a certain amount, if not fully, when you want to, the designers clearly intended their systematic use, not so much as a power up from regular beams.

But coming to the main point, the problem still is that the game world in MOM is uninteresting. You explore a ship. Baby bottle shaped at that, if the implicit message is anything to go by. Whose interiors look like some uninspiring, cliched metallic surfaces. The different environments are just an illusion, since everything takes place on that ship. I am not in the least exploring the Metroid universe with this game. And going back to the ship environments, because it's all created, why do they go back to the usual fire/ice/grass world again? Why this complete lack of creativity? I've seen this stuff in prime 1, and it was done much better then. So why not make some new areas, instead of recycling old ones?

And another thing which lets me say that this game is crap, relative to other Metroid games, is the complete thrashing of Samus' character. Who does Sakamoto think he is to tell me what she should be like? It really ruins the game, knowing that I'm playing some lost child with a hell of a lot of issues, than as what she should be: a pretty badass bounty hunter.

Well, we can't really compare this to anything because its more based on your opinion, which is entirely subjective.

For example, I agree they didn't tell the story well and Samus character should have been handled different;y.  Howeve,r I felt every area of the game was disinct (Plant life for Sector 1, Ice area for Sector 2, Manga Zone for Sector 3, Futuristic SciFi area for Sector 0 and 1).  And, like with Metroid Fusion, I like that they actually went to a new location besides just 'a planet like Zebes'.  Kind of like I like the world of SR388 as well, which is a combination of straight caverns/plant life and very SciFi Chozo Ruins.

Also, the developers added the feature of refilling your missiles because you don't pick up refills of missiles (or energy) in Other M.  But as I said, you literally can kill everything except like 2 bosses with just the standard beam weapons.  Compare this to something like Metroid Prime where specific enemies and most obsses required missiles.  In all honesty, the use of missiles is better in Prime (because they actually have a use).

For the missiles, I will replay the games eventually to see how it was done, but I dson't believe most bosses and enemies needed to be defeated by them, just made it much easier.

But saying that because I find it uninteresting makes it just an opinion is somewhat cutting it short, I didn't come to this conclusion just like that. First, sure every area is distinct, but I've seen these exact same themed distinct areas in Prime, in 2001, 10 years before MOM. In the meantime, we had prime 2, which was very much not a Zebes like planet, and prime 3 even went as to have 4 or 5 different planets, with still different themes. I am complaining that they have been incredibly lazy on the content side, since they're just recycling themes from a previous game, and so you get the completely justifiable reaction of "been there, done that". 10 years for recycled content. And that isn't good.

As for the Samus character, it isn't how it was handled that's the problem, but what they've turned her into that's atrocious. All characterisation of her should have not happened, and even worse with what they did.

But it is an opinion.  Some people (god help them) thought Samus' character was done well in Other M.  Can't really say their opinion is wrong.  Just like I can't say you're right for disliking it.

And I don't quite get your overall point...I do think the Prime games are an example of a Action/Platformer in the 3D world.



Six upcoming games you should look into:

 

  

@LordTheKnighNight: true, the handling compounded the problem, but it's still secondary to what her new character is in MOM. Arguably, there probably is no good way of handling it, since her new character, however you show it, is just bad.

@Kenryoku_Maxis: Apart from being a submissive woman just being a bad character to have, it's also completely contrary to what most people Imagined her character to be, or want it to be, and the relative low sales show it. Out of the Metroid games I've played, and moreso if you played all of them, does it ever look like she's a "fragile soul, who looks up to Malkovich for emotional guidance, and is hopelessly lost without her baby"? No. She's just here on a mission, and finishes it so well everytime. Like a bounty hunter. So it's MOM which is portraying a false image of Samus.

As for my overall point, to make it short, is that MOM is an unoriginal game, since the environments are copy pasta from Prime, which barely explores the Metroid universe, since it's set on only that ship, which could be in any scifi game, and ruins Samus' character completely. It's just a terrible Metroid game, and judging from Sakamoto's reaction, it doesn't seem it will get any better in the next game, if it will come out anytime soon.



LordTheNightKnight said:
ClaudeLv250 said:

I hope this game crosses 1 million so all the haters can melt into a screaming pool of hate, disbelief and indignation like a wicked witch in water.


No, we won't. Even if it does, it would be a slow crawl, still making it clear it didn't have legs, and it won't magically change the fact that it didn't make the series more popular, but make Samus a laughing stock.


Sorry, I couldn't understand the gurgling from the puddle over the sounds of Metroid: Awesome M. Something about legs? In this series?



Tag - "No trolling on my watch!"

ClaudeLv250 said:
LordTheNightKnight said:
ClaudeLv250 said:

I hope this game crosses 1 million so all the haters can melt into a screaming pool of hate, disbelief and indignation like a wicked witch in water.


No, we won't. Even if it does, it would be a slow crawl, still making it clear it didn't have legs, and it won't magically change the fact that it didn't make the series more popular, but make Samus a laughing stock.


Sorry, I couldn't understand the gurgling from the puddle over the sounds of Metroid: Awesome M. Something about legs? In this series?


If it was really awesome, it would have had legs.



A flashy-first game is awesome when it comes out. A great-first game is awesome forever.

Plus, just for the hell of it: Kelly Brook at the 2008 BAFTAs