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Forums - Sony - 3rd party developers can never get the full potential of the PS3

 

3rd party developers can never get the full potential of the PS3

True 52 47.27%
 
False 31 28.18%
 
maybe 27 24.55%
 
Total:110
CGI-Quality said:
BenVTrigger said:

That doesn't have anything to do with the "the power of the PS3" though.  Gears 2 looks better than Uncharted 1 and Gears 3 looks better than Uncharted 2.

Now let me point something important out here, this has NOTHING to do with comparing 360 vs PS3.  I'm simply using this as an example to the people who run around claiming PS3's true power is far ahead of everyone else and only PS3 exclusives are the best looking games.  To be honest it has nothing to do with the PS3 and everything to do with developers.  Epic has achieved similar graphics on the 360 that Naughty Dog has on the PS3, and even set to surpass Uncharted 2 with Gears 3 from everything I've seen.

In short the reason God of War, Uncharted, and Killzone look so amazing has more to do with extremely talented developers than the system itself.  When you get a talented team together on either console the bar for graphics can be raised.

Much of that is true, but the system's power still plays a pivotal role. The two consoles are similar in power, but not the same, and it shows in their exclusives.

The 360 needs more engines designed to take advantage of it's specs. That's one advantage the PS3 has over it. The talent is crucial, because the better a team knows a console (and their basic knowledge of code in general), the better their results will be.

Back on the subject of 3rd party titles, there are some beautiful titles from those devs, but to have the potential to create a God of War or Uncharted-like visual spectacle, they'll need to not only tap further into the available power, but use it as efficiently as they can. Until then, I think Naughty Dog, Guerrilla Games, and Santa Monica will continue to reign supreme with visuals.

Yeah I agree the systems power does indeed play a pretty big role as well but to me thats a trade off too.  The PS3 is better in some areas and the 360 in others.  Thats one reason some multi-plats look better on PS3 and some on 360 is mostly due to the different ways the developers tackle the system.  

I just see alot of PS3 only owners that go around and try to claim the only reason multiplats don't look as good is because the 360 is somehow "holding back" 3rd party developers from being able to reach God of War, Killzone, and Uncharted levels when in fact that has nothing to do with it.  Just like multi plat developers for the most part don't reach the Gears of War, Halo Reach, and Forza levels.  At the end of the day when you are only developing a game on one platform you have more time to optimize engines, assets, and time on that particular version which is why many exclusives look better than multiplats.

Edit:  Also sorry for going slightly off topic lol, though I do think the discussion is relevant to the original topic.



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MGS4, GTA4, Red Dead Redemption, etc. all say false.



CGI-Quality said:
BenVTrigger said:

That doesn't have anything to do with the "the power of the PS3" though.  Gears 2 looks better than Uncharted 1 and Gears 3 looks better than Uncharted 2.

Now let me point something important out here, this has NOTHING to do with comparing 360 vs PS3.  I'm simply using this as an example to the people who run around claiming PS3's true power is far ahead of everyone else and only PS3 exclusives are the best looking games.  To be honest it has nothing to do with the PS3 and everything to do with developers.  Epic has achieved similar graphics on the 360 that Naughty Dog has on the PS3, and even set to surpass Uncharted 2 with Gears 3 from everything I've seen.

In short the reason God of War, Uncharted, and Killzone look so amazing has more to do with extremely talented developers than the system itself.  When you get a talented team together on either console the bar for graphics can be raised.

Much of that is true, but the system's power still plays a pivotal role. The two consoles are similar in power, but not the same, and it shows in their exclusives.

The 360 needs more engines designed to take advantage of it's specs. That's one advantage the PS3 has over it. The talent is crucial though, as you said, because the better a team knows a console (and their basic knowledge of code in general), the better their results will be.

Back on the subject of 3rd party titles, there are some beautiful titles from those devs, but to have the potential to create a God of War or Uncharted-like visual spectacle, they'll need to not only tap further into the available power, but use it as efficiently as they can. Until then, I think Naughty Dog, Guerrilla Games, and Santa Monica will continue to reign supreme with visuals.

A post of beauty. nothing can be added to be honest.

Heres all im saying on this subject. When i see a 3rd party or 360 exclusive game look better then the top sony first party games, then i will always say the PS3 has more in the tank



Nobody's perfect. I aint nobody!!!

Killzone 2. its not a fps. it a FIRST PERSON WAR SIMULATOR!!!! ..The true PLAYSTATION 3 launch date and market dominations is SEP 1st

Even Sony can't never get the full potential of the PS3 (and maybe not even be close to it). There are too many processors in the PS3 and is almost impossible to write a complex program (like a game) that can use all at the same time. Trust me guys, I'm a developer and know that nowadays one of the biggest problems in compute science is how to parallelize a program.

 



BenVTrigger said:
goforgold said:
BenVTrigger said:

I'm tired of seeing this argument and people making claiming how PS3 exclusives are so far ahead. Coming from someone who has played nearly every big PS3 exclusive the only games which stand out far ahead graphically from 3rd party games and 360 games are Uncharted 2, Killzone 2, and God of War 3.

The PS3 has great graphics and is an amazing system but in my opinion most of you guys that claim this stuff must have not played games like Assassins Creed, Gears of War, or many others.

I think that's the point, just because there is a small amount of games that meet that status means something. what if ALL multiplats on ps3 looked and preformed like killzone 2, gow3, and uncharted 2. that's the question, will 3rd parties reach that level, and I'd say 2011 will tell all, with Rage, Brink, Mass Effect 3, Portal 2, and Crysis, that will be the year 3rd parties show if they can of can't push the ps3 as far as Sony's first parties.

I also think it will mark the end of the lazy (inferior) port era of ps3 multiplats.

That doesn't have anything to do with the "the power of the PS3" though.  

Gears 2 looks better than Uncharted 1.

07 game vs late 08 game, well it better had

and Gears 3 looks better than Uncharted 2.

09 game vs. late 2011, I would sure hope it does.

Now let me point something important out here, this has NOTHING to do with comparing 360 vs PS3.  I'm simply using this as an example to the people who run around claiming PS3's true power is far ahead of everyone else and only PS3 exclusives are the best looking games.  To be honest it has nothing to do with the PS3 and everything to do with developers.  Epic has achieved similar graphics on the 360 that Naughty Dog has on the PS3, and even set to surpass Uncharted 2 with Gears 3 from everything I've seen.

In short the reason God of War, Uncharted, and Killzone look so amazing has more to do with extremely talented developers than the system itself.  When you get a talented team together on either console the bar for graphics can be raised.

*glances at 2011 and........ killzone 3, uncharted 3, resistance, 3 and infamous 2, hell even lbp2.

every year Sony developers put more out of the ps3 than 3rd parties, as it stands NO third party game has ever surpassed or equaled that of Sony's first parties, they eventually meet the the quality sure, but only years down the line, and by then Sony's developers raise the bar even more, and looking at 2011, it looks like they're set to do it again.

however 2011 more than ever will be the year 3rd parties will start to put out some amazing games on ps3, will they reach that of Sony's first parties, that's left to be seen, and that's the question of this thread, the whole 360 vs. ps3 (which had NUMEROUS technical comparisons in which ALL led to the same ps3 is more powerful conclusion) is completely irrelevant.

disclaimer: Fact the ps3 can output more than the 360, the cell processor is more powerful then the Xenos cpu, the 360 however has a more efficient GPU NOT more powerful, both run 512 mb ram, but the 360 runs it unified, thus when games are ported from 360 to ps3 they perform better on 360, that and the fact that most multiplats that look better on the ps3 hardly use the cell at all, which consist of 1 main core and 8 spe's Xenos has a tri core, so when ported games on ps3 ONLY use the one main core, making the 360 version a better looking and preforming game.

developers only now are beginning to realize that using the ps3 as a lead platform will lead to an equal looking and preforming multiplatform game, or the ps3 version being slightly better. and other developers such as Crytech and ValVe are not porting games at all instead building all versions of their games independently for each platform as to utilize all each one has to offer, it is in these games will we see if 3rd parties can mach Sony's first.



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CGI-Quality said:
BenVTrigger said:
CGI-Quality said:
BenVTrigger said:

That doesn't have anything to do with the "the power of the PS3" though.  Gears 2 looks better than Uncharted 1 and Gears 3 looks better than Uncharted 2.

Now let me point something important out here, this has NOTHING to do with comparing 360 vs PS3.  I'm simply using this as an example to the people who run around claiming PS3's true power is far ahead of everyone else and only PS3 exclusives are the best looking games.  To be honest it has nothing to do with the PS3 and everything to do with developers.  Epic has achieved similar graphics on the 360 that Naughty Dog has on the PS3, and even set to surpass Uncharted 2 with Gears 3 from everything I've seen.

In short the reason God of War, Uncharted, and Killzone look so amazing has more to do with extremely talented developers than the system itself.  When you get a talented team together on either console the bar for graphics can be raised.

Much of that is true, but the system's power still plays a pivotal role. The two consoles are similar in power, but not the same, and it shows in their exclusives.

The 360 needs more engines designed to take advantage of it's specs. That's one advantage the PS3 has over it. The talent is crucial, because the better a team knows a console (and their basic knowledge of code in general), the better their results will be.

Back on the subject of 3rd party titles, there are some beautiful titles from those devs, but to have the potential to create a God of War or Uncharted-like visual spectacle, they'll need to not only tap further into the available power, but use it as efficiently as they can. Until then, I think Naughty Dog, Guerrilla Games, and Santa Monica will continue to reign supreme with visuals.

Yeah I agree the systems power does indeed play a pretty big role as well but to me thats a trade off too.  The PS3 is better in some areas and the 360 in others.  Thats one reason some multi-plats look better on PS3 and some on 360 is mostly due to the different ways the developers tackle the system.  

I just see alot of PS3 only owners that go around and try to claim the only reason multiplats don't look as good is because the 360 is somehow "holding back" 3rd party developers from being able to reach God of War, Killzone, and Uncharted levels when in fact that has nothing to do with it.  Just like multi plat developers for the most part don't reach the Gears of War, Halo Reach, and Forza levels.  At the end of the day when you are only developing a game on one platform you have more time to optimize engines, assets, and time on that particular version which is why many exclusives look better than multiplats.

Edit:  Also sorry for going slightly off topic lol, though I do think the discussion is relevant to the original topic.

Second pargraph is spot on. The 360 and PS3 aren't different enough in power to blame just one system for 3rd party titles not quite reaching the levels of exclusives. With the right optimization, both HD consoles have the potential to raise the bar.

agreed



adsl said:

Even Sony can't never get the full potential of the PS3 (and maybe not even be close to it). There are too many processors in the PS3 and is almost impossible to write a complex program (like a game) that can use all at the same time. Trust me guys, I'm a developer and know that nowadays one of the biggest problems in compute science is how to parallelize a program.

 

Listen to this man,he speaks the pure truth ;).



Mordred11 said:
adsl said:

Even Sony can't never get the full potential of the PS3 (and maybe not even be close to it). There are too many processors in the PS3 and is almost impossible to write a complex program (like a game) that can use all at the same time. Trust me guys, I'm a developer and know that nowadays one of the biggest problems in compute science is how to parallelize a program.

 

Listen to this man,he speaks the pure truth ;).

Thanks!

I would like to add that testing is another huge problem in parallel programs. I mean, when a lot of things are happening at the same time, is almost impossible to predict the program's behavior. So how can I test something that I don't know how to predict it's behavior?

I believe that Sony's next console will have a simple architecture, so the developers could easily code and test their games. This is what Sega did, the Saturn was to complex to the developers but Sega fixed it with the Dreamcast.