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Forums - Microsoft Discussion - Sony: Kinect is a bunch of tech problems

NotStan on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
[..]

Hello. Who is saying that? A Sony employed engineer. You wouldn't expect him to say something GOOD about the direct competitor in motion gaming, would you? 

They weren't talking about their competitor they're talking about why they didn't pursue 3D cameras, they would of said the same things before kinect was annouced, hell if you dig up their research and reports on 3D cameras that they gave to Sony they probably did, and if it wasn't for those limitations then why didn't Sony pursue 3D cameras?

Because they didn't see it as a viable market? Whereas MS did and took the opportunity to create a periphial that will is likely boosting the sales of 360 and is likely to squeeze another year out of it. Again, I don't get how you say that sales have no relevance to the capabilities of Kinect and then go off talking about why Sony did what it did.

Final like is, capabilities are capabilities. Do you have Kinect? No "Around a friends house" or "I was at gamestop once.. browsing some games and played Kinect for 5 minutes" experiences. Just because Sony didn't pursue it doesn't mean that this tech is not compatible, if you google some of the hacks on Youtube you'll see how much of the potential is just waiting to be unlocked, again, if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad. Ofcourse they would say something along the lines of "We tried it, but man it was rubbish!". It's called downplaying the competition, I hear that's quite common.

Read the full article before commenting again here I'll link it http://www.videogamer.com/news/sony_on_why_ps_move_has_greater_appeal_than_kinect.html

"We sit down with SCE Move developer Anton Mikhailov To talk about the status of PlayStation's motion-controller platform since its launch and why it's not just Kinect with a controller."

"if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad"

^I've been saying that for a page or two now.

 I read the initial article and the follow up article on Destructoid, I see no reason heading into the full interview and spending my time reading that when someone already took that time and had done the sum up.

But then again, I guess if a Sony representative were to tell you that they have the technology/funding/ability to launch a pig into space, you'd probably believe them.



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

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Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
fordy said:
Edgeoflife said:
Not sure about ps1 but ps2 it was a big part of it, the other part though was getting all the 3rd parties in exclusivity contracts, but if it wasn't for marketing and those deals dreamcast would of kicked its ass 

Marketing does not always imply success. Microsoft threw a ton of money towards the Xbox last gen, and it barely managed to scrape into second. There are always multipkle factors.

For instance, which one would you consider an average consumer to stop at with interest at a department store: a Move setup with The Fight, or a Kinect setup with Kinect Adventures?

One thing I would give Sony credit for, and that is trying to make motion more appealing to the hardcore, but I don't think it's going to work, as stated before, plus on top of it, there's a risk of alienating potential casual buyers, which is supposed to be the base for this kind of tech.

Depends completely on the demographic, if it was a street punk he would go for the fighting game where he can actually punch, if it was a soccer mom she'd go for the cartoony looking game, and marketing doesn't always equal sucess but it plays a major role in it and the fact remains that move is the better product for the application of gaming, it doesn't have the same appeal though but when looked at objectively even for causual games move is the better choice in most cases 



Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
[..]

Hello. Who is saying that? A Sony employed engineer. You wouldn't expect him to say something GOOD about the direct competitor in motion gaming, would you? 

They weren't talking about their competitor they're talking about why they didn't pursue 3D cameras, they would of said the same things before kinect was annouced, hell if you dig up their research and reports on 3D cameras that they gave to Sony they probably did, and if it wasn't for those limitations then why didn't Sony pursue 3D cameras?

Because they didn't see it as a viable market? Whereas MS did and took the opportunity to create a periphial that will is likely boosting the sales of 360 and is likely to squeeze another year out of it. Again, I don't get how you say that sales have no relevance to the capabilities of Kinect and then go off talking about why Sony did what it did.

Final like is, capabilities are capabilities. Do you have Kinect? No "Around a friends house" or "I was at gamestop once.. browsing some games and played Kinect for 5 minutes" experiences. Just because Sony didn't pursue it doesn't mean that this tech is not compatible, if you google some of the hacks on Youtube you'll see how much of the potential is just waiting to be unlocked, again, if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad. Ofcourse they would say something along the lines of "We tried it, but man it was rubbish!". It's called downplaying the competition, I hear that's quite common.

Read the full article before commenting again here I'll link it http://www.videogamer.com/news/sony_on_why_ps_move_has_greater_appeal_than_kinect.html

"We sit down with SCE Move developer Anton Mikhailov To talk about the status of PlayStation's motion-controller platform since its launch and why it's not just Kinect with a controller."

"if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad"

^I've been saying that for a page or two now.

 I read the initial article and the follow up article on Destructoid, I see no reason heading into the full interview and spending my time reading that when someone already took that time and had done the sum up.

But then again, I guess if a Sony representative were to tell you that they have the technology/funding/ability to launch a pig into space, you'd probably believe them.

So you are assuming he's biased and everything he says is a lie without even knowing the context he said it in, wow just wow 



NotStan on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
[..]

Read the full article before commenting again here I'll link it http://www.videogamer.com/news/sony_on_why_ps_move_has_greater_appeal_than_kinect.html

"We sit down with SCE Move developer Anton Mikhailov To talk about the status of PlayStation's motion-controller platform since its launch and why it's not just Kinect with a controller."

"if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad"

^I've been saying that for a page or two now.

 I read the initial article and the follow up article on Destructoid, I see no reason heading into the full interview and spending my time reading that when someone already took that time and had done the sum up.

But then again, I guess if a Sony representative were to tell you that they have the technology/funding/ability to launch a pig into space, you'd probably believe them.

So you are assuming he's biased and everything he says is a lie without even knowing the context he said it in, wow just wow

If it was an independent engineer fair enough, that guy has bills to pay. Of course he's going to focus on the negatives of the technology and not even mention the positives, it's a competitor for Christ's sake. Are you seriously that naive!?



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
[..]

Read the full article before commenting again here I'll link it http://www.videogamer.com/news/sony_on_why_ps_move_has_greater_appeal_than_kinect.html

"We sit down with SCE Move developer Anton Mikhailov To talk about the status of PlayStation's motion-controller platform since its launch and why it's not just Kinect with a controller."

"if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad"

^I've been saying that for a page or two now.

 I read the initial article and the follow up article on Destructoid, I see no reason heading into the full interview and spending my time reading that when someone already took that time and had done the sum up.

But then again, I guess if a Sony representative were to tell you that they have the technology/funding/ability to launch a pig into space, you'd probably believe them.

So you are assuming he's biased and everything he says is a lie without even knowing the context he said it in, wow just wow

If it was an independent engineer fair enough, that guy has bills to pay. Of course he's going to focus on the negatives of the technology and not even mention the positives, it's a competitor for Christ's sake. Are you seriously that naive!?

He did mention alot of the positives, if you read the interview you would know that 



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NotStan on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
[..]

Hello. Who is saying that? A Sony employed engineer. You wouldn't expect him to say something GOOD about the direct competitor in motion gaming, would you? 

They weren't talking about their competitor they're talking about why they didn't pursue 3D cameras, they would of said the same things before kinect was annouced, hell if you dig up their research and reports on 3D cameras that they gave to Sony they probably did, and if it wasn't for those limitations then why didn't Sony pursue 3D cameras?

Because they didn't see it as a viable market? Whereas MS did and took the opportunity to create a periphial that will is likely boosting the sales of 360 and is likely to squeeze another year out of it. Again, I don't get how you say that sales have no relevance to the capabilities of Kinect and then go off talking about why Sony did what it did.

Final like is, capabilities are capabilities. Do you have Kinect? No "Around a friends house" or "I was at gamestop once.. browsing some games and played Kinect for 5 minutes" experiences. Just because Sony didn't pursue it doesn't mean that this tech is not compatible, if you google some of the hacks on Youtube you'll see how much of the potential is just waiting to be unlocked, again, if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad. Ofcourse they would say something along the lines of "We tried it, but man it was rubbish!". It's called downplaying the competition, I hear that's quite common.

Read the full article before commenting again here I'll link it http://www.videogamer.com/news/sony_on_why_ps_move_has_greater_appeal_than_kinect.html

"We sit down with SCE Move developer Anton Mikhailov To talk about the status of PlayStation's motion-controller platform since its launch and why it's not just Kinect with a controller."

"if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad"

^I've been saying that for a page or two now.

 I read the initial article and the follow up article on Destructoid, I see no reason heading into the full interview and spending my time reading that when someone already took that time and had done the sum up.

But then again, I guess if a Sony representative were to tell you that they have the technology/funding/ability to launch a pig into space, you'd probably believe them.

So you are assuming he's biased and everything he says is a lie without even knowing the context he said it in, wow just wow

Don't turn this around at me just because I don't think that a direct competitor of the product is not biased in the slightest. I am just not the one to lap up propaganda quite easily.



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

Edgeoflife on 13 February 2011
NotStan said:
Don't turn this around at me just because I don't think that a direct competitor of the product is not biased in the slightest. I am just not the one to lap up propaganda quite easily.

Your defense of kinect says otherwise 



NotStan on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Edgeoflife said:
[..]

Read the full article before commenting again here I'll link it http://www.videogamer.com/news/sony_on_why_ps_move_has_greater_appeal_than_kinect.html

"We sit down with SCE Move developer Anton Mikhailov To talk about the status of PlayStation's motion-controller platform since its launch and why it's not just Kinect with a controller."

"if you expected one of Move engineers to give a truthful unbiased view on Kinect, you were mad"

^I've been saying that for a page or two now.

 I read the initial article and the follow up article on Destructoid, I see no reason heading into the full interview and spending my time reading that when someone already took that time and had done the sum up.

But then again, I guess if a Sony representative were to tell you that they have the technology/funding/ability to launch a pig into space, you'd probably believe them.

So you are assuming he's biased and everything he says is a lie without even knowing the context he said it in, wow just wow

If it was an independent engineer fair enough, that guy has bills to pay. Of course he's going to focus on the negatives of the technology and not even mention the positives, it's a competitor for Christ's sake. Are you seriously that naive!?

He did mention alot of the positives, if you read the interview you would know that 

Yes I am sure I should have read the long ass 3 page interview instead of reading the sum up. Oh my, please remind me next time to click through to the original article, then from there to click through onto the next one. Read the summary. That was posted in the OP, that's what I read. If you expect me to whip out my magnifying glass and scrutinize every little bit of that interview, I am seriously beginning to think that you're trolling me. Very hard.

Actually now I think about it..

Or you really are that naive.



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.

fordy on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
fordy said:
Edgeoflife said:
Not sure about ps1 but ps2 it was a big part of it, the other part though was getting all the 3rd parties in exclusivity contracts, but if it wasn't for marketing and those deals dreamcast would of kicked its ass 

Marketing does not always imply success. Microsoft threw a ton of money towards the Xbox last gen, and it barely managed to scrape into second. There are always multipkle factors.

For instance, which one would you consider an average consumer to stop at with interest at a department store: a Move setup with The Fight, or a Kinect setup with Kinect Adventures?

One thing I would give Sony credit for, and that is trying to make motion more appealing to the hardcore, but I don't think it's going to work, as stated before, plus on top of it, there's a risk of alienating potential casual buyers, which is supposed to be the base for this kind of tech.

Depends completely on the demographic, if it was a street punk he would go for the fighting game where he can actually punch, if it was a soccer mom she'd go for the cartoony looking game, and marketing doesn't always equal sucess but it plays a major role in it and the fact remains that move is the better product for the application of gaming, it doesn't have the same appeal though but when looked at objectively even for causual games move is the better choice in most cases 

I honestly dont know of any "street punks" who arent hardcore gamers, or better yet, hang around a department store.

Which leads me back to the original argument. Move might be better or it might not be. The way casuals see it (keep in mind that these are people who do NOT follow any gaming news whatsoever. They do not look at area resolutions, framerates or controller latency) they see the Move marked as new, and their initial response is "That's NOT new".



NotStan on 13 February 2011
Edgeoflife said:
NotStan said:
Don't turn this around at me just because I don't think that a direct competitor of the product is not biased in the slightest. I am just not the one to lap up propaganda quite easily.

Your defense of kinect says otherwise


There is a difference between countering someones views based on the products competitors interview and the defence of the product. I asked you if you have experienced Kinect to comment on whether it's a good product or not, I am still waiting for the answer, because going by your responses it's about as much a use as dog shit, which you have concluded without much experience yourself, I am not defending the product, I just think that your view is skewed and is based upon information that is provided by an engineer of Move. It's like me saying that Move is rubbish just because a Wii remote engineer said so.



Disconnect and self destruct, one bullet a time.