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Forums - General Discussion - Wikileaks + US diplomacy = biggest "diplomatic" storm ever incoming !

NJ5 said:
Kasz216 said:

No they didn't.

One woman decided she had been raped...

and the other who thought she had only been molested gave information to the court to support her.

Also, I don't think it was after they met?  I've read nothing like that.

All i've seen is that the second woman reported a rape, while the first gave details of their sexual encounter as testimony for the 2nd.

I remember reading several times that the women had private discussions before filing their complaints. I will try to find more articles to confirm this, but this is an interesting one that I just found:

http://www.crikey.com.au/2010/12/02/when-it-comes-to-assange-r-pe-case-the-swedes-are-making-it-up-as-they-go-along/

A few interesting claims here that are probably fairly easy to verify:

- the second woman "published on the internet a guide on how to get revenge on cheating boyfriends". (doesn't prove anything, but interesting for context I think)

- "she has thrown a party in Assange’s honour at her flat after the “crime” and tweeted to her followers that she is with the “the world’s coolest smartest people, it’s amazing!” (and then tried to delete these tweets)

- "But then neither Arden nor Wilén complained to the police but rather “sought advice”, a technique in Sweden enabling citizens to avoid just punishment for making false complaints. They sought advice together, having collaborated and irrevocably tainted each other’s evidence beforehand. Their SMS texts to each other show a plan to contact the Swedish newspaper Expressen beforehand in order to maximise the damage to Assange."


Sounds like rank sexist "Blaming the victim" stuff to me.

"A guide to getting revenge on exboyfriends"

If she had a guide already to do so... why didn't she go off her playbook?

 

Clearly "crying rape" wasn't on their, hence why they don't mention it so.

Are you familiar with the psychology of rape?


I mean, you do realize you are reading something directly from his lawyer?

You can see the same things from any accused rapists lawyer.



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Kasz216 said:

Ok.  I have to say this.

Fuck you.

"Women can be crazy" what kind of sexist remark is that.

No serously.  Using one mentally ill woman as a basis for juding all women when the large amount of rape cases go unreported and the ones that do are hard to find rapists guilty because of bullshit made up defenses like that.

Seriously you are saying because you know ONE crazy lady, that two women who have never met before somehow both made up a story to the police?

You don't know anyone who's liked to a woman or another man about a condom before?

Don't get your panties in a knot Kasz , but you're awfully naive if you don't think that a women would make up  rape allegations to create trouble for a guy. NJ5's article links don't really help your argument either.

As for the last question in this post, I honestly don't know anyone who's ever done that, nor can I imagine how you could "lie" about using a condom, and the girl not realising that the guy isn't wearing one. And I also don't think it's rape unless the girl realises, tells the guy to stop, but he doesn't, she struggles etc. (typicall rape scenario).

If they have sex (consensually, with the gil thinking that the guy's wearing a condom), and after they do the deed the girl realises that the guy wasn't wearing a condom, then sorry sister, that ain't rape, or abuse or anything.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

sapphi_snake said:
Kasz216 said:

Ok.  I have to say this.

Fuck you.

"Women can be crazy" what kind of sexist remark is that.

No serously.  Using one mentally ill woman as a basis for juding all women when the large amount of rape cases go unreported and the ones that do are hard to find rapists guilty because of bullshit made up defenses like that.

Seriously you are saying because you know ONE crazy lady, that two women who have never met before somehow both made up a story to the police?

You don't know anyone who's liked to a woman or another man about a condom before?

Don't get your panties in a knot Kasz , but you're awfully naive if you don't think that a women would make up  rape allegations to create trouble for a guy. NJ5's article links don't really help your argument either.

As for the last question in this post, I honestly don't know anyone who's ever done that, nor can I imagine how you could "lie" about using a condom, and the girl not realising that the guy isn't wearing one. And I also don't think it's rape unless the girl realises, tells the guy to stop, but he doesn't, she struggles etc. (typicall rape scenario).

If they have sex (consensually, with the gil thinking that the guy's wearing a condom), and after they do the deed the girl realises that the guy wasn't wearing a condom, then sorry sister, that ain't rape, or abuse or anything.

1)  Would some women do that?  Yes?

Would msot women?  No.

Is the number of women who make up rape even remotely statistically significant when it comes to rape charges? 

No.

 

2) Yes it is!  THAT IS TOTALLY RAPE!  You have nonconsentially had sex with a women because you told her you were wearing a condom when you weren't.  It would be no different if a woman said she'd have sex with you... but not anal sex, then you stuck it in her anus.  That's rape.  You've done something specifically that she told you not to do and you violated her.  Whether she knew or not until after the fact is irrelvent.



I mean, to say that's not rape... that's like saying you had sex with your twin brothers girlfriend pretending to be him... and it's not rape because she ageed, there was no struggle, and didn't know you weren't your brother.



Kasz216 said:
Lostplanet22 said:

Yeah a sex crime against his ex-gf?  Anyway sex crimes are so handy, if you want to fuck up someone/ a company or want to know someone's location badly....Just accuse them for a sex crime ....You need no proof..   Not saying he is innoncent though..


I was going through wikileaks history their is some nice stuff ..

 

Scientology

On 7 April 2008, WikiLeaks reported receiving a letter (dated 27 March) from the Religious Technology Centre claiming ownership of several recently leaked documents pertaining to OT Levels within the Church of Scientology. These same documents were at the center of a 1994 scandal. The email stated:“ The Advanced Technology materials are unpublished, copyrighted works. Please be advised that your customer's action in this regard violates United States copyright law. Accordingly, we ask for your help in removing these works immediately from your service.

– Moxon and Kobrin[132] ”


The letter continued on to request the release of the logs of the uploader, which would remove their anonymity. WikiLeaks responded with a statement released on Wikinews stating: "in response to the attempted suppression, Wikileaks will release several thousand additional pages of Scientology material next week",[133] and did so.


Because ex girlfriends have never been abused and raped.  I mean, girlfriends can't be sexually abused right?  They chose to date the person?

Seriously.  Grow up.

No, in fact the most cases of rape and sex abuse are during relationships but also in most cases it ends up an act of revenge....something that is normal for the rich and/or the famous... Two people break up...five years later the guy became famous/rich while she is still an Clean lady, office worker etc....She feels like a failure and feels life is not fair..Then accuse him for a sex crime;..  Pay me some money or I make it public.....Either way she will have her revenge...  That's why I wrote   Yeah a sex crime against his ex-gf?   


Interpol searchs him for a sex crime, when they found him he may not have a lawyer....Yeah that says a lot to me..



 

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Kasz216 said:

1)  Would some women do that?  Yes?

Would msot women?  No.

Is the number of women who make up rape even remotely statistically significant when it comes to rape charges? 

No.

 

2) Yes it is!  THAT IS TOTALLY RAPE!  You have nonconsentially had sex with a women because you told her you were wearing a condom when you weren't.  It would be no different if a woman said she'd have sex with you... but not anal sex, then you stuck it in her anus.  That's rape.  You've done something specifically that she told you not to do and you violated her.  Whether she knew or not until after the fact is irrelvent.

Not the same thing. Unless she was saying "no" during the sex act, and making an effort to terminate the sex act, then it's not rape. I don't understand how a woman could not sense that the guy was not wearing a condom (I'd at least hope that she'd sense that the guy put his dick and her anus). Anyways, even if she truly didn't sense it, it still shouldn't count as rape. The guy would be a jerk, sure, but he isn't and shouldn't be a rapist.

Plus, how can she even prove that she said she wouldn't have sex without a condom? Did she make him sign something?



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)

Lostplanet22 said:
Kasz216 said:
Lostplanet22 said:

Yeah a sex crime against his ex-gf?  Anyway sex crimes are so handy, if you want to fuck up someone/ a company or want to know someone's location badly....Just accuse them for a sex crime ....You need no proof..   Not saying he is innoncent though..


I was going through wikileaks history their is some nice stuff ..

 

Scientology

On 7 April 2008, WikiLeaks reported receiving a letter (dated 27 March) from the Religious Technology Centre claiming ownership of several recently leaked documents pertaining to OT Levels within the Church of Scientology. These same documents were at the center of a 1994 scandal. The email stated:“ The Advanced Technology materials are unpublished, copyrighted works. Please be advised that your customer's action in this regard violates United States copyright law. Accordingly, we ask for your help in removing these works immediately from your service.

– Moxon and Kobrin[132] ”


The letter continued on to request the release of the logs of the uploader, which would remove their anonymity. WikiLeaks responded with a statement released on Wikinews stating: "in response to the attempted suppression, Wikileaks will release several thousand additional pages of Scientology material next week",[133] and did so.


Because ex girlfriends have never been abused and raped.  I mean, girlfriends can't be sexually abused right?  They chose to date the person?

Seriously.  Grow up.

No, in fact the most cases of rape and sex abuse are during relationships but also in most cases it ends up an act of revenge....something that is normal for the rich and/or the famous... Two people break up...five years later the guy became famous/rich while she is still an Clean lady, office worker etc....She feels like a failure and feels life is not fair..Then accuse him for a sex crime;..  Pay me some money or I make it public.....Either way she will have her revenge...  That's why I wrote   Yeah a sex crime against his ex-gf?    She had to accusse him immediately, how longer you wait how less people will believe you especially when he became famous;.and that in a combination with an search by interpol and the fact that he may not have a lawyer when he get caught says a lot...

Interpol searchs him for a sex crime, when they found him he may not have a lawyer....Yeah that says a lot to me..

3 days isn't "immediatly" for you?

Besides, again... i'd suggest reading up on the psychology of rape... it can take months before some women are even willing to admit to herself she's been raped.



That's why I deleted it immediately! My post was fucked up at the end so edited it...



 

sapphi_snake said:
Kasz216 said:

1)  Would some women do that?  Yes?

Would msot women?  No.

Is the number of women who make up rape even remotely statistically significant when it comes to rape charges? 

No.

 

2) Yes it is!  THAT IS TOTALLY RAPE!  You have nonconsentially had sex with a women because you told her you were wearing a condom when you weren't.  It would be no different if a woman said she'd have sex with you... but not anal sex, then you stuck it in her anus.  That's rape.  You've done something specifically that she told you not to do and you violated her.  Whether she knew or not until after the fact is irrelvent.

Not the same thing. Unless she was saying "no" during the sex act, and making an effort to terminate the sex act, then it's not rape. I don't understand how a woman could not sense that the guy was not wearing a condom (I'd at least hope that she'd sense that the guy put his dick and her anus). Anyways, even if she truly didn't sense it, it still shouldn't count as rape. The guy would be a jerk, sure, but he isn't and shouldn't be a rapist.

Plus, how can she even prove that she said she wouldn't have sex without a condom? Did she make him sign something?

A) Yes it is.  Rape is rape.  Whether it is committed via force or deception.

 

B) Because he asked first if they could have sex without a condom and she said no unless he got an STD test first?  Which he refused then put on a condom which he took off halfway through?


As for feeling it?  I'm guessing you haven't had much expierence with sex?  It's actually pretty easy, I've had a condom fall off before during sex and had to stop the other person because they didn't notice.

 

http://www.houseofruthdothan.org/rapemyths.htm is really something you should read.



Kasz216 said:

A) Yes it is.  Rape is rape.  Whether it is committed via force or deception.

 

B) Because he asked first if they could have sex without a condom and she said no unless he got an STD test first?  Which he refused then put on a condom which he took off halfway through?


As for feeling it?  I'm guessing you haven't had much expierence with sex?  It's actually pretty easy, I've had a condom fall off before during sex and had to stop the other person because they didn't notice.

 

http://www.houseofruthdothan.org/rapemyths.htm is really something you should read.

Point A:

Read the link you gave me. Agree with everything's that's written there. Butthe link doesn't support this argument. Sorry, deception =/rape.

Question: If a man and a woman had sex, and the man said "I won't have sex with you unless you're on the pill" and the woman lied that she was, would that also be considered rape?

 

Point B:

I am not a woman, so I have no way of knowing if you can feel a difference between a penis with a condom and a condomless penis in a vagina, as I do not have a vagina. I also never asked my ex this question, as it didn't cross my mind at the time. Next time I have sex, I'll ask.



"I don't understand how someone could like Tolstoy and Dostoyevsky, but not like Twilight!!!"

"Last book I read was Brokeback Mountain, I just don't have the patience for them unless it's softcore porn."

                                                                               (The Voice of a Generation and Seece)

"If you cant stand the sound of your own voice than dont become a singer !!!!!"

                                                                               (pizzahut451)