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Forums - General - Machine Girl-- Drill Braw, need I say more?

Words Of Wisdom said:
tarheel91 said:

Ignoratio elenchi (also known as irrelevant conclusion or irrelevant thesis) is the formal fallacy of presenting an argument that may in itself be valid, but doesn't address the issue in question. "Ignoratio elenchi" can be roughly translated by ignorance of refutation, that is, ignorance of what a refutation is; "elenchi" is from the Greek έλεγχος, meaning an argument of disproof or refutation.

1) You got the point.

2) You're trying to distract from the real argument.

3) If a scholarly US History book uses the term Indian to refer to these people, I think it's an acceptable term.

 


I'm sorry, but you missed the point long ago.

That's okay though, we even have prizes for our contestants that don't get the grand prize so that everyone can feel like a winner. For all your trouble and sincere arguing, you win...

A brand-new ACME Sarcasm Detector.

And an ASCII Picard:

............................................________
....................................,.-‘”...................``~.,
.............................,.-”...................................“-.,
.........................,/...............................................”:,
.....................,?......................................................,
.................../...........................................................,}
................./......................................................,:`^`..}
.............../...................................................,:”........./
..............?.....__.........................................:`.........../
............./__.(.....“~-,_..............................,:`........../
.........../(_....”~,_........“~,_....................,:`........_/
..........{.._$;_......”=,_.......“-,_.......,.-~-,},.~”;/....}
...........((.....*~_.......”=-._......“;,,./`..../”............../
...,,,___.`~,......“~.,....................`.....}............../
............(....`=-,,.......`........................(......;_,,-”
............/.`~,......`-...................................../
.............`~.*-,.....................................|,./.....,__
,,_..........}.>-._...................................|..............`=~-,
.....`=~-,__......`,.................................
...................`=~-,,.,...............................
................................`:,,...........................`..............__
.....................................`=-,...................,%`>--==``
........................................_..........._,-%.......`
...................................,<`.._|_,-&``................`


Enjoy!


I was actually not being genuine from the moment I first responded to Parokki. The last sentence of that post should have been a dead give away. You still took the bait... hook, line, and sinker.

Haha, classic.  See you're losing an argument?  See you've got no where to go?  Chalk it all up to sarcasm and blame the other poster for not noticing how your serious post with a very nonsarcastic style was so obviously supposed to be sarcastic.  I believe this tactic is known as red herring, the goal being to distract from the intial argument.

 



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Is that the new Tarantino film? lol.



">Words Of Wisdom said:
I was actually not being genuine from the moment I first responded to Parokki. The last sentence of that post should have been a dead give away. You still took the bait... hook, line, and sinker.


At some point in the conversation you turned into a troll but your initial response was clearly serious. Claiming otherwise pretty much invalidates any claim of "JUST FOOLIN ROFL!" and is tantamount to admitting that you backed out of mounting a serious defense because you knew you were going to lose.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

tarheel91 said:

Haha, classic. See you're losing an argument? See you've got no where to go? Chalk it all up to sarcasm and blame the other poster for not noticing how your serious post with a very nonsarcastic style was so obviously supposed to be sarcastic. I believe this tactic is known as red herring, the goal being to distract from the intial argument.

Okay, let's go over this slowly.

1) My responses became disingenuine when Parokki asked a question about southern climatic changes. I originally typed the post up to have the rain dance part as a larger section of the post but decided a more sincere looking response would better suit what I believe to be a very silly question in itself. For that reason I also left out the smiley.

2) Put away the edu-penis you brought out with your post talking about your AP class. Taking a petty high school class does not in any way qualify you to speak on any matter in an expert sense or any other for that matter. In fact, knowing that is the limit of your knowledge hinders your credibility. I don't know how much you know about internet posting but you can never really know what the educational background of the person you are posting with is, short of them flat out telling you; bringing out your edu-penis is just asking to be shot down by someone with a bigger one. The fact that you consider me to be portraying Native Americans in a negative light when you yourself still refer to them as "Indians" likely shows that your knowledge is insufficient for an earnest discussion.

3) You fail at arguing. In every post in which you have referred to mine, you have assumed and inferred my position. In fact, all you've done is build strawman arguments based off of your inferences to which I've questioned. My position in this entire conversation has simply been that you do not understand my position whereas you have simply attacked my post continually attacking arguments I did not make (strawmen). You can easily see thus by the fact that I have not stated a position in any of my posts responding to yours nor defended any particular position. The idea that you have won anything but a fictitious argument you yourself imagined is beyond bizarre.

To illustrate what happened in a simpler manner:

Imagine that I find a basket ball on a court and shoot a basket. After which I sit down to relax. tarheel comes along and begins shooting baskets shouting "I'm winning. I'm winning!" Meanwhile I continuously ask him who he's playing against. After he's shot enough baskets he begins shouting "I beat you!" to me. At this point, my response is quite appropriately "I just shot a free throw earlier, I wasn't playing a game." tarheel can continue to shout and dance however the premise will remain absurd.

If I were seriously arguing anything, this thread would be very different.

Final-fan said:

At some point in the conversation you turned into a troll but your initial response was clearly serious. Claiming otherwise pretty much invalidates any claim of "JUST FOOLIN ROFL!" and is tantamount to admitting that you backed out of mounting a serious defense because you knew you were going to lose.


It wasn't a troll. I didn't expect a kid with an over sized edu-penis to attack my posts and build fictitious strawmen arguments with them. I mounted no serious defense because I maintained no serious position to defend.



Words Of Wisdom said:
tarheel91 said:

Haha, classic. See you're losing an argument? See you've got no where to go? Chalk it all up to sarcasm and blame the other poster for not noticing how your serious post with a very nonsarcastic style was so obviously supposed to be sarcastic. I believe this tactic is known as red herring, the goal being to distract from the intial argument.

Okay, let's go over this slowly.

1) My responses became disingenuine when Parokki asked a question about southern climatic changes. I originally typed the post up to have the rain dance part as a larger section of the post but decided a more sincere looking response would better suit what I believe to be a very silly question in itself. For that reason I also left out the smiley.

2) Put away the edu-penis you brought out with your post talking about your AP class. Taking a petty high school class does not in any way qualify you to speak on any matter in an expert sense or any other for that matter. In fact, knowing that is the limit of your knowledge hinders your credibility. I don't know how much you know about internet posting but you can never really know what the educational background of the person you are posting with is, short of them flat out telling you; bringing out your edu-penis is just asking to be shot down by someone with a bigger one. The fact that you consider me to be portraying Native Americans in a negative light when you yourself still refer to them as "Indians" likely shows that your knowledge is insufficient for an earnest discussion.

3) You fail at arguing. In every post in which you have referred to mine, you have assumed and inferred my position. In fact, all you've done is build strawman arguments based off of your inferences to which I've questioned. My position in this entire conversation has simply been that you do not understand my position whereas you have simply attacked my post continually attacking arguments I did not make (strawmen). You can easily see thus by the fact that I have not stated a position in any of my posts responding to yours nor defended any particular position. The idea that you have won anything but a fictitious argument you yourself imagined is beyond bizarre.

To illustrate what happened in a simpler manner:

Imagine that I find a basket ball on a court and shoot a basket. After which I sit down to relax. tarheel comes along and begins shooting baskets shouting "I'm winning. I'm winning!" Meanwhile I continuously ask him who he's playing against. After he's shot enough baskets he begins shouting "I beat you!" to me. At this point, my response is quite appropriately "I just shot a free throw earlier, I wasn't playing a game." tarheel can continue to shout and dance however the premise will remain absurd.

If I were seriously arguing anything, this thread would be very different.


First, I'd like to point out that I mentioned my educational credibility once, and that it wasn't even in relation to this.  I referenced it once because we were talking about a major climate change in NA, and wouldn't it make sense to have covered such a topic in either AP US History or AP Environmental Science?  I said I'd never seen it in said classes and that, as a result, I doubt it existed.  I then explained that we might have simply skipped over it in APES because I have an idiot teacher.

If you're such a masterful arguer, why are you attacking your opponent?  You should know that only makes you seem less credible.  Someone with any knowledge about arguing knows at least that much.

By the way, I know what a straw man argument is; the illustration was pretty useless.  You failed to apply it to any of my arguments.  You simply claimed I had done something of that sort.  Nice connection.



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I was actually not being genuine from the moment I first responded to Parokki. The last sentence of that post should have been a dead give away. You still took the bait... hook, line, and sinker.
(Boldface added)

It wasn't a troll.


I would suggest that you revisit the definition of "troll".

P.S. Are you still trolling? Because your responses have been so contradictory that I have trouble believing that such an articulate poster as yourself would put forth such an incoherent position.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
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My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
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I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom! 

Final-Fan said:
I was actually not being genuine from the moment I first responded to Parokki. The last sentence of that post should have been a dead give away. You still took the bait... hook, line, and sinker.
(Boldface added)

It wasn't a troll.


I would suggest that you revisit the definition of "troll".

P.S. Are you still trolling? Because your responses have been so contradictory that I have trouble believing that such an articulate poster as yourself would put forth such an incoherent position.

It wasn't meant start an argument per se, merely spark some amusing discussion which it was right up towards the end of it however it has soured rather quickly.  I have no interest in discussions which cease to be amusing.  Besides, were I trolling I wouldn't still be in this thread now would I?

tarheel91 said:

If you're such a masterful arguer, why are you attacking your opponent?  You should know that only makes you seem less credible.  Someone with any knowledge about arguing knows at least that much.

By the way, I know what a straw man argument is; the illustration was pretty useless.  You failed to apply it to any of my arguments.  You simply claimed I had done something of that sort.  Nice connection.



I'm attacking you because I'm not arguing anything at the moment.  I have yet to do so.  I have the sneaking suspicion I'm repeating myself though.  I wonder why...

I'm glad you know what a strawman argument is.  I'd be happy if you'd consider not making them. 



Final-Fan said:
I was actually not being genuine from the moment I first responded to Parokki. The last sentence of that post should have been a dead give away. You still took the bait... hook, line, and sinker.
(Boldface added)

It wasn't a troll.


I would suggest that you revisit the definition of "troll".

P.S. Are you still trolling? Because your responses have been so contradictory that I have trouble believing that such an articulate poster as yourself would put forth such an incoherent position.

Oh man, check out this movie:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSpCWJnnWVI



It wasn't meant start an argument per se, merely spark some amusing discussion which it was right up towards the end of it however it has soured rather quickly. I have no interest in discussions which cease to be amusing. Besides, were I trolling I wouldn't still be in this thread now would I?


1. You posted a statement of fact that you later claim you never believed was true, and you did this for the stated purpose of generating amusement for yourself via the outraged reactions of others. That fits the accepted definition of trolling pretty closely from where I sit. How do you define it differently so that it excludes what you've done here?

2. After your initial inflammatory post, you decline to directly rebut any of tarheel91's arguments, instead preferring to ask questions that imply that he misrepresented your previous position, while not clearly defining just what your position truly is. Also, conveniently (and troll-like), your technique makes tarheel91 do all the work.

3. Then, in your big rebuttal, you berate him for having "assumed and inferred [your] position" despite the fact that it's all he could do since you never once make an actual statement (not a question) except in your first post of the exchange which you state is a false representation of your beliefs. How could you possibly fault him for not reading your mind correctly, especially if you begin with a lie?

3a. You say that you never defended any particular position, but this is disingenuous.
"How did I make it seem like that by commenting on the climate?" clearly implies denial that your post made such a claim.
"Did I state anywhere in my post that the settlers did not cause the Native Americans any problems?" clearly implies that your posts did not make such a claim.

3b. Your entire participation in the exchange reminded me of a twisted Socratic method, wherein you ask leading questions to maximize the response tarheel91 gives you while not directly advancing any arguments yourself. This is classic troll behavior.

It wasn't meant start an argument per se, merely spark some amusing discussion which it was right up towards the end of it however it has soured rather quickly. I have no interest in discussions which cease to be amusing. Besides, were I trolling I wouldn't still be in this thread now would I?


5. I have established that you either defended or pretended to defend a statement that -- in your own words -- you made, insincerely, for your personal amusement, that amusement being your sole motivation for participating in the exchange. Again, this is a textbook example of trolling.

6. The troll remains in the thread until the reason for his trolling (in your case, personal amusement) is gone. I presume that although the original discussion has lost its entertainment value, this current discussion of the discussion does entertain you. I suppose that means I shouldn't be posting this in that case, but I guess I'm just a sucker for a debate.



Tag (courtesy of fkusumot): "Please feel free -- nay, I encourage you -- to offer rebuttal."
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
My advice to fanboys: Brag about stuff that's true, not about stuff that's false. Predict stuff that's likely, not stuff that's unlikely. You will be happier, and we will be happier.

"Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not his own facts." - Sen. Pat Moynihan
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The old smileys: ; - ) : - ) : - ( : - P : - D : - # ( c ) ( k ) ( y ) If anyone knows the shortcut for , let me know!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
I have the most epic death scene ever in VGChartz Mafia.  Thanks WordsofWisdom!