I'm sorry if both of you feel offended but we are talking about a real issue here that propelled many people not to buy a 360 due to the RoD issue. We're discussing those numbers, guess where, on a sales website.

If you don't feel like posting anything useful don't post at all.

Also, there's negative threads everywhere.

One question I had was why don't people ever use modified versions of the attach ratio instead of the most often-used lifetime software sales divided by lifetime hardware sales?  I think dividing a particular year's software sales by the lifetime hardware sales shows current trends in user base purchasing, much more than what the lifetime attach ratio can show.

For example, let's look at just this year's current software sales so far.  Currently, VGChartz has lifetime PS3 hardware sales at 37,864,891.  Meanwhile, 2010 software sales for the PS3 is 65,812,638.  If you apply the attach ratio for the total amount of lifetime hardware divided by this year's software sales, you get a 2010 PS3 attach rate of 1.738.

In contrast, Microsoft's lifetime hardware sales is at 43,531,641, while currently their 2010 software sales are at 66,995,728.  Applying the attach ratio to these numbers results in a 2010 attach rate of 1.539.

If you look only at software sales for this year so far, the numbers between PS3 and Xbox 360 sales are VERY CLOSE.   In the end, I think current software sales trends provide enormous insight into how big each console's active user base actually are.  I guess my point is, instead of wondering how many of each console are replacements, simply look at software sales to take a guess at how big each user base is (at least as far as spending habits is concerned).

A lot of the negative 360 come from you.

Also people with modded 360's can easily get it fixed, x-clamp fix and some solder.

0. People send the console to warranty and that number doesnt count as unit sold... people who think otherwise FAIL at life and are dumb as hell...

But if Console gives RRoD and u have no Warranty u need to buy another and that count as shipped/Sold to Consumer.

People can't discuss some facts without being negative. Its not my fault that the damn thing overheats and causes an internet sensation and massive losses to a certain company.

I didn't know about that x-clamp fix though....

interesting discussion to bad your "friend" had to send you a fake moderation PM

i dont think there really are alot out there that are MS replacements since they didnt really replace many, they would send you back a fix console either yours or some else's

what you have to account for are all the people that didnt send theres in after they broke b/c maybe they have several times already and got fed up and bought a new console from the store or that there warranty ended and didnt bother with MS and re bought from the store

you also have to think of the new 360 250gb on how many of those are rebuys sure you can say the same for sony slim but the ps3 slim was really a downgrade to many people no shinny/less visual appeal, no OS at the time, slower bluray drive ect

as to your question the real number of 360 out there or in other words the current real active user base idk but its defiantly not 43M or even 40M i would assume less than 40M more than 30M

Damn i never knew the FR was 42% and that 55% had theres break again

I really do think its irrelevent, as if you are trying to make it a comparison, with the ps3's 1 year warranty and other factors, they all balance out.

What I think is a lotttt greater question is the true % for the RRoD error and how it is obtained.  It is mentioned in this discussion that 43% is the fail ratio...now I've seen numbers all over the place...so I wonder...is this 43% simply saying that 43% of customers have had their console fail, or is estimating the total # of fails divided by the total number of consoles.  I may be completely off, but if you took the total number of fails divided by the total number of consoles, you would probably be approaching 100%...which does not infer every console fails, but rather there have been an average of 1 failure per customer, per se.

So many people are saying that the sales figures did not include consoles refurbished by Microsoft. They say the units weren't shipped to retailers. Well I had a friend who replaced his 360 twice actually going to the store due to the early warranty. Before it became a three year RROD warranty. I also know friends who purchased extended warranties through Best Buy and FutureShop and those retail outlets replaced them, meaning the units were shipped to retailers.

Infact I only know one friend who's 360 hasn't RROD and even his red ringed once but then worked fine so who knows what happened.

I suspect Microsoft now fixes every unit that gets RROD within 3 years, but what about all the units sold before they extended the warranty. Or all the retail warranties like Best Buy and Future Shop who replace RROD units?

I myself bought a 360 Slim and got a three year BestBuy warranty on it so that if it ever breaks down I don't have to go through Microsoft.

I could try to guess but it probubly wouldn't be that close. Who knows how many units were simply bought as replacements!

When it's done repatatively, and by a member who obviously dislikes the company he/she is trying to bash, well it gets old, real fast, and it is considered trolling by most, especially when it is done consistantly.

As far as replacement at the store level...I had a friend who worked as a manager for Bestbuy and a few yrs back he said many 360's were replaced under their own in-house warranty- which they did send back these units to be repaired. So they dont count as a sale, but BestBuy did make money off selling their own warranties.. Also, they did replace a few 360's to some people as a customer service issue on rare occasions.  First, replacements dont count as sales!  The defective product is taken and sent back RMA if possible which means basically the store will receive another 360 later from the depot to replace it once the depot receives the defective unit within manufacturer warranty.. As it was not sold but exchanged and it is registered at a POS station with a code to show RMA exchange on the store side.  This is not a sale.. its giving a new product off the shelf for free (-1 console ) and taking a bad one sent back RMA and getting a replacement later ( 1) to take its place .. This is a even swap if everything is done right...  If the RMA was taken under false pretenses or done incorrectly the store takes a complete loss, but this is typically because the store didnt have the paper work right or the authority to replace the merchandise in question. 

Concerning replacement at the manufactuerer level: Doesnt matter if its Sony, Nintendo, or MS ..  most consoles are repaired, not replaced as there is a financial loss - but not as much as total console replacement obviously.  MS had increased the manufacturer warranty of the 360 to three years - something unheard of in any console warranty - because they knew they had to back a real issue with  repairs done at their expense.  Anyone, including the author of this post who beleives a manufacturer can legally report replacements as a "sale" and "net gain" to their bottom line doesn't undertand how absurd that actually is.  A replaced console is a "loss" and hits the bottom line of any company much like "Shrink" ( theft ) does as a store level.. Eventually this hits the quarterly reports and losses are reported along side of the gains. 

And even if you throw all that out and say in your pretend world that they did count as sales, you have to realize the majority of RROD 360's were never replaced, but repaired at a great loss ..as for a couple years MS paid priority shipping on as many as 15 million consoles ( a total loss ) and covered those consoles for 3years from time of sale... MS also payed alot out by  increasing the number of repair facilities, hiring more personnel and utilities, taxes on land.. If this had happened to Sony it would've bankrupted them... As far as "replacements" ( done with exchange - so this isnt a sale ) I've read MS replaced around 2 million consoles as customer service PublicRelations for people who had sent their consoles in multiple times ( like 3 or more times).. so no sale there.. and again- the faulty console was still taken back by the depot in the majority of cases ..this hit MS's financial loss category which can be seen in their reports more so then.. As the last 2-3 years they have reported a profit as failures have decreased shaprly and of course with slimline 360 its been virtually non existant..

The XB 360 was around 8 million ahead anywhere before the 'peak' of these repairs and replacements hit.. if anything the whole RROD caused people to stop buying 360's which is one reason Sony was able to close the gap for awhile down to around 4.5 million .. I think the new slimline 360 is reversing that somewhat.. right now PS3's might be getting a slight boost from casual gamer sales due to 'Move' and I expect MS will get a similar boost from Kinect in Nov which would boost 360 sales more since holidays is typically their season to shine.  Either way I dont either will make much difference this Gen..

If sales were actually inflated on 360 they would have one of the most "incredible attachment rates" as they are pretty far ahead of Sony in the software sold category:

PS3 source data: http://www.vgchartz.com/worldtotals.php?name=&publisher=&console=PS3&genre=&minSales=0&results=1000&sort=Total

Xbox 360 source data: http://www.vgchartz.com/worldtotals.php?name=&publisher=&console=X360&genre=&minSales=0&results=1000&sort=Total

Lets not forget how many years the XB 360 was under-reported in sales in areas like Scandinavia! Anyone who thinks any console, including the Wii can't be under-reported is fooling themselves.. it happens to all console in some markets..