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Forums - General - What's your point of view in the Hiroshima and Nagasaki atomic bomb?

c03n3nj0 said:

Japan was really not intending to surrender. At all. The only other option was to invade Japan, but that would've causted thousands of lives on both sides, especially for Japanese civilians.

The U.S had no option but to use the nukes.

And besides, the point that there were no millitary bases and it was just for bombing civilians is not true.

Hiroshima had the head quarter of Japan's second army and was a communication center n' all that.

As for Nagasaki, they were extremely unlucky. Kokura was the original target, but most of the city was covered by clouds and it got in the way of the bombing, so they just bombed Nagasaki instead.

I agree that the nuke was a horrible thing, but it was necessary to end World War II. It really is basically being between a rock and a hard thing.

Yeah lucky they dropped the bombs so not thousands of people would  lose their life..



 

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Lostplanet22 said:
c03n3nj0 said:

Japan was really not intending to surrender. At all. The only other option was to invade Japan, but that would've causted thousands of lives on both sides, especially for Japanese civilians.

The U.S had no option but to use the nukes.

And besides, the point that there were no millitary bases and it was just for bombing civilians is not true.

Hiroshima had the head quarter of Japan's second army and was a communication center n' all that.

As for Nagasaki, they were extremely unlucky. Kokura was the original target, but most of the city was covered by clouds and it got in the way of the bombing, so they just bombed Nagasaki instead.

I agree that the nuke was a horrible thing, but it was necessary to end World War II. It really is basically being between a rock and a hard thing.

Yeah lucky they dropped the bombs so not thousands of people would not lose their life..

....you're intentionally not getting the point it seems. -_-

A U.S invasion of Japan would've been more costly on both sides than the two atomic bombs dropped on them.

Like said before, they estimated a million lives would've been lost. How many of those do you think would've been civilians? Many more than were actually killed on the bombings. 



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non-gravity said:
NunedQ said:

i hope everyone agrees that the second one was unnecessary. The threat of a second would have worked just as well...


Japan was unwilling to surrender under US terms.

I believe the Japanese emperor wanted to remain in power.

That is correct. Capitulation talks had been going on for quite a while. The key problem was the status of the japanese emperor (as actual "god" to the Japanese at that time).

I recently saw a documentary where they interviewed the guy that survived the Hiroshima bomb. Without any infrastruture left, he (amongst others) was immediately evacuated to a hospital in  ..... Nagasaki. Talk about bad luck..



what I ask you is how many AMERICAN CIVILIANS did the japanese kill? then compare that to the number of JAPANESE CIVILIANS americans killed with the bomb. to see who the was the biggest monster? Please understand I am under NO CIRCUMSTANCE trying to justify what the japanese did in pearl harbor because that was terrible too, but there is a huge difference here and if you think about it you may see it, the japanese attacked a military base. the military know that if there is war there is a chance that they may die and they are trained speacially for that. Instead who did america attack? the children who were in schools, moms that were cooking, people INNOCENT people doing regular things, now you may try to justify this and say that it was neccesary, but the tought of what was done and the consequences make me sick. Let me put it this way, if your watch on the news that someone got into a school a killed lets say 10 5 year old kids you would probably be repulsed by the idea but america did even worse. and to the people that think that 300,000 was nothing compared to the amounts of deaths in the war, is your life not a big deal? or you family´s life? every life is unique and irreplasible. just 1 person dead would be a terrible crime. Now if america had killed 300,00 japanese soldiers I wouldnt mind so much because as I said soldiers are trained for just that, but what they did cannot be forgotten. Now, were the japanse good? Hell no, they killed millions of chinese and tortured thousands too, and were just as bad if not worse than the nazis. I guess what I´m trying to say that everyone in war is a monsters too because war brings the worst in people. picture this. the USSR were the first to get to berlin and they saved many jews, but they were just as bad, they raped thousands of german women and killed many. Back to the topic I dont there is any justification to attack the innocent, the americans were just as bad as the others because they didnt attack the military but the innocent. and that is just unforgivable.

Now you may satinize my comments if you want

 



there were worse things that happened and the US warned people to leave the towns.



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c0rd said:
Pimp3k said:
oldschoolfool said:
forest-spirit said:

Of course it's a crime. Massacring hundreds of thousands is a severe crime no matter your intentions.



It was a neccessary evil. War itself should be a crime. Nobody wishes for these things.

There is no such thing as "necessary evil". There is simply evil or god. Calling something as necessary evil will not justify it. It was maybe necessary from your point of view because your American. But intentional killing of millions civilians is nothing more and nothing else then genocide.

It didn't kill millions of civilians. (though it killed quite a lot...)

However, million(s) of people probably would have died if it weren't dropped. Do you consider this alternative to be "good?"

OK half a million.

War is a bad thing and about what would have happened if the A-bombs were never dropped we can now only speculate. People do ugly things in wars but there is a limit to everything. Mass murder is a crime, thats a fact.

As my war experience is quite fresh (Yugoslav Wars '91-'95) ill share few things with you. Every side did what they thought it was necessary. As a result of that was half a million people displaced, mine fields thruout Croatia and Bosnia (that are not yet cleared and every year several children still dies because of them), mass graves as a result of mass executions of war prisoners, Ovcara massacre,  Srebrenica genocide... just to mention a few. Every side did what they thought was necessary but that does not mean it was a right thing to do, or a good thing to do.

 

Everyone that thinks that A-Bombs were necessary evil should read "Sadako will leben by Karl Bruckner (eng The day of the bomb).

 

 



MrBubbles said:

there were worse things that happened and the US warned people to leave the towns.


So I guess that justifies it then



c03n3nj0 said:
Lostplanet22 said:
c03n3nj0 said:

Japan was really not intending to surrender. At all. The only other option was to invade Japan, but that would've causted thousands of lives on both sides, especially for Japanese civilians.

The U.S had no option but to use the nukes.

And besides, the point that there were no millitary bases and it was just for bombing civilians is not true.

Hiroshima had the head quarter of Japan's second army and was a communication center n' all that.

As for Nagasaki, they were extremely unlucky. Kokura was the original target, but most of the city was covered by clouds and it got in the way of the bombing, so they just bombed Nagasaki instead.

I agree that the nuke was a horrible thing, but it was necessary to end World War II. It really is basically being between a rock and a hard thing.

Yeah lucky they dropped the bombs so not thousands of people would not lose their life..

....you're intentionally not getting the point it seems. -_-

A U.S invasion of Japan would've been more costly on both sides than the two atomic bombs dropped on them.

Like said before, they estimated a million lives would've been lost. How many of those do you think would've been civilians? Many more than were actually killed on the bombings.

Their is not really proof of it. Except that it would be more costly on USA side. 



 

hallowedbeeddie said:
MrBubbles said:

there were worse things that happened and the US warned people to leave the towns.


So I guess that justifies it then

Ofcourse, Terrorists warned USA civilians aswell still they stayed in USA.;..those people in the WTC towers asked for it X_X.



 

It's actually interesting what it brought forth, it made Japan the leader in the anti-atomic movement, but more interestingly Japan also made itself the only country that truly knows what Armageddon is. Little Boy and Fat Man is the indirect cause to story's like Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind and Akira. It's why Armageddon story's are so common in Japan. It's also why a movie like Blade Runner has a Japanese setting. In a way September 6 - 08:15 has been a reset button for Japan. The new year zero if you will. From that point on Japan changed rapidly. Many then saw the atomic bombing as the point were Japan needed drastic change, of course also spurred by the American occupying the country for several years. But is was not only the American who thought Japan needed the change many Japanese themselves felt so.

On the subject itself, I think it was necessary evil, and yes it does exist. Even in Japan itself many see it that way. Not only did it end the War it also ended the Military Dictatorship. It's also the reason Japan doesn't really blame America, they don't point fingers at them. They just acknowledge nuclear weapons are horrible and should never be used again.