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Forums - General - Decline and fall of the US.

Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:

I really hope the US doesn't collapse. Sure I have my critisisms of it, but I could never stand a country like china being the world leader, it would scare the shit out of me.


I just think their will be nothing like a world leader...in fact I really don't know what you worry about?


What I meant by world leader was more like when people say "market leader"


Ah I think China will not be it for long though (India is coming up aswell and with their population growth;..) An interesting future that is for sure...Three new imporant markets China/india/Brazil...will Europe be like an new middle east?,  will USA found a way to pay their debts, what about Japan? etc;.

When you say it like that, it does seem like the future could be interresting. Maybe, there will be 4 superpowers instead of just 1.

What I find more interresting though, is what's going to happen to Mars when it gets colonized. Is it going to get split between countries, or getting its own management. Will there ever be a war between planets?



I LOVE ICELAND!

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It's the tax cuts and the wars, and then the bailouts because of the irresponsible financial sector. All of that was under Bush II. Although the mechanism for tax cuts, wars, and deregulation goes all the way back to nixon and even further.

If not for the tax cuts and the wars we'd be in much better shape than we are now. None of this is here nor there, we are still in better shape than most countries. We will remain _flat_ in growth for a period, which is fine imo, and will allow other countries to catch up. Which is what we want in the end, a relatively equal world.

One can even hope that the top 1% owning 90% of americas wealth (and consequently also a greater share of the worlds wealth) will also shift to a much more respectable number.



A warrior keeps death on the mind from the moment of their first breath to the moment of their last.



KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:

I really hope the US doesn't collapse. Sure I have my critisisms of it, but I could never stand a country like china being the world leader, it would scare the shit out of me.


I just think their will be nothing like a world leader...in fact I really don't know what you worry about?


What I meant by world leader was more like when people say "market leader"


Ah I think China will not be it for long though (India is coming up aswell and with their population growth;..) An interesting future that is for sure...Three new imporant markets China/india/Brazil...will Europe be like an new middle east?,  will USA found a way to pay their debts, what about Japan? etc;.

When you say it like that, it does seem like the future could be interresting. Maybe, there will be 4 superpowers instead of just 1.

What I find more interresting though, is what's going to happen to Mars when it gets colonized. Is it going to get split between countries, or getting its own management. Will there ever be a war between planets?

Four superpowers would be far more stable.

You know, mars is a dead rock, much like the moon. It can't support live. There's nothing we can do about that.

 



In the wilderness we go alone with our new knowledge and strength.

Stefan.De.Machtige said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:

I really hope the US doesn't collapse. Sure I have my critisisms of it, but I could never stand a country like china being the world leader, it would scare the shit out of me.


I just think their will be nothing like a world leader...in fact I really don't know what you worry about?


What I meant by world leader was more like when people say "market leader"


Ah I think China will not be it for long though (India is coming up aswell and with their population growth;..) An interesting future that is for sure...Three new imporant markets China/india/Brazil...will Europe be like an new middle east?,  will USA found a way to pay their debts, what about Japan? etc;.

When you say it like that, it does seem like the future could be interresting. Maybe, there will be 4 superpowers instead of just 1.

What I find more interresting though, is what's going to happen to Mars when it gets colonized. Is it going to get split between countries, or getting its own management. Will there ever be a war between planets?

Four superpowers would be far more stable.

You know, mars is a dead rock, much like the moon. It can't support live. There's nothing we can do about that.

 


There are lots of stuff we can do about that, it's not viable to try terraforming at the moment though. Until then it's always possible to create pressurized greenhouses and just build any structures so that the air doesn't get out. Mars has plenty of raw materials, and supplies from earth could sustain a small population.



I LOVE ICELAND!

KungKras said:
Stefan.De.Machtige said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:

I really hope the US doesn't collapse. Sure I have my critisisms of it, but I could never stand a country like china being the world leader, it would scare the shit out of me.


I just think their will be nothing like a world leader...in fact I really don't know what you worry about?


What I meant by world leader was more like when people say "market leader"


Ah I think China will not be it for long though (India is coming up aswell and with their population growth;..) An interesting future that is for sure...Three new imporant markets China/india/Brazil...will Europe be like an new middle east?,  will USA found a way to pay their debts, what about Japan? etc;.

When you say it like that, it does seem like the future could be interresting. Maybe, there will be 4 superpowers instead of just 1.

What I find more interresting though, is what's going to happen to Mars when it gets colonized. Is it going to get split between countries, or getting its own management. Will there ever be a war between planets?

Four superpowers would be far more stable.

You know, mars is a dead rock, much like the moon. It can't support live. There's nothing we can do about that.

 


There are lots of stuff we can do about that, it's not viable to try terraforming at the moment though. Until then it's always possible to create pressurized greenhouses and just build any structures so that the air doesn't get out. Mars has plenty of raw materials, and supplies from earth could sustain a small population.

Mars can never become a earth-like planet. It's core is dead, and it has no stabilising moon - let alone a schield against the suns' radiation. It has huge duststorms, and very little water.

To build something on Mars, you need a reason to spend huge, and huge, amounts of money. There really isn't one, that's why we never build a base on the moon. Hugely expensive for so, so little gain.

 



In the wilderness we go alone with our new knowledge and strength.

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zgamer5 said:
richardhutnik said:
zgamer5 said:

wow i never thought that the bush administration was that bad.

During that era, supporters of the administration justified deficits by saying, "But we are at war".  Now that the administration isn't in power, there is harping about the deficit, and apparently thew U.S is no long at war.  Go figure.


and the banks giving loans to everyone didnt help. i really wonder how bush got elected twice.

America was in trouble long before Bush. America has been going down hill since the 70's. What every President has done is focus of short term gain while letting future generation carry the burden. Guess what, That future generation has arrived.



Stefan.De.Machtige said:
KungKras said:
Stefan.De.Machtige said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:
Lostplanet22 said:
KungKras said:

I really hope the US doesn't collapse. Sure I have my critisisms of it, but I could never stand a country like china being the world leader, it would scare the shit out of me.


I just think their will be nothing like a world leader...in fact I really don't know what you worry about?


What I meant by world leader was more like when people say "market leader"


Ah I think China will not be it for long though (India is coming up aswell and with their population growth;..) An interesting future that is for sure...Three new imporant markets China/india/Brazil...will Europe be like an new middle east?,  will USA found a way to pay their debts, what about Japan? etc;.

When you say it like that, it does seem like the future could be interresting. Maybe, there will be 4 superpowers instead of just 1.

What I find more interresting though, is what's going to happen to Mars when it gets colonized. Is it going to get split between countries, or getting its own management. Will there ever be a war between planets?

Four superpowers would be far more stable.

You know, mars is a dead rock, much like the moon. It can't support live. There's nothing we can do about that.

 


There are lots of stuff we can do about that, it's not viable to try terraforming at the moment though. Until then it's always possible to create pressurized greenhouses and just build any structures so that the air doesn't get out. Mars has plenty of raw materials, and supplies from earth could sustain a small population.

Mars can never become a earth-like planet. It's core is dead, and it has no stabilising moon - let alone a schield against the suns' radiation. It has huge duststorms, and very little water.

To build something on Mars, you need a reason to spend huge, and huge, amounts of money. There really isn't one, that's why we never build a base on the moon. Hugely expensive for so, so little gain.

 

We don't really know if the core is completely dead, only that a huge meteorite impact stopped it from spinning and generating a magnetic field that could keep the solar wind away, and thus the planet's water was blown away by the solar wind.

If it turns out that Mars has a liquid core, perhaps in some way altering the course of one of its moons and making it collide with the other to combine into one big moon that could have the same effect as the earth's moon on the earth's core. Or maybe some fancy large-scale magnetic field generators will be invented in the future. And then, the solar wind problem would be gone.

And, Mars would only need to be able to sustain itself for colonization to be a good idea, dead rock or not. Since humand are experts at altering the enviroment we live in, a self sustaining society on mars isn't an impossible idea, the amount of energy from the sun that reaches mars' surface is close to the amount on earth, so solar power is a viable option for energy, and ther is still frozen water on the planet.. A small self-sustaining society could grow, and maybe one day, Mars could have a big population. Starting such a colony is maybe too expensive today, but as tech becomes cheaper...

Sorry for the long response, it's just that I have given this subject a lot of thought before :P



I LOVE ICELAND!

KungKras said:
Stefan.De.Machtige said:
KungKras said:
Stefan.De.Machtige said:

Four superpowers would be far more stable.

You know, mars is a dead rock, much like the moon. It can't support live. There's nothing we can do about that.

 


There are lots of stuff we can do about that, it's not viable to try terraforming at the moment though. Until then it's always possible to create pressurized greenhouses and just build any structures so that the air doesn't get out. Mars has plenty of raw materials, and supplies from earth could sustain a small population.

Mars can never become a earth-like planet. It's core is dead, and it has no stabilising moon - let alone a schield against the suns' radiation. It has huge duststorms, and very little water.

To build something on Mars, you need a reason to spend huge, and huge, amounts of money. There really isn't one, that's why we never build a base on the moon. Hugely expensive for so, so little gain.

 

We don't really know if the core is completely dead, only that a huge meteorite impact stopped it from spinning and generating a magnetic field that could keep the solar wind away, and thus the planet's water was blown away by the solar wind.

If it turns out that Mars has a liquid core, perhaps in some way altering the course of one of its moons and making it collide with the other to combine into one big moon that could have the same effect as the earth's moon on the earth's core. Or maybe some fancy large-scale magnetic field generators will be invented in the future. And then, the solar wind problem would be gone.

And, Mars would only need to be able to sustain itself for colonization to be a good idea, dead rock or not. Since humand are experts at altering the enviroment we live in, a self sustaining society on mars isn't an impossible idea, the amount of energy from the sun that reaches mars' surface is close to the amount on earth, so solar power is a viable option for energy, and ther is still frozen water on the planet.. A small self-sustaining society could grow, and maybe one day, Mars could have a big population. Starting such a colony is maybe too expensive today, but as tech becomes cheaper...

Sorry for the long response, it's just that I have given this subject a lot of thought before :P

They scanned the field and found only small pockets left. Mere remnants. And I don't remember reading about any  record of tectonic activity on mars. The core seems dead... or dying.

About creating a moon for mars, that could work. I didn't think about it like that. Lot's of work though.  

In order too generated an artificial field like you say, they would have to make cold fusion in a huge way - If it's possible and practical. What else can generate that kind of power?  That would be expensive.

I like to think about space and stuff too. But i'm more cynical about it. IMO manned space-exploration is useless. Robots are the future astronauts. Go robot.

In the long run man can't leave earth. He needs earth's ecosystem and that can't be replicated - or at least not in good enough terms. Not in a ship, and certainly not on a planet. It's a fun idea, but it doesn't work. It's sad.



In the wilderness we go alone with our new knowledge and strength.

badgenome said:
richardhutnik said:
zgamer5 said:

wow i never thought that the bush administration was that bad.

During that era, supporters of the administration justified deficits by saying, "But we are at war".  Now that the administration isn't in power, there is harping about the deficit, and apparently thew U.S is no long at war.  Go figure.

And opponents of the administration, like Paul Krugman, criticized deficits. But now that the administration isn't in power, deficits are a Good Thing. Go figure.

Take that as proof that no one really cares about them.  The particular reason why you would take the GOP and conservative side to task more is that balanced budgets ARE supposed to be one of their foundational points they stood on.



dharh said:

One can even hope that the top 1% owning 90% of americas wealth (and consequently also a greater share of the worlds wealth) will also shift to a much more respectable number.


That figure is inaccurate.  Do some research on this.  The top 1% does own more wealth than the bottom 80% together, but not what you said.