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Forums - General - French Parliament Votes To Ban The Burka

Carl on 13 July 2010
SciFiBoy said:
Carl2291 said:

No. Not because i "don't like them". I didn't say that at all. I gave perfect reasons.

And as for the "and finding rare cases where poeple use them to commit a crime is stupid, I can easily do the same for hoodies and such." Go ahead. I don't care. I was only using it to show that it isn't just Muslim women who wear them. For all you know, Bin Laden could have walked past you in the street just Yesterday... The same goes for everyone else in the thread.

Oh, and you're the one being pathetic. You're trying to find the littlest little thing so you can play the racist card again. Get a grip.

The Burka (or however you spell the damn thing) is made to cover your entire face, baring the eyes, while you walk around in the street or work, doing day to day things. It hides your identity. End of. Do you support the supposed "ID Card" thing that was (or is?) going to happen here? Would you agree that Millions of those ID cards will have the exact same "face" on them?

The things you pointed out as should be banned, all have uses beneficial to the person wearing them, and even people around them in some cases (I'm looking at you, Bike Helmet and Internet). Paper bag is just "pathetic". The Burka... Doesn't. If anything it creates a problem for the vast majority of people around them. Especially nowadays with the Taliban and bomb scares...

And i fully agree with the quote posted in this thread. When in Rome...

Get over it. The Burka being kept as legal doesn't even benefit you...


I oppose ID Cards...

thats debatable, what benefit does wearing a hoodie give you? non medical plastic surgery? IM rather than phone?

"when in rome" is stupid, so if I go to a city known for rape, should I rape people too?

so what? im not allowed to care about peoples rights unless they affect me? thats stupid.

Fair enough.

A hoodie keeps you warm. Non Medical Plastic surgery... Way too many details to be bothered with even starting an arguement on that one, but even then... The chances are it's recorded with before and after shots, with details on the person having it done. IM rather than phone?... What?

It's only stupid if you are looking at it from a stupid point of view. "if I go to a city known for rape, should I rape people too" Is 100% a STUPID point of view.

People have a right to not be scared of being blown up by some terrorist hiding his face under a Burka in there own country. Doesn't seem you care too much about THOSE peoples rights though...

If France votes to not want the Burka. It's French people's RIGHTS to not want it. If i wanted to walk naked in public, it would be my right to do so. But i wouldn't be allowed. This is no different IMO...



                            

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Packie on 13 July 2010
Kantor said:
SciFiBoy said:
Kantor said:

Some people don't seem to be getting this:

France is a secular country. Completely secular. Religious Education cannot be taught in school or university. Pupils may not wear religious symbols of any kind, from any religion, to school. No Burqas, no crosses, no Kirpans, no Kippahs.

This is not intended to persecute Muslims. This is intended to preserve the non-religious atmosphere of France, and to prevent against discrimination more than anything else.


as I understand it, the Burka has nothing to do with their religion, its a cultural thing.

and teaching RE is fine, so long as its not biased.

It has everything to do with the Islamic religion. It is a symbol of Islam.

RE will always be biased, that's the thing. You're not going to have an atheist teaching RE, so the teacher will be of a certain religion (in Britain/France, most probably Christianity). Also, separation of church and state, and all that. Religion has no place in an institution of learning based on scientific proof.

Actually, the Burka and hijab existed way before Islam was created. A lot of the arabian tribes in the region had women wearing burka signifying that they're from the upper/wealthy classes and women who didn't wear burka/hijab were considered from the lower class or slaves. You can argue that the burka became part of islam because the cultural integration that happened at that time. What I'm trying to say is that islam didn't create the whole burka phenomenon. it existed way before it. ScifiBoy is right it is in a way a cultural thing.



Pyro as Bill on 13 July 2010

"People have a right to not be scared of being blown up by some terrorist hiding his face under a Burka in there own country."

No they don't.

"People have a right to not be scared of being blown up by some terrorist hiding his face under a Burka in there own country."

You're right, they do.

 

Seems a lot of English people have no idea what their rights actually are and are not.



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

Lostplanet22 on 13 July 2010
SciFiBoy said:
Lostplanet22 said:

Must say that I don't totally not agree with the 'when in Rome' aswell...

But their must be an minimum of integration though....


intergration to what exactly?

following laws, sure, but what else?


Learn the language, know that people are equal (women who want to divorce can do this, children who want to quit the religion have the right do that and even marry someone from else religion, homosexualty is allowed here, freedom of speech, know that you don't have the right to vote the first five years, etc (so much)...

^ That is what I had to learn at an integration school... For me they should also let new immigrants sign a contract (in their native language) that they agree with all of it...

If those immigrants get caught in a problem (like beating up homosexuals or jews) they should know that they have a risk to get send back to country of origin...(After 5 years of staying in the country it should be impossible the send them back)




 

SciFiBoy on 13 July 2010
Carl2291 said:
SciFiBoy said:
Carl2291 said:

No. Not because i "don't like them". I didn't say that at all. I gave perfect reasons.

And as for the "and finding rare cases where poeple use them to commit a crime is stupid, I can easily do the same for hoodies and such." Go ahead. I don't care. I was only using it to show that it isn't just Muslim women who wear them. For all you know, Bin Laden could have walked past you in the street just Yesterday... The same goes for everyone else in the thread.

Oh, and you're the one being pathetic. You're trying to find the littlest little thing so you can play the racist card again. Get a grip.

The Burka (or however you spell the damn thing) is made to cover your entire face, baring the eyes, while you walk around in the street or work, doing day to day things. It hides your identity. End of. Do you support the supposed "ID Card" thing that was (or is?) going to happen here? Would you agree that Millions of those ID cards will have the exact same "face" on them?

The things you pointed out as should be banned, all have uses beneficial to the person wearing them, and even people around them in some cases (I'm looking at you, Bike Helmet and Internet). Paper bag is just "pathetic". The Burka... Doesn't. If anything it creates a problem for the vast majority of people around them. Especially nowadays with the Taliban and bomb scares...

And i fully agree with the quote posted in this thread. When in Rome...

Get over it. The Burka being kept as legal doesn't even benefit you...


I oppose ID Cards...

thats debatable, what benefit does wearing a hoodie give you? non medical plastic surgery? IM rather than phone?

"when in rome" is stupid, so if I go to a city known for rape, should I rape people too?

so what? im not allowed to care about peoples rights unless they affect me? thats stupid.

Fair enough.

A hoodie keeps you warm. Non Medical Plastic surgery... Way too many details to be bothered with even starting an arguement on that one, but even then... The chances are it's recorded with before and after shots, with details on the person having it done. IM rather than phone?... What?

It's only stupid if you are looking at it from a stupid point of view. "if I go to a city known for rape, should I rape people too" Is 100% a STUPID point of view.

People have a right to not be scared of being blown up by some terrorist hiding his face under a Burka in there own country. Doesn't seem you care too much about THOSE peoples rights though...

If France votes to not want the Burka. It's French people's RIGHTS to not want it. If i wanted to walk naked in public, it would be my right to do so. But i wouldn't be allowed. This is no different IMO...


1) you can buy clothes that keep you warm with no hoods on them...
2) plastic surgery for non medical reasons is only done for shallow selfish reasons, its also altering how you look, so could easily be used by criminals.
3) you said people should be able to see the face of who they talk too, with IM or Phone, or whatever, you cant do that.
4) how is it stupid? its the exact same logic as you are using, just taken to the logical conclusion.
5) no-one else mentioned terrorism? this seems like your poorly disguised islamophobia and that you think they are all terrorists because of what they were and where they come from.
6) I actually have no issue if people want to walk around naked, you might get cold though.



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Carl on 13 July 2010

@ Pyro

Same thing, i just added more detail to my version



                            

SciFiBoy on 13 July 2010
Lostplanet22 said:
SciFiBoy said:
Lostplanet22 said:

Must say that I don't totally not agree with the 'when in Rome' aswell...

But their must be an minimum of integration though....


intergration to what exactly?

following laws, sure, but what else?


Learn the language, know that people are equal (women who want to divorce can do this, children who want to quit the religion have the right do that and even marry someone from else religion, homosexualty is allowed here, freedom of speech, know that you don't have the right to vote the first five years, etc (so much)...

^ That is what I had to learn at an integration school... For me they should also let new immigrants sign a contract (in their native language) that they agree with all of it...

If those immigrants get caught in a problem (like beating up homosexuals or jews) they should know that they have a risk to get send back to country of origin...(After 5 years of staying in the country it should be impossible the send them back)

equality and stuff I guess is fair, language to an extent, they need to be able to communicate certainly.

if they commit a crime, it would depend on which nation they are from, if that nation might put them in danger, then I would say arrest them here.



SciFiBoy on 13 July 2010
Carl2291 said:

@ Pyro

Same thing, i just added more detail to my version




Pyro as Bill on 13 July 2010
Carl2291 said:

@ Pyro

Same thing, i just added more detail to my version


Hardly. One says you have a right not to be killed, the other says you have a right not to be scared by your imagination.

You don't really want a law against bad dreams do you?

:;)



Nov 2016 - NES outsells PS1 (JP)

Don't Play Stationary 4 ever. Switch!

FootballFan on 13 July 2010

Can we just remember that the law passed prevents people wearing balaclavas as well....Like the Burka it's my choice to wear it, but is quite rightly not allowed in public places. If I walked into a bank with one on my identity would be hidden just like a Burka. Therefore, I am immeditly a threat to security as if I commited a crime (anywhere) CCTV cameras couldn't instantly find my identity. It is a security issue.....the passed bill specifically says garments....not just to piss off those that CHOOSE to wear the garments.