What i find intruging is that Creationism seems to be a phenomena which appears in large only in America, and in quite narrow group within society. Europeans have widely accepted and embraced evolution without any interference with their religious faith, the Catholic Church has also accepted the idea. Why do some evangelical groups in America promote science and evolution as evil is beyond me. 

Science while still does not offer a complete explanation of the Evolution, has produced enough evidence about Age of Earth, Macro and Micro Evolution to dismiss works of Creatonism. And Creationism is simply a continuation of the Fundamentalist opposition to Evolution and has no real value.

@mhsillin

Out of curiosity is the writing of the Bible literally stated to be written by the hand of God, or that the act of writing the book was a product of direct communication with God, or that God imparted a divine inspiration. This is fairly important. I am asking this does the book say these things happened to the writers. I am curious is this found in the document, or is it simply assumed to be the case. I am just curious, because in all of these debates I have had. Not once has anyone presented a passage where God takes credit for the writing. Not to mention I have never heard anyone even recount a story of a shepard boy just stumbling over the finished book in the wilderness.

Speaking to your conspiracy theory about Evolution. Seriously there are people whos reputations are at stake, or there is a profit making venture underway? The scientific community as a whole accepts the theory. That said scientists are more then willing to discount a theory proven wrong. Not fifty years ago there were competing theories for the nature of the Universe the Big Bang model, and the Static State model. Both models had large camps of supporters. However once Static State was disproven via cosmic background radiation the community as a whole fell in line with the Big Bang model. With no resentment, and nobody had their reputations crushed. This was even a very public debate between supporters, and the public didn't even take it out on the losing side. This reputation notion is nonsense. This might hold weight if scientists who support a theory proven false got lynched, but it doesn't happen. They still get jobs, and they are still well paid.

This notion that someone is making money off of evolution is bullshit. Only your own persecution complex cooked this one up. Scientific texts and lectures aren't what most of us would call cash cows. Further more it isn't even if the theory needs more validation. In other words your not going to get a grant to prove natural selection yet again. You might get money for paleontology. Sponsers often get recognition in the naming of finds, but really getting money to dig in dirt in the hot sun for months on end. That is something you do if you expect to find something or at least hope to find something. Sometimes they have to go on digs for years on end until they find a new species.

Scientists don't make money off of Natural Selection. Nor are their reputations at stake. Especially when the truly vast majority of the community takes the theory as fact. You know who really makes money off of Natural Selection. Wait for it theologians thats right. There is a shitload of money into trying to debunk Evolution. The faithful are easily bilked, and they buy shitloads of books, go to seminars, and make donations. A scientist doing paleotology might make twenty five thousand dollars a year on a Paleontological dig, and most of the diggers are either doing it for free, or are locals that are getting a good wage, but not a spectacular one.

The charismatic theologian attacking Natural Selection on the other hand can make tens of millions of dollars. A television ministry is a massive corporate venture. Many of them own large amounts of real estate, and even run amusement parks. Many of them are really financial moguls. Plus its their reputation that is golden. Any insinuation of inproper behavior can destroy their money making machine. One romp with a prostitute, and it can be over. So here is where we are.

The Scientist works in basic obscurity, basically makes a living, and has to put in a lot of hard work. Sounds kind of like a decent guy to me. The Theologian tearing down Natural Selection gets fame, basically makes a fortune, and only has to put in a couple hours work a week. Oh my such back breaking labor. Seriously here who has the most to gain, and who has the most to lose. A conspiracy doesn't just happen for shits and giggles. There is something to gain, and really scientists don't have anything to gain. Hell if one of them can scientifically disprove Natural Selection he or she would be a shoe in for the Nobel prize, and become world famous. Can that actually be how a conspiracy works.

Your imagining things.

@Lolcislaw

The United States is a immigrant nation that was cut out of the wilderness. This mindset is the logical outcome of how a immigrant population settles. They are usually tight knit, self reinforcing, and incredibly uniform. Over time that uniform nature is locked in. Homogenization takes time to occur, and when you look at the United States its still a nation in the process of becoming homogenous. Whereas Europe has had much longer to become homogenous. So in the United States there are pockets of tight knit groups that have locked in their values. You have to remember this just isn't the product of starting off with a very narrow set of values, but the nature of their location created external pressures. Both imagined and real. They just didn't have a choice. Any colony that couldn't subjugate certain levels of free thought faced a very real problem from without and from within.

So today you have places in the United States that started from very uniform stock. That also had to develop a mindset that they manage their own affairs. So you have deeply held beliefs with a certain degree of fear when it comes to outside influence. Mind you this isn't necessarily all bad. That usually breeds a very strong sense of community and mutual support. People in communities like that take their responsibility seriously. As a matter of fact its almost hilarious just how fast they mobilize to deal with problems.

That's because the Bible was written by men whether you think they were inspired by God or not. Evolution is not a religion, but an observable scientific theory, something creationism/ID will never be since it is believed by faith and without contrary. The Bible: Written by men who's reputations and money are riding on it.

Smidlee said: mhsillen said: Squall_Leonhart said: Evolution = Fact! To say otherwise is to deny ones self the truth and hide behind the teachings of a story book I bet you think the bible was written just by men. If you do then evolution should get the same respect in your eyes. Written by men who's reputations and money are riding on it. That what I found interesting about these debates  is you can learn alot about people. - He obviously already determined in his mind what "THE TRUTH" is. - "The Truth" is  extremely dogmatic. - Don't trust what you read from a book. - Trust more what you read on the internet.

Wait wait wait

"Don't trust books, trust people on the Internet instead"?  Seriously?  I mean, are you really not joking, for real? 

(Disclaimer:  some books lie, and some people on the internet should be given great respect and trust.  But your two bullet points put together are just ... it makes you laugh, but almost makes you cry.)

Final-Fan said: Smidlee said: mhsillen said: Squall_Leonhart said: Evolution = Fact! To say otherwise is to deny ones self the truth and hide behind the teachings of a story book I bet you think the bible was written just by men. If you do then evolution should get the same respect in your eyes. Written by men who's reputations and money are riding on it. That what I found interesting about these debates  is you can learn alot about people. - He obviously already determined in his mind what "THE TRUTH" is. - "The Truth" is  extremely dogmatic. - Don't trust what you read from a book. - Trust more what you read on the internet. Wait wait wait "Don't trust books, trust people on the Internet instead"?  Seriously?  I mean, are you really not joking, for real?  (Disclaimer:  some books lie, and some people on the internet should be given great respect and trust.  But your two bullet points put together are just ... it makes you laugh, but almost makes you cry.)

I found that funny too! Books are a much more reliable source than the internet. For instance, your statements are unreliable and on the internet. Both books and the internet have reliable and unreliable sources. For instance, any book written by Discovery Institute and the Answers in Genesis website as unreliable sources and on the other side is a Biology textbooks approved by the Board of Education and sites runned by billion dollar corporations as reliable.

Evolution is a religion because as much as you wanna think it is all proven and facts are evident it is the opposite.

I'm not surewhat to believe at this point but I can say I would not throw out a belief in a  designer]creator

Really, show me evidence against evolution because the fossil record, genetics, morphology, chemistry all point to a common ancestor. Remember, many people believe in a designer but also accept evolution as the method on which that designer used. So this isn't a debate whether there is a god/designer or not. What evidence disproves evolution by natural selection?

According to bible belief there is a commoin ancestor

I love this subject but I will get killed in here as I have suffered nuelogical problems forthe last year and have trouble connecting points

He meant species having common ancestors of earlier species, not humans having ancestors of earlier humans.