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Forums - Gaming - Another Look At Piracy

Kasz216 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
 

I want it pirated so the developer knows that they should not be asking $60 for a game that is ridiculously bad next time they release a game.

But you said yourself, piracy has no effect at all on developers, so why should they bother about how much a title is pirated ?

Because instead of 3 million pirated copies maybe they would have had 3 million sales, maybe even more for anyone who just decided to refrain from buying it and pirating it.

But but, piracy does not affect sales !!!

That is the whole argument you have been posting on this forum over and over for the last year............

 

Are you suddenly changing your mind ???????

 

No... he's saying if you charge 30 dollars for a game worth 30 dollars... more people may actually buy it.  That at a lower Price Activision is likely to create more sales.

If a pirate does pirate something he wouldn't pay 60 dollars for... it doesn't mean he wouldn't pay 40, or 20.

 

Nope, he is saying that if less people decided to pirate the game ( for whatever reason, be it price, quality or another reason) more copies would be sold..

 

That seem to be like he's establishing a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of copies sold..........

 

You're are both saying that under different conditions the number of pirated copies and the number of sold copies would evolve differently.

What if the condition was : ' it's not possible to pirate a given game. Would that condition affect the number of copies sold ? you betcha, following your reasonning.

So you are both establishing a relation between sales and piracy level that  Vlad has been hammering for months does not exist.....



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Around the Network
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
 

I want it pirated so the developer knows that they should not be asking $60 for a game that is ridiculously bad next time they release a game.

But you said yourself, piracy has no effect at all on developers, so why should they bother about how much a title is pirated ?

Because instead of 3 million pirated copies maybe they would have had 3 million sales, maybe even more for anyone who just decided to refrain from buying it and pirating it.

But but, piracy does not affect sales !!!

That is the whole argument you have been posting on this forum over and over for the last year............

 

Are you suddenly changing your mind ???????

No you are not getting this at all. You can't take a hypothetical scenario completely different from the original then apply it to the original.

Your hypothetical scenario is that developer release games that fit the value of their price and make it as convinient to obtain as a torrent copy. That right there would be the case where piracy would be be hurtful to the industry.

Saying that piracy hurts the industry in its current state because of the conclusion above  is absolutely wrong. Those 3 million people would not have bought the game at the given quality/price and inconvience, and hence they pirate. That means that developers should see the numbers, and try to service the pirates so they can get sales out of them. For every 1000 pirates stopped there is 1 person who buys the game, or so studies say. To stop piracy they need to to make their products worth what they are asking for, and to make it convinient to obtain.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

Ail said:
Kasz216 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
 

I want it pirated so the developer knows that they should not be asking $60 for a game that is ridiculously bad next time they release a game.

But you said yourself, piracy has no effect at all on developers, so why should they bother about how much a title is pirated ?

Because instead of 3 million pirated copies maybe they would have had 3 million sales, maybe even more for anyone who just decided to refrain from buying it and pirating it.

But but, piracy does not affect sales !!!

That is the whole argument you have been posting on this forum over and over for the last year............

 

Are you suddenly changing your mind ???????

 

No... he's saying if you charge 30 dollars for a game worth 30 dollars... more people may actually buy it.  That at a lower Price Activision is likely to create more sales.

If a pirate does pirate something he wouldn't pay 60 dollars for... it doesn't mean he wouldn't pay 40, or 20.

 

Nope, he is saying that if less people decided to pirate the game ( for whatever reason, be it price, quality or another reason) more copies would be sold..

 

That seem to be like he's establishing a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of copies sold..........

That isn't a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of sold copies at all.

Afterall, he's saying if something chagned.  IE, Price or Quality.


Not "If piracy stopped."

 

If it was a better game more people who didn't pirate the game would sell it.  The same is true with it was cheaper.  However by studying your piracy vs sales numbers... it can tell you a LOT about the product.



Ail said:

 

Nope, he is saying that if less people decided to pirate the game ( for whatever reason, be it price, quality or another reason) more copies would be sold..

 

That seem to be like he's establishing a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of copies sold..........

 

You're are both saying that under different conditions the number of pirated copies and the number of sold copies would evolve differently.

What if the condition was : ' it's not possible to pirate a given game. Would that condition affect the number of copies sold ? you betcha, following your reasonning.

So you are both establishing a relation between sales and piracy level that  Vlad has been hammering for months does not exist.....

That is true, but it's an effect of what I said.

Better quality/cost + convinience -> more sales -> less piracy.

What you are trying to imply i:

less piracy -> more sales.

Which is absolutely faulty.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

Kasz216 said:
Ail said:
Kasz216 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:
vlad321 said:
 

I want it pirated so the developer knows that they should not be asking $60 for a game that is ridiculously bad next time they release a game.

But you said yourself, piracy has no effect at all on developers, so why should they bother about how much a title is pirated ?

Because instead of 3 million pirated copies maybe they would have had 3 million sales, maybe even more for anyone who just decided to refrain from buying it and pirating it.

But but, piracy does not affect sales !!!

That is the whole argument you have been posting on this forum over and over for the last year............

 

Are you suddenly changing your mind ???????

 

No... he's saying if you charge 30 dollars for a game worth 30 dollars... more people may actually buy it.  That at a lower Price Activision is likely to create more sales.

If a pirate does pirate something he wouldn't pay 60 dollars for... it doesn't mean he wouldn't pay 40, or 20.

 

Nope, he is saying that if less people decided to pirate the game ( for whatever reason, be it price, quality or another reason) more copies would be sold..

 

That seem to be like he's establishing a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of copies sold..........

That isn't a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of sold copies at all.

Afterall, he's saying if something chagned.  IE, Price or Quality.


Not "If piracy stopped."

 

If it was a better game more people who didn't pirate the game would sell it.  The same is true with it was cheaper.  However by studying your piracy vs sales numbers... it can tell you a LOT about the product.

Not really , you and Vlad are both saying that those pirates under different conditions could be potential buyers...

So if piracy was not possible isn't it reasonnable to consider that some of those pirates could translate as buyers ?

It seems so to me. So just by its existence, piracy does indeed affect sales....

 



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Around the Network
Ail said:
Kasz216 said:
 

That isn't a clear relation between the number of pirated copies and the number of sold copies at all.

Afterall, he's saying if something chagned.  IE, Price or Quality.


Not "If piracy stopped."

 

If it was a better game more people who didn't pirate the game would sell it.  The same is true with it was cheaper.  However by studying your piracy vs sales numbers... it can tell you a LOT about the product.

Not really , you and Vlad are both saying that those pirates under different conditions could be potential buyers...

So if piracy was not possible isn't it reasonnable to consider that some of those pirates could translate as buyers ?

It seems so to me. So just by its existence, piracy does indeed affect sales....

 

There is a study that shows that for every 1000 stopped pirates, only 1 sale is made. You assume the sale is not made because of piracy. When in fact the sale is not made because of the quality/price and convinience, and piracy follows from that.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

You are saying that quality of a game and it's price have effect on the piracy level of a game...

I'm saying that the fact that a game can be pirated has an effect too. And you will be hard pressed to argue about this. 

If it can't be pirated, piracy level = 0...



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:

You are saying that quality of a game and it's price have effect on the piracy level of a game...

I'm saying that the fact that a game can be pirated has an effect too. And you will be hard pressed to argue about this. 

If it can't be pirated, piracy level = 0...

Yes except that would mean that if piracy level = 0, then sales would be even larger, which you cannot show me at all. Again, the US and Netherlands have both said that they can't say that piracy actually affects sales, and that if they do it's a minimal amount.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835

 

vlad321 said:
Ail said:

You are saying that quality of a game and it's price have effect on the piracy level of a game...

I'm saying that the fact that a game can be pirated has an effect too. And you will be hard pressed to argue about this. 

If it can't be pirated, piracy level = 0...

Yes except that would mean that if piracy level = 0, then sales would be even larger, which you cannot show me at all. Again, the US and Netherlands have both said that they can't say that piracy actually affects sales, and that if they do it's a minimal amount.

 

Lets say piracy is made impossible tomorrow...

What are you going to do ?

Stop gaming ?

Or buy some games...

 

PS : I already answered your study, yes if Gas was free I would have more money to spend on some other products, that does not demonstrate anything at all...........



PS3-Xbox360 gap : 1.5 millions and going up in PS3 favor !

PS3-Wii gap : 20 millions and going down !

Ail said:
vlad321 said:
Ail said:

You are saying that quality of a game and it's price have effect on the piracy level of a game...

I'm saying that the fact that a game can be pirated has an effect too. And you will be hard pressed to argue about this. 

If it can't be pirated, piracy level = 0...

Yes except that would mean that if piracy level = 0, then sales would be even larger, which you cannot show me at all. Again, the US and Netherlands have both said that they can't say that piracy actually affects sales, and that if they do it's a minimal amount.

 

Lets say piracy is made impossible tomorrow...

What are you going to do ?

Stop gaming ?

Or buy some games...

Buy the same games I would have bought even when piracy existed, and not even bother with the rest. Actually I'd miss on some amazing games, cause I sure as hell wouldn't have bought games like World of Goo and Machinarium. I doubt most pirates would magically start buying games either. I doubt the people in poor countries will start buying games, or the people who think that games are not worth the money will magically start buying games.

P.S. Except that you'd have spent the money on gas somewhere else. Meanwhile they stated that piracy increased the amount of money one would have spent by getting people to buy related products, not just substitute X for Y.



Tag(thx fkusumot) - "Yet again I completely fail to see your point..."

HD vs Wii, PC vs HD: http://www.vgchartz.com/forum/thread.php?id=93374

Why Regenerating Health is a crap game mechanic: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=3986420

gamrReview's broken review scores: http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/post.php?id=4170835