Kasz216 said:
I literally facepalmed in real life at this last sentence.
For fun though Vote by Idelogy Liberal 21% Conservative (34%( Bush 84% (81%) Kerry (15%) 18% |
I facepalm at most things you write. And thanks for proving my point.
Kasz216 said:
I literally facepalmed in real life at this last sentence.
For fun though Vote by Idelogy Liberal 21% Conservative (34%( Bush 84% (81%) Kerry (15%) 18% |
I facepalm at most things you write. And thanks for proving my point.
Sqrl said:
You post an article that tears apart the very point you're trying to make. Interesting tactic.... Excerpt: ... To reiterate, people who subscribe to non-traditional ideas probably have above-average intellects, but that does not mean other smart people will like those ideas. This is a point often lost on liberals who work in universities or in the news media. They observe, usually correctly, that friends and acquaintances in their social circle are smarter than the average (and likely more conservative) people they encounter on the street. But too many elites see this correlation between smartness and liberalism as somehow a validation of their political views. They seem unaware that the wider world features plenty of intelligent people who are not professors or movie critics or government bureaucrats. Even among the nation’s smartest people, liberal elites could easily be in the minority politically, but different social circles keep them insulated from finding that out. The result is a convenient but damaging political meme that circulates among some people on the Left—the belief that their opponents simply can’t understand what makes for good policy. ... There is a certain devilish fun to contemplating the intelligence of liberals and conservatives, but it should have no effect on how we think about issues. Political debates would be better without it. |
More intelligent people are statistically significantly more likely to exhibit social values and religious and political preferences that are novel to the human species in evolutionary history. Specifically, liberalism and atheism, and for men (but not women), preference for sexual exclusivity correlate with higher intelligence, a new study finds.
http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2010/02/100224132655.htm
I do agree, though, that it doesn't do much good to assume that since another person is less intelligent that their ideas are unfounded or that they cant understand your ideas.
ManusJustus said:
I facepalm at most things you write. And thanks for proving my point. |
Of which... holds no actual relevence. Since the numbers who "cross vote" are very small.
Also, voting in general is a better sign of conservatism and liberalism then self idenfitication.
Reason being... it forces you to choose.
Rather then say "I'm for this, i'm against this!" It forces you to quantify the value of each issue to you.
Even if you hold mostly conservative values... if one liberal value is more important to you then all of those conservative values combined... in reality you are a liberal.

| Sqrl said: I typically hate these kinds of studies but just to prove the point of how muddled this topic really is:
Excerpts: ... Sociologist Markus Kemmelmeier compared college students' self-professed political views to their SAT and ACT scores (which are imperfect but useful measures of cognitive ability.) First, he did find a general trend that social conservatives (those who wanted to ban abortion and gay marriage) weren't as gifted as students with a more progressive take on gender roles. But he found the exact opposite pattern with anti-regulation attitudes: The conservatives/libertarians (yay guns boo taxes) appeared to be smarter than their commie compatriots. Kemmelmeier found this crossover "particularly surprising" and says, "It highlights (yet again) that ‘conservatism' is not necessarily a coherent construct, but that you have to distinguish at minimum social conservatism and economic conservatism (libertarianism). If you think about it: Jerry Falwell and Milton Freedman are worlds apart." ... Well there you have it, apparently I'm one smart dude. Everyone please from this point remember to refer to me as "Supreme Lord Wicked-Smart of SuperSmarty'ness" and remember your political views are now FACTUALLY demonstrated to be vastly inferior to mine...keep that in mind so that I can now dismiss your views with a wave of my hand (which incidentally, like most things, is a massive waste of my vast impressive and monumental intellect).
Damn I'm awesome. |
*high five*
we r smert, sqrl!!!!1

Or check out my new webcomic: http://selfcentent.com/
By the way I just want to point out that even if you prove the points you're trying to prove right now (which I think is pretty unlikely) you still haven't proven the crux of your argument, namely that the people who are actually committing the acts of violence are disproportionately of a conservative political view.
If we assume liberals are smarter, better educated, etc...on the average than people with any other view (again this by itself is a HUGE stretch) your point of saying "and poor people are more likely to be violent" doesn't actually prove a damn thing in regards to conservatives.
Even if we 100% buy into everything you've posted:
- We still have no way to know if poor and/or dumb liberals are responsible for more than there share of violence.
- Even if we assume liberals do less than there share your argument amounts to "any violence not done by liberals is done by conservatives", based on what exactly?
rocketpig said:
*high five* we r smert, sqrl!!!!1 |

Radical American Muslims take on South Park
http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2010/04/19/security-brief-radical-islamic-web-site-takes-on-south-park/?hpt=T2
Islamic radicals are using the same methods that Conservative groups have been using to eliminate their targets. The radicals warned Matt Stone and Trey parker that if they didn't bend to their will that bad things would happen to them, and they posted personal addresses of South Park's creators and people to pay them a visit. Very similar to what conservatives have done with doctors who practice abortion and politicians who support healthcare reform.
I'm afraid that there are Muslims out there who are more willing to act than many of the Christian and Tea Party groups, even though conservatives have killed it seems most them just resort to vandalism and intimidation. Still these acts of terrorism to push their social and religious views on others needs to stop, we are not living in the 13th century anymore.
I'm afraid there are Muslims out there who are completely immune to irony.
ManusJustus said:
I think its appropriate. First of all, Kristallnact means the night of the broken glass, which is what happened to the property of several Democrat sentators. It was a method used by the Nazis to insight people to riot and harm a group of people, just as Conservative activists insighted people to harm Democrats by posting addresses of their homes, offices, and other family members for people to "pay them a visit." Furthermore, the method of posting personal information online, such as home and office addresses, is a tactic used by Neo-Nazis today when they try to insight people to attack their targets. Thats not to mention other methods of intimidation that the Nazi's agaisnt political opponets in Germany. So yes, the conservative activists are easily comparable to Nazis. |
I know the debate has long since moved away from this point, and when this thread first popped up a few weeks ago I deliberately stayed away because in general I don't enjoy arguing politics, but I don't feel like there's been adequate closure on this issue and can no longer keep silent.
In this entire thread you've engaged largely in ad hominem attacks against conservatives using overly sensationalist language. I shouldn't have to remind you, but due to your insistence on pressing this point I will anyway - the Nazis killed over 6 million Jews in just their death camps alone. Add in the gypsies, homosexuals, and other people the Nazis oppressed and it goes up even more, with estimates ranging from 11-17 million people in total who lost their lives to the nazis.
If you think that a few fringe radicals who in no way represent the majority of the movement or their ideals are enough to equate all conservatives with nazis then you are helplessly delusional.
Fortunately I know a few other liberals myself, and can at least confirm that your opinion doesn't represent that of the majority so there may still be some hope for American politics.

|
De85 said: In this entire thread you've engaged largely in ad hominem attacks against conservatives using overly sensationalist language. I shouldn't have to remind you, but due to your insistence on pressing this point I will anyway - the Nazis killed over 6 million Jews in just their death camps alone. Add in the gypsies, homosexuals, and other people the Nazis oppressed and it goes up even more, with estimates ranging from 11-17 million people in total who lost their lives to the nazis. If you think that a few fringe radicals who in no way represent the majority of the movement or their ideals are enough to equate all conservatives with nazis then you are helplessly delusional. |
Ad hominems are not fallacies. Individuals and groups that resort to violence to force their social and political views on others are predominately conservative, thus conservatism poses a threat to democratic society.
Concerning Nazis, what did they do before they got into power? They intimidated politicians, vandalized homes and businesses, conjured up fears of foriegners and minority groups, claim those who disagree with them don't support their country, and so forth. Exactly how conservatives in America act. You may be from Europe or elsewhere, or perhaps you only get your information from Fox News, but hate crimes committed by conservatives are very common in the United States. It is very common for non-conservative groups to be personally assaulted because of who they are. Assaults and intimidation against homosexual are still main stream in rural (conservative) areas of America. When Jim Adkisson was asked why he brought a gun into a Unitarian Church and killed several innocent people, he said, "because I hate the liberal movement." He wanted to commit suicide, but thought that killing liberals before being killed by police would be better.
Recently, atheist/agnostic groups started buying ad space saying "if you don't believe in God, you're not alone," but wherever these advertisements go they are vandalized; and its not fringe conservatives, its a majority of conservatives. When President George H. W. Bush was asked if he recognized the equal citizenship and patriotism of Americans who are atheists, he replied, "I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered patriots. This is one nation under God." Atheists aren't considered citizens in Saudi Arabia or Iran either...