finalrpgfantasy said: does anyone know how long is ff XIII

I'd say about 12 miles

aragod said: finalrpgfantasy said: does anyone know how long is ff XIII I'd say about 12 miles

no, i was reffering to time.

Excellent OP

you should also add

"LOTs of content has been removed from EVERY FF, this is not new with FF13"

Teo said: The dumbest statement I have read in years. FF 7,8,9, and 10 were all linear, ALL. In FF8, the whole first disc you were in a tiny island and the galbadian continent with access to only 3 towns (2 mandatory, 1 optional). You didn't even have full access to the continent since moutains cut of the other parts. In Disc 2 you finally get to move around the ocean but mountains again prevent you from going to more rewarding quest areas. Finally in disc 3 is when you get full access, but you all know thats really the end of the game because in disc 4 everything gets blocked off. FF9 was even more linear everything was 1 way for the first 2 disc. Disc 1, small slices of the mist continent as the story progressed. Disc 2, the outer continent, smaller than the mist continent. Disc 3 access to everywhere you have been before, near end of disc 3 you finally get full access to the whole game with airship. FF10, the true king of linearity, this game is more linear than FFXIII. I imported the game. FF12 is the only open world FF that was not linear at all, you could go almost everywhere before the half point of the story. It's so ridiculous that everyone and their mother has jumped on the linear bandwagon, FF fans need to clarify this to those who keep say it like it's something new.

I know i'm late to this thread, but screw it, you just said everything that I've been saying for these past months.

I will also add that FFIV and FFVI are also as linear as you could get.

In FFIV, it's not until you get the airship to reach the well that will connect you to the underground that you gain some non-linear exploration capacities.

In FFVI, the entire World of Balance is one big linear experience. You even get hand-guided in most of the parts, and dungeons themselves are pretty linear, especially the Goddess Statues map. It's not only when you get to the World of Ruin, and start looking for your companions that the game actually gets non-linear.

All in all, good OP. 

The vast majority of JRPGs are linear, but most of them try, in some degree, to give you an illusion of non-linearity, a fake feeling of being in an open world. They usually try this giving you a world map where you can move, and let you access a city where you are not suposed to go, even if there is nothing to do there. There are games that don't try to mask linearity, and some people (like me) don't like that.

FF10 is the most famous, where you just had to follow the arrow of the mini map to the next boss/cutscene, giving you what I would call a "corridor feel". I like JRPGs that try to fool me and hide their linearity. I think the presence of a world map is very important (for example, I loved the Dragon Quest 8 map, because it was beautiful, and gave me a sensation of "traveling").

This doesn't mean that games like FF10 or FF13 are bad games. I liked games like Rogue Galaxy that also used corridors, but I think that hiding linearity adds value to the game.

PD: English is not my first language, so there may be some errors. Sorry.

what its linear?okay im not buying it...

antoniocm said: The vast majority of JRPGs are linear, but most of them try, in some degree, to give you an illusion of non-linearity, a fake feeling of being in an open world. They usually try this giving you a world map where you can move, and let you access a city where you are not suposed to go, even if there is nothing to do there. There are games that don't try to mask linearity, and some people (like me) don't like that. FF10 is the most famous, where you just had to follow the arrow of the mini map to the next boss/cutscene, giving you what I would call a "corridor feel". I like JRPGs that try to fool me and hide their linearity. I think the presence of a world map is very important (for example, I loved the Dragon Quest 8 map, because it was beautiful, and gave me a sensation of "traveling"). This doesn't mean that games like FF10 or FF13 are bad games. I liked games like Rogue Galaxy that also used corridors, but I think that hiding linearity adds value to the game. PD: English is not my first language, so there may be some errors. Sorry.

 You pretty much said what I was about to :P.

 I'm iffy on the whole pseudo-freedom that previous FF's / JRPG's have given us. It'll be a shame for FFXIII to lose it, but at the same time it makes the game much more concise to play, a much more focused playthrough. Whether there was an extra town in FFVIII at some point or not, the fact was to actually get anywhere you had to go to point x and talk to person x, you never really had any freedom.

 I think peoples bigger worries with FFXIII is the lack of stuff to do outside the story. (Spoiler tags - regarding what sidequests there are, no story spoilers) The monster hunts sound great, and if they're as difficult as people suggest they sound awesome - but my worry is that it? FFVII had the Weapons, finding the best weapons, the arena, golden saucer, finding all materia, and stuff im sure i forgot. Of course I'm sure there is more depth then I've read on import previews lol.

FFX was criticized for being too linear too. I think normally linear games have better stories, or better told stories anyway. I like a mixture of linear and non-linear games.

antoniocm said: The vast majority of JRPGs are linear, but most of them try, in some degree, to give you an illusion of non-linearity, a fake feeling of being in an open world. They usually try this giving you a world map where you can move, and let you access a city where you are not suposed to go, even if there is nothing to do there. There are games that don't try to mask linearity, and some people (like me) don't like that.

Earlier, I posted something similar to this on GameSpot. The designers in past Final Fantasy titles implemented a World Map that acts as a veil, successfully overshadowing the linear progression. In the former installments, the Overworld Map at the beginning of the game is linear and comparable to Final Fantasy XIII. The limited World Map appears to be vast in volume, but the progression still remains linear like a JRPG (this is not the case for every JRPG, mind you).

It is very easy for the tension of a game's plot to decline when it exhibits non linear aspects or obtrusive game elements. Character development and Story progression seem to be the preeminent focus set by Square, which is understandable. Before attacking the game design and deeming its linearity as a negative impact, I suggest a firm grasp on narratology and the essentials of Game Design Theory. These two elements can actually explain the logic behind a linear game and the decision to present the plot in such a manner.

FINAL FANTASY=LINER TO THE BONE until the half of every ff you are not allowed to do a lot of things