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The_Yoda said:
Ok so a "No I will not list the atrocities committed" would have been much shorter. Instead I get deflection. I am not disappointed. You will hang the moniker of "systemic" on the rapes so as to deny there was rape. Special kind of special at play again. You should apply to be an ABC fact checker. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-68474899 Pramila Patten, the UN's Special Representative on Sexual Violence in Conflict, said her team had "found clear and convincing information that sexual violence, including rape, sexualised torture, cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment" had been committed against hostages. There were "reasonable grounds" to believe such violence could be "ongoing against those still held in captivity", she told reporters. Hamas gunmen infiltrated southern Israel on 7 October - killing about 1,200 people and taking 253 others hostage. The UN report said "the mission team found that there are reasonable grounds to believe that conflict-related sexual violence occurred in multiple locations during the 7 October attacks". These happened in at least three locations - the Nova music festival site and its surroundings, Road 232, and Kibbutz Re'im, it added. Reports of sexual violence carried out by Hamas - which is proscribed as a terrorist organisation by Israel, the UK and others - began to emerge soon after 7 October and have accumulated steadily ever since. The BBC has also seen and heard evidence of rape, sexual violence and mutilation of women. But it wasn't "systemic" right? So you can downplay and deny. These that you have defended for hundreds of posts are great people that hide in schools and hospitals and among the poor civilian population and contribute to their deaths and the destruction of facilities that are much needed currently. You want to play semantics because you have little to nothing else in way of defense. Barbaric acts answered in some cases with barbaric responses. It is an tragic situation to be sure since 99% of those affected on either side aren't really at fault. All right I'm done. I am sorry I even responded initially. Please do not respond unless you are willing to drop hiding behind semantics. Just in case you are, I will ask again ... Can you please list the atrocities from October 7th that you believe happened? Sorry my response was all broken up by pesky work and may not flow worth a damn. Credit where it is due, my response is not as polished as your typical response. I believe you hide behind semantics but your responses are polished and almost always included sources. From that perspective a non-sarcastic bravo and tip of my hat to you. It is a shame that differences of opinion or perspective drive humanity apart when if you tossed those out most of the time there would be far more common ground between people of all places and walks of life. We tend to focus on those differences though instead of common ground. Pity |
It's not me that hung the 'systematic' moniker on the rapes. It's the media. I never denied that there were no instances of rape. What I'm saying is there was no systematic rape campaign as the media has been shouting since Oct 7 (as some sort of excuse or distraction to what's being done to Gaza)
I'm sorry I don't trust the BBC anymore, they have been caught lying and have shown nothing but bias when it comes to the ME. Even some of their own reporters have turned against the BBC.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-67629181
"Nothing happened by coincidence. Rape was systematic."
And that UN report has been twisted in many ways. Reading the source you get
reasonable grounds .... in at least three locations
.... may be indicative of some forms of sexual violence
Other reported instances of rape could not be verified in the time allotted.
heard of other allegations of rape that could not yet be verified.
at least two allegations of sexual violence widely repeated in the media, were unfounded ...
Other allegations, including of objects intentionally inserted into female genital organs, could not be verified
reports of conflict-related sexual violence, including at least one instance of rape, could not be verified
reports of sexual violence including a case of rape and genital mutilation, neither of which could be verified
Now when it comes to the hostages
With respect to hostages, the mission team found clear and convincing information that some have been subjected to various forms of conflict-related sexual violence including rape and sexualized torture and sexualized cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment and it also has reasonable grounds to believe that such violence may be ongoing.
What information, who supplied the information.
Then she calls the mission incompetent.
The mission was neither intended to, and nor could the mission team, in such a short period of time, establish the prevalence of conflict-related sexual violence during and after the 7 October attacks. The overall magnitude, scope, and specific attribution of these violations would require a comprehensive investigation by competent bodies.
The NY Times debacle made me very skeptical. Especially where the family of the victim said the NYT took things out of context and there never was any rape committed (in their case)
https://mondoweiss.net/2024/01/family-of-key-case-in-new-york-times-october-7-sexual-violence-report-renounces-story-says-reporters-manipulated-them/
A New York Times story claiming a pattern of gender-based violence on October 7 hinged on the story of Gal Abdush. But the Abdush family says there is no proof she was raped, and that Times reporters interviewed them under false pretenses.
Btw there is also no proof Hamas has been hiding in schools and hospitals. Whatever flimsy 'evidence' the IDF has concocted has been debunked. No Hamas command centers have been found. It's the standard lie the IDF uses to excuse their actions. In their view everyone is a human shield that is still in the area after they issue another evacuation order.
Also Hamas is more than resistance fighters, they are the entire government. Civil workers, police, paramedics, teachers. So in that sense, yes Hamas is 'hiding' in schools and hospitals. Everyone on the government payroll is considered a target by Israel. They're not part of Oct 7 though, didn't even know about it as Sinwar held it a tight secret to a small group. Yet Israel's Lavender AI is targeting families of civil servants regardless.
As for atrocities committed on Oct 7, murder, kidnap, sexual violence likely including rape, late disorganized response leading to more deaths including friendly fire.
