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Soundwave on 12 June 2024
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Pemalite said:
Soundwave said:

Tears of the Kingdom has sold over 20 million copies in a year at full price $70, no bullshit inflated sales either by dropping the price six months in like some of these other phony "blockbusters" ride on, Breath of the Wild has been available for 7 years ... 99.9% of games wish they had Tears of the Kingdom sales.

Not once did I claim that Tears of the Kingdom wasn't a success.
But it sold less than Breath of the Wild.

If the underlying technology is what makes a game successful or not, then using your false prior logic it should have out-sold Breath of the Wild.

Soundwave said:


I don't care what your tech preferences are or what systems you own, it's irrelevant to discussions about the broad market. I only bring this up again because for whatever reason there's the same couple of posters that feel like they must insert that into market discussion, it's just completely non-sensical. I own, I like, etc. etc. here let me give you the memo again -- I don't give a crap what you like or what you own or what you prefer, I don't see what it adds in industry-related discussion.

Except it's very relevant as you keep mentioning other platforms, don't try shifting the goal post because you have empirically lost this debate on every level.

Soundwave said:

There aren't that many "next-gen graphics showcase!" titles that are actually selling that well, most of the best selling games are old games like Fortnite, GTAV, COD, Zelda, Minecraft, Madden NFL, Elden Ring, Mario Kart, or you have a few licensed games with huge IP like Harry Potter and Spider-Man etc. the games that are trying to showcase graphics as a big selling feature aren't lighting up the sales charts, it's fair to ask what is happening in the marketplace.

There are tons of next-gen graphics showcases that are selling well.

Another user already mentioned them, so I won't bother repeating them to undermine your constant lies and logical fallacies.

But doing what Trump does and repeating the same lies over and over, isn't going to magically turn them true.

Actually do name all of these graphics driven showcase titles that are made specifically for PS5/XBSX only or RTX 20+ series cards only that are selling huge numbers that aren't,

1.) Made by Sony and generally with a Marvel license attached to it. We know Ratchet & Clank Rift Apart broke even but from Sony's internal leaks it looks like it barely made a profit, they have pushed back a 4th game and cut the budget from what Rift Apart had, for it which indicates the game didn't make big money. Sony's own games obviously get a ton of marketing attention and bundles which a regular publisher is not going to be able to match. 

2.) Or have a unicorn license attached to them like Harry Potter. Most developers cannot afford to simply slap Spider-Man or Harry Potter or Star Wars onto their games and there's only a handful of IP like that even available to begin with. 

If we look at the games that fit into that criteria

Alan Wake II - Graphics showcase. Has won GOTY awards, has Nvidia marketing behind it, still has not broke even. 

Avatar: Frontiers of Pandora - Graphics showcase. Huge IP, had a marketing co-deal with Playstation. Charted one time at I believe no.6 on Circana and then dropped off the face of the earth. Further to that we find this:

Meanwhile, Avatar: Frontiers of Pandora, which released last month, has seen 1.9 million players thus far, according to Henderson, accruing around $133 million in revenue, which is quite a step down from what developer Massive Entertainment’s previous releases managed in their early days, with The Division bringing in $330 million and The Division 2 bringing in $264 million.

So even with one of the biggest movie IPs ever attached they had underwhelming performance compared to something like ... The Division (lol).

Final Fantasy 16 + Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth - Two fairly large budget next-gen games with a big name brand and FF7 itself is hugely iconic. Sales results are very disappointing here. 

Forspoken - Another big "next-gen" graphics blockbuster that Square-Enix was banking on, this one is a full on flop with a budget north of $100 million too. 

Starfield - One of the most expensive and hyped games ever made, nice graphics sure, but no where near the success of other Bethesda games, despite being their best looking game ever made by a good margin. $400 million dollar budget. Has done nothing to drive XBox hardware. 

Immortals Of Aveum - Big budget Unreal Engine 5 showcase title that's all about pushing graphics fidelity with a huge publisher (EA) behind it ... flopped. Half the dev team was laid off after release due to poor sales and just a few months ago another big chunk of the staff that was left was placed into furlough (basically an unpaid leave). Wonderful. 

Senua's Saga: HB2 - Another Unreal 5 Engine title, Microsoft paid $120 million for this studio no doubt hoping for a visual showcase that would drive XBox sales. Instead this is a total flop, Steam numbers below HiFi Rush which sold so badly it got that studio axed altogether. Lets hope Microsoft is generous and won't pull the plug on this studio so fast for the sake of the people who work there and need that paycheque. 

Gotham Knights - Very pretty game, next-gen only, not too far off from Spider-Man 2 in graphics to be honest. Huge IP (Batman) too. Has not sold huge numbers. 

I'm sure there will be graphics heavy games in the future that do sell well, but there are enough examples here to show that the modern industry is changing also and graphics are not the driving force for sales or even a reliable way to make money in the game business anymore. And it's not even like all of these games had poor reviews, the only one that really had outright terrible reviews would be Forspoken and it's not like games with poor reviews have never sold well, there are plenty of examples of games selling well without 9/10 reviews. So that can't be used as an excuse here, if people want next-gen graphics so bad, they sure as fuck aren't buying of the next-gen only games that really try to push the technology. 

I'm sure for instance Deadpool & Wolverine will do great in the future too, that doesn't mean there aren't serious problems with Hollywood movie budgets and the overemphasis on empty special effects that aren't impressing a lot of movie goers any longer. People acknowledge clearly several big budget Hollywood movies of late have bombed or underperformed, you would think on a sales website for gaming there could be some nuanced discussion beyond just "I likey graphix and needs my RAM! Gimme moar!!!!", but I guess not. 

The gaming equivalent to something like Boxofficetheory this website/forum is most certainly not. 

Last edited by Soundwave - on 12 June 2024