PlayStation Nation |OT| Playing Astro Bot on the Horizon Until Dawn

[Runa216]

BasilZero said:

dane007 said:

Its fun game but its not a final fantasy game to me.

You can say that for every Final Fantasy game that was released after the original Final Fantasy.

yeah, the whole 'this isn't Final Fantasy' narrative just makes no sense to me whatsoever. IT's been especially bad ever since VII, which people in some ways thought 'wasn't final fantasy' because it was a modern (ish) scetting. The same thing happened with 8 being slightly futuristic and breaking the level up system. Some people hated 9 for its chibi aesthetic. Some people hated 10 for its islander aesthetic, lack of traditional levelling system, and lack of a world map. some people hated....you get the point. 

Every final fantasy has some detractors. And with the rise of social media it's easier and easier to get bad takes out there in the wild with tonnes of other contrarian supporters. 

I recently went through and re-played the Pixel Remasters. Got platinum on the first four and was working on 5 when 16 came out and I temporarily put it aside. 

And as a person who's been with the franchise since the early 90s, and someone who only just basically discovered 2, 3, and 5 (I had never put more than a few hours into 2, never played 3, and never beat 5 even though I got to the end due to a save file corruption on my PSP), I can honestly say that 16 is probably the MOST Final Fantasy game other than 9. The things we see, the events as they conspire, the world and the characters and the action is all what I imagined in my head when playing the old pixel games, both back in the 90s and recently. The flow of the story, the fluctuating cast, the world building...all of it is absolutely 'final fantasy' at its core. 

There are only a couple things about this game that can be argued to be 'not final fantasy', and that;s the lack of controlling the whole party and the action RPG elements instead of turn-based combat. And given that FF has ALWAYS been about switching things up, and trying new things, and updating the existing mechanics or completely going off in another direction...Well, the argument isn't a good one. 

And 15 had all those same issues. So the precedent is already there. 

There's no angle you can really come from that doesn't have a deft counterpoint. 

Final Fantasy 16 really is Final Fantasy. And In spite of the change of core mechanics to a heavily action RPG inspired combat system, it's the only game since 12 that has given me these feels. I haven't been THIS into Final Fantasy since 2006. And that makes me feel special. 

Like I said, I only just beat and completed 2 and 3 for the first time and loved them. I consider the first three NES games to be classics. Rudimentary and a bit awkward but they really established a lot and I was shocked at how good the story was in 2 and 3, and how refined the job system was in 3. 

4 and 5 are both amazing as well, taking the character-based storytelling up a notch while refining the party mechanics. 6 is my single favourite game of all time. 

7 is another bonafide classic. And despite 8 being a weird departure I love that one, too. IX took me some time to appreciate but it has probably aged the best of the PS1 games. 

10 and 12 are again both heavy departures from the prior games, with their sphere grid, licence board, lack of world map, etc features. 

But all of these games are on my all-time favourites list. They all are notably different from one another, but I love them all. They all give me the feels. The nostalgia. the sense of epic scale and positive memories. that sort of started to dissipate around the time of 12. I never played 11 since it was an online only game, and as much as I love 12 the story isn't memorable for me at all. I genuinely don't remember the plot of 12, but I do remember the world and characters and the gameplay (I genuinely believe the Gambit system to be the best way to manage all three party members in a game like this). We all know my opinions on XIII so I won't bore you here. XIV didn't catch my eye because it was TERRIBLE at first and it was once again an MMO. (I hear it's one of the best, now, something I will have to find out some day).

And again XV didn't really do it for me. I liked that game a lot, but I felt its action RPG elements were half-baked, and for as much as I loved the core cast and the open world exploration bits, that final linear act was terrible and the overall storytelling never really grabbed me. The last time I had a FF story grab me was in 2001 with Final Fantasy X. 

So yeah, I Went into XVI sorta half expecting it to not be great. I had high hopes, as the first 11 FF games (1-10 and 12) are all on my favourites game list and I would probably rank Final Fantasy as my favourite franchise ever, even if the nostalgia is starting to wear off and the newer games haven't been grabbing me. But XVI grabbed me. Grabbed me from the demo and has held onto me right up until the Bahamut fight, which I just finished before writing this needlessly long write-up I bet nobody will read. 

I genuinely think it's the best writing and story in a Final Fantasy game. Ever. Nothing else even comes close. 

I genuinely feel it's the most fun combat system. Leagues better than 15. 

I genuinely believe it's the best cast of characters. I genuinely get sad when a villain I hate dies because it makes the world that much less. 

I genuinely think the world development is among the best in the franchise, same with the art direction. 

I Genuinely feel it's the most epic of all the FF Games in terms of scope, scale, and memorable moments. 

I do have a few nitpicks like the framerate stutters and other minor performance issues, but the closest thing I have to 'complaints' about the game boil down to 'I love this but I kinda wish it would do this other thing another FF game did', like a better crafting system or having a world map with an airship you can fly. Like, my 'complaints' insofar as they are complaints, are just me bitching because there are elements from other FF games I wish was here. Discounting how fun THIS Game is. 

So part of me 'gets' the whole 'it's not final fantasy' argument, but I still think it's a bad argument as like you said, Basil, 'it's not final fantasy' is something that can be said equally of any new final fantasy, and 16 entries in it's time to stop trying to perpetually complain due to it not being what we internalize as being pure and start focusing on how well it does what it's trying to do. FFXVI does what it's trying to do better than any game I've played in years. and while it's not a perfect replica of what we're all imagining as what is and isn't final fantasy, it is a tonne of fun. 

Remember, some people complained about God of War 2018 not being God of War anymore because KRatos...was actually a well written character. Oh, they tried passing it on like it was a difference in combat or something, but we all know it was just people whining about a change in tone. And what we got was SO much better. God of War 2018 and Ragnarok were infinitely better than old God of War. And FFXVI is better than XV and XIII. That's the trade-off when you try something drastically different. You're always gonna alienate some people but eventually if you're doing something great then the audience will come. Like how God of War 2018 sold what....23 million copies? 

Yeah. 

FFXVI is a classic in my eyes. The most 'final fantasy' game I've played since 9. And the first FF game since 2006 to make me feel quite this way.