RolStoppable said:
Good business and good games aren't mutually exclusive at all. Likewise, a new 2D Mario game being great isn't remotely something unthinkable or unrealistic. A typical strawman argument by people who don't want another 2D Mario is to paint those who want a new 2D Mario as asking for another New Super Mario Bros. retread. A) But what is actually being asked for is a new Super Mario Bros. game made with AAA treatment.
B) It wasn't that long ago that you made a thread about David Jaffe's incredible stupidity. No developer should be above criticism, especially if they say or do something very stupid. C) 2D Mario is among Nintendo's biggest IPs and it's approaching a full decade without a new game. This isn't the first time this has happened either. D) It's no secret that Miyamoto dislikes 2D Mario and would rather have Nintendo only make 3D Mario games. The way he conflates 2D Mario and 3D Mario games in his answer to investors makes it very likely there's no new 2D Mario game in the works nor planned to be made anytime soon. What's so damning about Miyamoto's attitude is that it has influenced other developers inside Nintendo too, E) plus when he used to be general producer he promoted the people who he considered to be the best fit for these jobs. While Eiji Aonuma has nothing to do with Mario, he should have no business with Zelda. But he was Miyamoto's chosen guy to take over and F) it didn't do the Zelda IP much good. It's only when Nintendo's business intervenes and dictates that the things Aonuma wants in Zelda shouldn't go in there and the focus should be on things that make Zelda sell. With 2D Mario it's a similar situation: The people who want to make a new game aren't in the positions to get it made and when Miyamoto talks about 2D Mario like he does in this answer to investors, it's further shutting down any such possibility. G) |
A) I would love to know how you'd imagine such a game to look and feel like. No sarcasm, I really would like to know.
B) Yes I know that, but I'd argue that these are very different topics. Jaffe was just desperately looking for attention, but Miyamoto merely explains why and how he created the NSMB series. His goal was to make the game more accessible and he succeeded. At the same time, we can see that Super Mario Odyssey also made a lot of changes to make the game more accessible, and this approach succeeded as well. I believe that basically all he said was that there is more than just one way to make Mario games more accessible, and that Nintendo tries yet another approach for their next instalment.
By the way, he always had this way of thinking that 2D and 3D Mario was basically the same. https://iwataasks.nintendo.com/interviews/#/wii/nsmb/0/4
His explanation is that both styles use 3D polygon models so they're both 3D games, camera angles don't seem to bother him pretty much. Now I won't defend this as even I can see how much of a stretch this is, but oh well. It might be a very unusual explanation, but it's still a much better one than Jaffe's 'I'm too dumb to shoot diagonally even though I've already done it before, so this game gets a 3/10 and sucks.' Also, as dumb as Miyamotot's explanaton is, I think we're not scratching your main concern here.
C) Yes, I agree. It is a hot thing.
D) Very debatable. He and Tezuka created the NSMB series in the first place. Rol, I love you, but I think you're reaching pretty hard on this one.
E) Yes, that's what all supervisors/seniors/executives do. They put people around them that share their mindset. This is nothing unusal.
F) Also very debatable, the Aonuma Zeldas are amazing. Maybe we have differing tastes. But then again, how do you even know which contents were Aonuma's ideas and which were not? Perhaps I don't fully understand your point here.
G) If the business has such a high power to demand which games will and which games will not be made, then his take on the fate of 2D Mario is not decisive, is it? Perhaps I don't fully understand this statement of yours, too. In any case, I really can't imagine that he has any grudges against the 2D series and I don't think that he would prevent another game. Like padib already said earlier, he's busy with other things anyway. But, time will tell, we'll see.
Last edited by GoOnKid - on 12 November 2021
