Official 2020 US Presidential Election Thread

[vivster]

Bofferbrauer2 said:

Rab said:

In other countries like Australia that can work as it is closer to proportional representation, as seen how the Greens in many other countries are a force even if not getting elected outright, the US Electoral College is a "winner takes all" system, small parties will not get proportional representation therefore its a dead vote, so the "lesser of two evils" rational is the practical choice for voters  

vivster said:

Because it's useless unless the US establish democracy. And to do that you have to vote democrats first. Voting 3rd party is not only throwing your vote away, it's working actively against what you try to achieve. Just like moronic Bernie supporters not voting for Hillary and effectively giving their vote to Trump, setting them back even further.

Voting against democrats in the US is voting against yourself unless you are a millionaire or a sociopath.

It is throwing your vote because everybody thinks it's throwing away your vote. If everybody voted by their heart and not just against the "evils" of the other side, then both parties wouldn't be anywhere close to be so dominant. In fact, I doubt they would be anywhere near dominating at all.

You can see that in local elections, where third parties have much more power and are holding several offices. But once you go a step further, this stupid way of thinking kicks in, ensuring that the two big parties stay unchallenged in state or federal elections.

You're overestimating people's willingness to vote for 3rd party. Think about who votes for them. People already involved with politics who know about policy and care about it. That's a tiny percentage of voters. Even without the electoral college 3rd parties wouldn't even come close to the established parties.

US politics is so entrenched right now that it takes multiple paradigm shifts for 3rd parties to get any kind of meaningful positions in the country, let alone a presidency. So how it is right now even if you could convince people who would consider voting for a 3rd candidate it would not be enough to rattle either party. 3rd party voters are more likely to come from the left side since they are actually interested in politics. That would lead to the Republicans winning every single election and you can be sure they will do everything in their power to suppress 3rd party powers.

So yes, until the US gains a democracy voting 3rd party is indeed not only throwing away your vote, but actively working against the rise of 3rd parties. First you will have to lay the groundwork.

And let's pretend it is possible right now to prop up a 3rd party to usurp whatever one of the established parties, you would just end up with a 2 party system again, because you haven't actually changed the underlying conditions yet.