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iron_megalith on 28 May 2020
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Mnementh said:
iron_megalith said:

Ah yes. NBC is definitely impartial! Just like CNN! Not like NTD! Or even Fox! But certainly Wikipedia is the Bible of all accurate information!

It seems that you completely missed all the things I said because you are mentally filtering it. By the way, NTD is not the only one saying that the death toll could be higher than what CCP is reporting.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/marleycoyne/2020/04/23/chinas-early-coronavirus-cases-may-have-been-four-times-higher-than-official-tally-new-study-suggests

But yeah! CCP figures that are also fed to W.H.O. are totally trustworthy! Nice talk. But there's clearly no point arguing when you offered nothing to the table.

Yeah, if you would read you would see that forbes is telling a different story than NTD. All countries have unidentified COVID-19 cases. In all countries the number is not reliable, a dark number is assumed that ranges between three or six times as much. China lies amidst that. All countries tended to adjust their criteria over time with more information.

But Forbes is talking about cases, not deaths, about four times as much cases, not 40 times as much deaths as NTD does. Deaths are a lot easier to recognize than infections, as a person dying is pretty obvious and there can only be discussion about the reason. There still is often a miscount of COVID-19 related deaths, for instance for Italy the number is estimated to be about double going by excess mortality. France, the UK and the US all added over 1000 deaths subsequentially to the statistics. There surely is some miscount in China too, but nobody in their right mind assumes 40 times as much deaths. So, to conclude it: the Forbes-articles does not at all support the outlandish claim by NTD/Epoch Times.

Cases definitely doesn't equate to deaths. But that doesn't mean some deaths are not related to the case. Those are not mutually exclusive.

You and I will never know what the "true" figure is till an independent investigation happens. CCP has made it clear that it doesn't want to do that. It will only allow parties it trusts which are those that align with them.

So at this point, bringing up statistical figures of a regime with a very long track record of lying as "arguments" is a very brain dead move.

You can say what you want about NTD or Epoch Times "blowing it out of proportion". I clearly said "Take it as you will". In the end, nothing changed in this discussion. Your counter argument that CCP did not fuck this up holds no water in this discussion.

Meanwhile my initial argument is still supported by the actual actions of CCP. You cannot say they did not cause such a big problem for the rest of the world by withholding information as long as they can about the gravity of the pandemic. They imprisoned a doctor that tried to warn about a potential human to human transmission. Playing the race card when travel bans were set against them. Coercing W.H.O. to exclude Taiwan despite them having the best response. The list goes on.

For you, CCP clearly did nothing wrong and we should trust them!