Official Thread: The Impeachment of President Donald Trump

[Runa216]

padib said:

That's true, we have the same problem over here. I understand what he means now. Thanks for reminding me.

Runa216 said:

I'm also Canadian, but I do have an agenda because this is a global community and I want my friends south of the border to live safe, prosperous lives. Not lives marred by that cheeto tyrant. Everyone deserves compassion, nobody should have the right to deny that. Not even the president. 

And trust me, I'd like nothing more than for Democrats and Republicans to get along and find common ground and compromise. The ideal forms of government are when the liberal left and the conservative right find solutions that best help the largest number of people. There is room for left-wing and right-wing politics in any democracy, as there needs to be a balance between personal liberty and freedom with the costs needed to ensure that society as a whole is better for everyone. 

The problem is that modern Republicans do not stand for what traditional right-wing politics are supposed to represent. Right-wing politics, at its core, stands for freedom from government control. The idea that a person should be able to do what they want without the government getting involved. But that's not what the modern right actually stands for. They represent xenophobia, controlling of other people's sex lives, pushing of religion, guns guns guns, denying climage change if it means more free capital, Controlling women's bodies, and tradition over progression. If they were crying only about the gubmint telling them what to do and how to live their lives, then I'd be more sympathetic. as it stands, they are trying to control others based on their morals while crying foul and claiming to be the victim. They are actively repressing gays, women, minorities, trans folk, atheists, and anyone else who has a modern or progressive lifestyle because it's not about freedom anymore, it's about maintaining the status quo at all costs. They don't care about freedom, they literally stand for the exact opposite of what they claim to be about all while decrying the left for their supposed transgressions while the Left is more centrist. 

So I don't know why people are whining when people rightly vilify the current republicans. They are villains. They legitimately are the bad guys. They're hypocrites, a black mark on their party's frankly positive overall history. They are a group that, as a whole, celebrate oppression while crying about how the left oppress them. They don't want freedom, they want freedom for them to do things the way they want without repercussion but don't want the same for those who have vastly different values. They want tradition and resist change, even positive change. They liked it better when black folks sat at the back of the bus, women were relegated to the kitchen, homos had the faggotry beaten out of them to turn them into real men, sports mattered more than academics, and God was the only source of morality. 

From my perspective, and what I've seen, Liberals/Democrats are pushing the values we need. They are the ones who accept the cost of net gain and understand that taxes need to be paid, social programs need to be maintained, and laws need to be reformed to change with the times while Republicans/Conservatives are resisting these changes and stomping around like petulant children becuase two guys wanted to fuck without having to worry about literally being lynched. 

I treat this situation as an us vs them mentality becuase that's what it's become, thanks almost entirely to the republicans. 

And keep in mind I truly believe a balance between right-wing and left-wing politics need to be found. I just don't think that the current 'right' has 'making the world a better place for everyone' on their mind and are too busy trying to keep things the way they were, regardless of how bad it is over time. 

I see where you're coming from. It is important to underline those fundamental issues with certain people.

The issue though is, what sources tell us this? Are there polls that show this, or is it only what we hear from certain leaders, is it only what we see in certain closed circles. These issues exist on both sides, the far right and the far left. That's why I agree with your idea of balance. And also to point out that, while on these fundamental items Trump hasn't shown to be a leader for change, he hasn't (during his time as president) done something in the wrong direction (apart from what could be understood as xenophobia at the border). At the same time he did things to help the citizens of America stand taller on the international front, especially economically. Balance also begins in how we judge people, groups of people, it starts with us. Only people can make this world better, not just presidents or politicians. It's important that people stay cool and meet in the middle, come out of their comfort zones and debate to let the best ideas stand out. From my perspective, Trump was bashed by the media and the extreme left, or by disgruntled voters of the democratic party who hoped that Hilary would be elected, while most of what he was saying, to me, was not so offensive, and showed to me that he wanted to strengthen America. That leaves a bad feeling as an observer. Sure he was a jerk, he was abrasive, but that is his leadership style, aggressive. And in that sense it's both his strength and his weakness. But in the end, I felt that an anti-Trump movement was created at first by a minority, and it blew up into something that, to me, shouldn't really happen in America.

Life is my source. Actions speak louder than words and you can tell these are the values they have due to the bills they pass, the bills they don't pass, the way they act around others, the people they elect, the fundamentals of their campaigns. If a person who outwardly pushes ideals of racism and xenophobia gets elected, the logical conclusion is that those who voted for him support his racism and xenophobia. Same with ecology, same with religion and gun rights and sexuality and gender equality. You can easily decipher what matters to this party by observing what politicians they elect to represent them. 

Why is this so difficult to understand for most people. Nobody's ever going to come out and say "I hate all people from this race", becuase that would be stupid. But say "We're going to literally build a wall to keep these people out while simultaneously making it even harder for these people to enter our country legally to the point we might as well be proposing a ban" says the same thing while not sounding as bad. In the end, the result is the same, and 52 million people still voted for that shit stain of a human, and now the senate has agreed that his actions have gone too far. 

This is a pretty obvious and one-sided discussion.

Also, holy shit no Trump did not 'do anything to make America look good on the international front." Ask a thousand people from random parts all over the world and 995 of them will say Trump is a goddamn joke and making that country look bad. Because he is. 

You're also wrong about 'Trump just being bashed by the media'. Again, this isn't some bipartisan con job or smear campaign, he has a well-documented history of lies, ineptitude, childish behaviour, lies, aggression, hatred, lies, ignorance, sensationalism, lies, and more lies. He lies so much. He floats from one lie to the next it's gotten too hard to keep up with them. Literally over half the things he says are lies, fabrications, or blatant misrepresentations of the data. I can't listen to five minutes of him without having to pause once a second to subconsiously say "No, that's wrong, here's the real stat." He says shitty things and does shitty things and conjures up falsehoods with such consistency and fervor that I wouldn't be surprised if he woke himself up every morning by looking in the mirror and calling himself Jesus. Politifact polled everything he said this year (2019), and found he lied MORE THAN 2016, 2017, and 2018 BY A WIDE MARGIN, SO NOT ONLY DID HE GET ELECTED ON BULLSHIT BUT HE'S GETTING EMBOLDENED AND AS A RESULT IS GETTING WORSE.

Not you in particular, but I don't care if [the royal] you are a bigoted, traditonalist, religious, hate-filled person (Again, the royal 'you' as a general statement, not aimed at any one person), I don't know how anyone could trust Trump based on his assault on reality. He's so far removed from anything resembling the truth that I wonder if this is all a game to him or something, because there's absolutely no way he's actually that delusional. He just says what he says with so much confidence and repetition that morons believe him. 

Repeating the same lie doesn't make it the truth, no matter how sure of yourself you are. The fact that 52 million people fell for it makes me absolutely hate and disrespect at least 52 million Americans. Not the other 250 million, but the 52 million who voted for him? yeah, they're all fools. Or assholes. Or bigots. Or whatever. They just are. That's who they voted in to represent them. 

Actions do in fact speak louder than words.