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MrWayne said:
Qwark said:

That's one way of percieving equality the left/social conviction that social equality equals the equal of outcome construct.

The liberal perception follows the line of thought that societal equality equates equality of oppurtunity, which is quite well established. A women can reach great places of power within Germany, hell Merkel is probably Europe is most influencefull and powerful person.

Also there are also fields like education and healthcare where man are in the minority, should those change to to reach gender equality in your perception. 

I do think real equality is equality of outcome however i also think that there is only one way or should I say one formula to achieve equality of outcome.

equality of oppurtunity  +  time  =  equality of outcome

So if equality of opportunity is achieved it will eventually lead to equality of outcome, if not, equality of opportunity was never really achieved in the first place.

That's only true if you count that every group of people, whether its gender religions or races and person are inherently the same and have the same hopes and dreams. In some cultures especially Asian ones which outperform us being a doctor or lawyer has a very high status.

Man and woman are also inherently different (still equals of course). Aside from obvious body changes the Psych and brain of woman largely differ from males which is why women in general have more talent for teaching, life sciences, healthcare etc.

So if I would state the formula it is as follows and gross oversimplification:

Status + Culture + Talents + Time + Equal oppurtunities = Outcome. Which does not always have to be very comparable to an other group of people.

For instance I studied Landscape and Environment Management, something a bit of a Dutch thing. As with most Spatial and Environmental studies its a field in which Dutch white males have a high representation, but that doesn't mean there is a direct inequality. 

Since we all have the freedom of individual choice and we choose what we like and your background, culture, religion, gender etc. are all very relevant for that choice. So if a said group of people chooses a different field of studie.

Asians are overrepresented in comparison with other races in technical studies for example, probably because culture, background, expectations etc. than that doesn't mean an Asian can't follow the same studie as I did. Some might choose to do so and have the same chance as succeeding as me. Hé has an equal oppurtunity of succeeding as me. 

The difference is I see equality on the level of the individual as a liberal (college is free over here) and you see it for the society as the left prefers too. And if you purely look at the oppurtunities of the individual a black female has as much chance to succeed for her education as her white male co-student.

Whether her environment supports her as much is another story but has few to do with equality of oppurtunitie, especially on an individual level which is how I see equality of oppurtunity. 



Please excuse my (probally) poor grammar