By using this site, you agree to our Privacy Policy and our Terms of Use. Close
thismeintiel on 03 June 2018
Edit Thread
NightlyPoe said:
thismeintiel said:

1.  I have sales numbers to point to.  You don't lose those from some fabled fatigue.  Especially when that fatigue supposedly only activated for the 3rd movie in 3 years.  Man, people got tired of SW faster than some other franchises.  Crazy since the first two films were absolute hits.  And what will be the excuse if Ep 9 bombs, or greatly underperforms, and its been 1 1/2 years since Solo?  Still fatigue?  But, you can interpret those numbers however you wish.

2.  Yes, negativity attracts clicks.  But not just from those who absolutely agree with the person.  It also attracts people who disagree.  Your Jim Sterling example proves that very well.  Death threats with 100s of thumbs up.  Likewise, for the SW videos there should be tons of comments that disagree, and that Like Bar shouldn't be so one-sided if there were so many who disagreed with them.  Kinda like what happened with the Ghostbusters '16 trailer.

3. It doesn't matter if the "boxes" were empty.  This is where a competent writer and/or director steps in and fills those boxes with great reveals.  Not a hack who comes in and basically trolls the fandom in the name of subversion for subversion's sake.  And no, Luke was not going to hide (and die.)  That was the BS Rian Johnson came up with.  You don't go to hide from the world and make a map to your exact location.  The movie made it more like he was searching for something.

Nope, that's a very shitty reason.  This is freaking Luke here.  The guy who was told by both Yoda and Obi Wan that he may have to sacrifice his friends in order for him to live and to become a great Jedi who could take on the Emperor and Vader.  Not Luke.  He would not leave his friends to die, even if he had just a small a chance to save them.  This is also the same Luke that was told Vader was too far gone to save.  There was no chance to get his father back.  But, Luke sensed some good still in him and he refused to give up.  These are the exact same complaints Mark Hamil told Rian, Luke would not give up and he would have tried everything to save his nephew.  And he sure as fuck would not have saddled his sister and best friend with his fuck up, running off to die.

Yes, Rey was a Mary Sue in TFA.  However, many thought that may be explained by some Jedi lineage and she would train further with Luke.  It wouldn't have fixed it, but it would have helped a lot.  TLJ actually worsens the problem.  Not only does she not train (5 secs of flinging around a lightsaber does not count), she turns out to be the daughter of drunk nobodies, AND she's shown to be the most powerful Jedi EVER.  She can take down Elite Guards, even though its only her 2nd lightsaber fight.  She can pick up a ton of boulders while barely concentrating.  The only scene where she comes up against resistance is with Snoke, which was supposed to show how powerful he was, not how less of a Mary Sue she is.  Though, he still goes out like a bitch in the end.  In fact, given the other scenes, it actually feels out of place.

As for Ben getting hurt, and not MaRey Sue, that's just BS.  They were in the middle of a symmetrical room.  They flew back the exact same way.  It just served to show her more of a Mary Sue and it ruined Ben's intimidation factor, as he's easily knocked out and wakes up like minutes later, with Hux almost killing him beforehand.  It also creates yet another plot hole.  He wakes up minutes later, I'd say at least 10-15 mins since she has time to escape.  Then, they have time to land AT-ATs (very far away for some reason), have the shitty craft scene, but Rey gets there just in time to save everyone?  She should have been there ages ago, inside with them.  There are just so many of these holes in plot and logic that it is impossible to enjoy that film.

Finn didn't have to be a comedy relief character.  In fact, he does more than that in TFA, while still being humorous.  Rian is the one who chose not to do anything with him and stick him with comedy relief.  We could have had him trying to run away like a coward, at first, wanting to meet up with Rey and skip town.  But then he eventually sacrifices himself for his friends.  Maybe that causes Rey to join Ben in this 3rd option, to finally end the war.  Or maybe they actually do something with him and Phasma, instead of jack.  There are many more options than that.  Any of them more interesting than Finn/Rose side quest.  Hmm.  The only black lead relegated to the comic relief and no real character development.  Using Lucasfilm's logic, that says a lot about Rian Johnson.

4.  Google is your friend.  I did enough citing in the TLJ thread.  If you want to not believe me, that's your choice.  Just know that you are wrong.

1.  You have a shaky opinion of what sales numbers mean.  You don't have proof of anything.  There is no proof that half the audience is boycotting to be found.

2.  In this case those that enjoyed the movie just went on with their lives.  It was only a smallish group that was dedicated to tearing it down.  In Breath of the Wild's case, people were sitting there watching Metacritic and were angry that someone ruined the score.  Different situations.  Same thing happened with Black Panther when someone gave it a negative review and people were angry even though the movie hadn't come out yet.

For the most part, those that like TLJ don't really care if someone else doesn't like it.  And I will remind you that the audience scores for TLJ were high.

3.  The mystery boxes were a distraction.  The important ones were answered.  The unimportant ones were discarded.

It wasn't subversion for subversion sake.  It was a well-executed story about the power, humanity, and worth of legends.  You only looked at Luke feeling bad and stopped there, which is a shame.

"It's freaking Luke here" is not a character trait.  Luke was not perfect in the Original Trilogy either.  He has Anakin's flaws, only not as strongly.  This was repeated throughout the OT and it caused him to abandon his training and later almost fall to the Dark Side.  Finally, he made a mistake that he couldn't take back.  It works as character motivation if you understand that he's a man beneath the legend.  The movie tried to challenge you and you failed I'm afraid.

Rey being overpowered was unfixable.  Giving her a Jedi lineage does nothing to make her so overpowered so quickly.  All that could be done is to bring her down a peg.  The most powerful potential Force-user on record was born to slavery on Tatooine.  Not sure what lineage has to do with anything.

There's nothing wrong with one person getting injured and another being okay in an accident.  I have no idea why you think that two people in a room on a ship that just suffered an explosion have to be injured exactly the same.  That's just a silly complaint with no merit whatsoever even in the real world.

Finn was awful in TFA as well.  He's a lost cause that will always bring down the film whenever's he's in it and not worth discussing.  They should just kill him off and cut their losses.

4.  I don't do your research for you.

Ok, I'm just going to stop this convo here.  Lol, I'm just afraid I can't take the whole "TLJ was so deep and you haters just didn't get it" talk and take the conversation seriously anymore.  That movie was as deep as a puddle after a light rain.  But hey, I'll be here when Ep 9 underperforms because "fatigue."  Or maybe you'll be right and after 1 1/2 years SW will rebound and make another $2B.