NightlyPoe said:
1. Different cultures have different sets of concerns and beliefs. You have not given me anything that makes me believe that the rest of the world is significantly more hostile to fairly mild SJW material than Americans. 2. Umm, okay. Star Wars ups viewership. That's not exactly a surprise. Also, negativity attracts even more clicks. Again, not a surprise. As our old friend Arlo pointed out that negative videos tend to attract more views than positive videos (even on a mostly positive channel like his). Youtube commentators thrive on hot takes, even unpopular ones. It doesn't mean that it makes up a majority of viewers in anything. How much of a bump in name recognition did Jim Sterling get for giving Breath of the Wild a mediocre review? There may be people who didn't like the movie, but it's not as universal as you seem to believe. You're just stuck looking for ways to prove your point. 3. First, I should note that I do not have a high opinion of TFA. It was shallow as can be and its lack of a gameplan for the full trilogy. The "mystery boxes" were always empty. Abrams is the master of creating shallow entertainment that fools people into thinking he has depth. It's a terrible way to make movies and the only good thing I can say about his being hired is that at least it got him away from Star Trek. Your complaints about Luke in exile should be directed at TFA. It has the map to a guy trying to hide. And it has Luke hiding while the galaxy goes to hell. They literally stuck him there because they were afraid he'd overpower the movie. The map, at least, has an explanation as everyone knew that Luke was going to fine the Jedi Temple (per Han's dialogue), they just didn't know where that was. Hence the need for a map. I'm not sure what better explanation you wanted for why Luke was hiding on a planet, but TLJ's explanation of his being responsible in a moment of weakness of sending his nephew to the Dark Side and getting the rest of his students either killed or sent to the Dark Side as well serves for a perfectly valid reason why he would be ashamed and broken. Rey being a Mary Sue was also a problem with TFA. TLJ couldn't rectify it, but they did tone it down a bit and even had her completely outmatched by Snoke and needing to be saved. She tried to trust Ben, but he still had too much hate. There was no 3rd way, just Anakin Skywalker's plan all over again. Also, different people get injured in separate ways during accidents. There's nothing even strange about Ben being knocked unconscious while Rey had time to get away. Finn is a former child soldier and the comedy relief character. That, to quote Mark Hamill, it's a conceptual nightmare that can't be fixed and is flat out offensive combination. He adds nothing to the series. 4. Oh, so it wasn't the studio. It was analysts that you... won't actually cite. Gotcha. |
But, the problem is they just screwed up any arc he could have had. One, it would have been more interesting to have him the Jedi, instead of Luke wannabe. And in the 2nd one, they wasted him by using him as just a side character in the Disney Casino side quest. No development at all. In fact, he was about to do something interesting, by sacrificing himself to save others. This is something he really would have never done before, though they didn't really build up to it in TLJ. But, of course, like anything good they may have had going, they ruin it.1. I have sales numbers to point to. You don't lose those from some fabled fatigue. Especially when that fatigue supposedly only activated for the 3rd movie in 3 years. Man, people got tired of SW faster than some other franchises. Crazy since the first two films were absolute hits. And what will be the excuse if Ep 9 bombs, or greatly underperforms, and its been 1 1/2 years since Solo? Still fatigue? But, you can interpret those numbers however you wish.
2. Yes, negativity attracts clicks. But not just from those who absolutely agree with the person. It also attracts people who disagree. Your Jim Sterling example proves that very well. Death threats with 100s of thumbs up. Likewise, for the SW videos there should be tons of comments that disagree, and that Like Bar shouldn't be so one-sided if there were so many who disagreed with them. Kinda like what happened with the Ghostbusters '16 trailer.
3. It doesn't matter if the "boxes" were empty. This is where a competent writer and/or director steps in and fills those boxes with great reveals. Not a hack who comes in and basically trolls the fandom in the name of subversion for subversion's sake. And no, Luke was not going to hide (and die.) That was the BS Rian Johnson came up with. You don't go to hide from the world and make a map to your exact location. The movie made it more like he was searching for something.
Nope, that's a very shitty reason. This is freaking Luke here. The guy who was told by both Yoda and Obi Wan that he may have to sacrifice his friends in order for him to live and to become a great Jedi who could take on the Emperor and Vader. Not Luke. He would not leave his friends to die, even if he had just a small a chance to save them. This is also the same Luke that was told Vader was too far gone to save. There was no chance to get his father back. But, Luke sensed some good still in him and he refused to give up. These are the exact same complaints Mark Hamil told Rian, Luke would not give up and he would have tried everything to save his nephew. And he sure as fuck would not have saddled his sister and best friend with his fuck up, running off to die.
Yes, Rey was a Mary Sue in TFA. However, many thought that may be explained by some Jedi lineage and she would train further with Luke. It wouldn't have fixed it, but it would have helped a lot. TLJ actually worsens the problem. Not only does she not train (5 secs of flinging around a lightsaber does not count), she turns out to be the daughter of drunk nobodies, AND she's shown to be the most powerful Jedi EVER. She can take down Elite Guards, even though its only her 2nd lightsaber fight. She can pick up a ton of boulders while barely concentrating. The only scene where she comes up against resistance is with Snoke, which was supposed to show how powerful he was, not how less of a Mary Sue she is. Though, he still goes out like a bitch in the end. In fact, given the other scenes, it actually feels out of place.
As for Ben getting hurt, and not MaRey Sue, that's just BS. They were in the middle of a symmetrical room. They flew back the exact same way. It just served to show her more of a Mary Sue and it ruined Ben's intimidation factor, as he's easily knocked out and wakes up like minutes later, with Hux almost killing him beforehand. It also creates yet another plot hole. He wakes up minutes later, I'd say at least 10-15 mins since she has time to escape. Then, they have time to land AT-ATs (very far away for some reason), have the shitty craft scene, but Rey gets there just in time to save everyone? She should have been there ages ago, inside with them. There are just so many of these holes in plot and logic that it is impossible to enjoy that film.
Finn didn't have to be a comedy relief character. In fact, he does more than that in TFA, while still being humorous. Rian is the one who chose not to do anything with him and stick him with comedy relief. We could have had him trying to run away like a coward, at first, wanting to meet up with Rey and skip town. But then he eventually sacrifices himself for his friends. Maybe that causes Rey to join Ben in this 3rd option, to finally end the war. Or maybe they actually do something with him and Phasma, instead of jack. There are many more options than that. Any of them more interesting than Finn/Rose side quest. Hmm. The only black lead relegated to the comic relief and no real character development. Using Lucasfilm's logic, that says a lot about Rian Johnson.
4. Google is your friend. I did enough citing in the TLJ thread. If you want to not believe me, that's your choice. Just know that you are wrong.
