StarDoor said:
Turkish said:
"In other words, pointing out that Sony's profits were a hundred million dollars or so more in one quarter is a pretty poor argument to show that Sony is more profitable or more popular." No one made that argument, the argument was that Playstation was more profitable and popular, not Sony. This interaction started whether a spun off Playstation would be worth more than Nintendo, as did the argument which company is worth more today. And about Nintendoes most popular console, of course I meant their fastest selling console.
Both my statements are correct. Playstation is indeed more profitable and popular as they sell more consoles and make more money, and Sony has a bigger market cap. Not sure what arguments need to be started here. You're right you don't need to hear about my travels, because you already know PS4 is indeed the best selling and most popular console on the maket, my anecdotes only explain Sony ain't lying.
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How would PlayStation alone be worth more than Nintendo when Sony has five divisions that are more profitable than PlayStation, yet the overall market cap for all of Sony combined is only 5% higher than Nintendo?
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Turkish said:
Division performance ranked from best to worst:
Semiconductors 55.4Bn yen profit
Financial Services 46.2Bn yen profit
Music 25Bn yen profit
Imaging Products & Solutions (IP&S) 23.2Bn yen profit
Home Entertainment & Sound (HE&S) 22.6Bn yen profit
Game & Network Services (G&NS) 17.7Bn yen profit
Mobile Communications (MC) 3.6Bn yen profit
Pictures 9.5Bn yen loss
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Apparently, you must think that Sony could multiply its stock value by six times if all of its divisions split up into separate companies.
Also, saying that Sony sells more consoles is dubious, since the only timeframe for which that's true is the last 4 years:
http://gamrconnect.vgchartz.com/thread.php?id=230847&page=1
They've only sold more since the PS4 launched: In other words, they've sold more only when you look at Nintendo's worst generation and exclude the 3DS's best two years on top of that. During the fifth gen, Nintendo was ahead. During the sixth gen, Sony and Nintendo sold nearly equal amounts. During the seventh gen, Nintendo was significantly ahead. Only during the eighth gen has Sony been significantly ahead.
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Saying Sony selling more consoles is not dubious lol, it's a fact. You don't need to go 5 or 10 years to claim otherwise. "nintendos worst generation" is an excuse, can also be said about "sony's worst generation".
KLAMarine said:
Turkish said:
Is not hard to look up latest financial reports. PS4 division made 17.7bn yen profit vs Nintendoes 16.2 last q, and they just launched their most popular console.
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It's difficult for me: I'm not in the habit of looking up financial reports but going off of some recent articles, sounds like Nintendo has done pretty well:
Nintendo: $190 million in profit out of $1.38 billion in net sales
https://mynintendonews.com/2017/07/26/nintendo-returns-to-profit-thanks-to-nintendo-switch/
PlayStation: $160 million in operating profit out of revenue of $3.15 billion
http://comicbook.com/gaming/2017/08/01/playstation-4-sales-slump-gaming-profits-down-sony-earnings-report/
I'm not a business major, far from it. I believe profit and operating profit are two different things as are net sales and revenue so these figures are likely not directly comparable...
Also, are these for the same periods of time? I often hear about quarters and to this day, I'm not entirely sure what time periods these quarters span...
Seriously, this financial stuff just doesn't interest me much. I just hope the games I like are successful.
Turkish said:
Playstation has bigger brand recognition, do a representative poll worldwide and more people will know Playstation than Nintendo
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So? Has a representative poll been done worldwide?
Turkish said:
from all my travels in Europe, Middle East and Asia Playstation was the most associated with gaming.
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Your travels covered 3/4 of the world? You polled 5.6 billion people on this matter in your travels?
Turkish said:
It's been a continuously used name for over 20 years.
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Over 30 years for Nintendo.
Turkish said:
Playstation makes big money and let others make big money, it's how 3rd parties survive. PSN until recently was making more money than all of Nintendo, that storefront alone is worth $.
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This may be so but why is it that by the metric YOU brought up, Nintendo is currently valued more highly than PlayStation?
Why might this be?
Recall you stated before that
Turkish said:
If Sony spun off Playstation, it would be worth more than Nintendo alone.
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Yeah they're for the same period, last quarter. I'm comparing operating income for both companies, which is exactly what those numbers are.
JWeinCom said:
Turkish said:
"In other words, pointing out that Sony's profits were a hundred million dollars or so more in one quarter is a pretty poor argument to show that Sony is more profitable or more popular." No one made that argument, the argument was that Playstation was more profitable and popular, not Sony. This interaction started whether a spun off Playstation would be worth more than Nintendo, as did the argument which company is worth more today. And about Nintendoes most popular console, of course I meant their fastest selling console.
Both my statements are correct. Playstation is indeed more profitable and popular as they sell more consoles and make more money, and Sony has a bigger market cap. Not sure what arguments need to be started here. You're right you don't need to hear about my travels, because you already know PS4 is indeed the best selling and most popular console on the maket, my anecdotes only explain Sony ain't lying.
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Yeah, I used Sony when I meant playstation. My bad. I still have no idea how showing that the games/services division made more money in one quarter shows that they are more profitable. That's like... not how business works.
If you meant fastest selling, you should have said fastest selling... because that is not synonymous. Either way it's completely irrelevant to the point you were making. Again, Sony lost money as they launched the PS4. So there's no reason to expect a launch to be a profitable time, or to expect that this will be the most profitable point of the switch's lifespan.
As I've said several times... market cap is not the value of a company... Even if it were, Sony's market value is slightly higher than Nintendo's... that's all of Sony. So unless every other Sony division is less than worthless (worth negative dollars) then I don't see how the playstation division can be worth more than Nintendo.
Playstation 4 is the most popular console on the market... which doesn't really have much to do with whether the Playstation division is worth more than Nintendo. But yay for them, I guess?
Of course Sony ain't lying. I'm sure Sony has people who know how to properly evaluate a company's worth, and wouldn't be saying these kinds of nonsensical things.
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Most popular console and fastest selling console mean the same thing in that context, it is factually the most popular console for the same timeframe. How else would you interpret that? That a console 4 months on the market is already their biggest selling, why would I ever claim that?
"So unless every other Sony division is less than worthless (worth negative dollars) then I don't see how the playstation division can be worth more than Nintendo"
Look at the Ebay situation, when they spun off Paypal, it overtook its parent company's market cap, now it's worth double.
