Nintendo and Sony have to bring out Handheld/Phone hybrids in 2017.

[KBG29]

Darwinianevolution said:

Still does not answer the question of what could Sony and Nintendo do in regards to making their own phone and/or mobile OS. If the Xperia is as big of a loss as you describe it, why would Sony try to push their own brand of phone even further? Like I said, gaming is not the key to make a phone successful, it's just one of the many elementd to take into account with them. The reason why mobile is hurting handhelds so much is because parents can now get a cheap gaming device (that the kids would need anyway) that has a giant backlog of free to play and serves as a multimedia/internet browser device. Nintendo can push their mobile offerings into android or IOs, but if they tried to lock the market with their own closed OS or phone, it would fail.

And about Microsoft's UWA system. Why would the backing of XBox Live games be that much useful? I doubt many phone users care about the kind of games you could get on XBox Live, and many XBox Live users would rather get their games on much more powerful hardware.

Sony should push their own phone over loosing Xperia sales, because every unit would actually make money since it would be part of Sony's ecosystem. Right now they sell an Xperia phone at a loss, and then Google makes money on every interaction users have on the device. It is the most illogical business model they could possibly have. A phone that is running on the PS4 OS would have web browsing, and a massive catalog of free games, along with the games you already own on PS4. It would be a massive value over iOS or Android for any PS4 owner. 

UWA and Xbox Anywhere would be a massive boost for Microsofts next venture into mobile. First you have the same access to all of your apps on Windows 10, Xbox, and Phone. Then you can continue your adventures on the road, or play COD, NBA 2K, etc. at lunch break, or at the DMV, or the doctor, which would be much better than the current crop of mobile games.

Captain_Yuri said:

And how is that much different than what the Nexus had? Sure, Google can select the hardware but the Nexus 6P had flagship specs when it released just like Pixel does with Google's OS support and how well did that do? Oh thats right, didn't even make a dent. Not to mention that Pixel's hardware specs are standard flagship specs just like the Nexus was (just obviously the newest itteration). Google didn't make a custom CPU/GPU/etc for the Pixel. There isn't anything unique inside the Pixel that makes it different in terms of specs that the Nexus didn't have at the time of its relative release.

Pixel is way diferent than Nexus. Nexus was just an experiement, and had nothing special except the most bare bones version of Android. With Pixel Google is adding deeper intergration, and optimizing Android around the device, making it much more iPhone like than Nexus or any Android ever was. 

"All Google Play Software will be optimized for Pixel." What??? Why would all Google Play software will be optimized for a phone that doesn't even have market share? Developers on the Play Store won't do that because how would they make money from that? Just targeting a phone that doesn't even have much market share at all. And why would Google make Pixel the only choice on Android? That doesn't even make any sense. Pixel isn't even made by Google, the manufacturer is HTC... Google just tells HTC the designs and etc. And HTC has their own phones to think about. If Google made Pixel the only phone on Android, then HTC wouldn't even make phones for them because it will cripple HTC's own phones as well as every other manufacturer. Makes zero sense

Everything will run better on Pixel, because the whole OS will be optimized around it, including all development tools. Other manufactures will still be able to make phones that use android, but google is going to make it harder and harder to compete, and continue to give benifits to Pixel users.

What on earth? Smartphones aren't even x86, how are they gonna manage that?

Yes, Apple and Google phones run on ARM, but Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendos should run on x86. x86 is very capable of being used in mobile, and it is time it is utilized, and gives some competition to ARM in this field.

You aren't really explaining how though considering all the competition. They can't simply port the games to phones and lower the res. It doesn't work like that... If its like PSNow, there are will be latency and response problems since the LTE tower is so far away and not to mention the datacaps.

They can absolutly run the games at lower res, they wouldn't even be ports. All games on PS4 and XBO already run on scalable engines. That is why the Scorpio and the Neo are happening. With the same CPU and GPU in the PS4 at 10nm FinFET, and reduced GPU cores, running the games on PS4 phone would be very little work.

 

Conina said:

KBG29 said:

With Googles recent announcement of the Pixel, the move to take full control of the Android platform is well under way. I have been screaming that this was comming for the last 5 years,...

... and the last 5 years you were wrong. You are probably also wrong the next 5 years if you keep on playing that broken record.

-I was absolutly right the last 5 years. HTC, Smasung, Sony, and every other Android based phone company is in serious trouble now that Pixel is here. Google is taking control of their platform, and are going to optimize Android to Pixel, and give Pixel many exclusive features not offered to the competition. As for the next 5, I may be wrong about Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo, but everyone on Android will get hit hard by Pixel.

and have absolutly condemned Sony and Nintendo for their decision to not bring out phone versions of the Vita and 3DS. On the Sony side it is even more rediculous in the fact that they make phones and have thousands of patents...

... while Apple, Google, Samsung and a few others have tens of thousands mobile phone patents.

-Sony is equal in patents to Google, Apple, Samsung, or Microsoft as far as this goes. They have been in the Phone business longer than any of them, and they own all of Ericssons patents as well.

and yet abandoned Vita to instead loose billions on Android. Now the Xperia line once a brand that sold 40 million devices a year, has dropped to the point that they only expect to sell around 15 million this year. 15 million could have easily been achieved every year if they had continued to release Vita revisions,...

Easily!... Yeah, right!

-Yeah, right. A 5th gen 4G LTE Vita with 4GB of RAM, 128GB of built in Storage, a vibrant app Store, 12MP cameras front and back, NFC, Sony Pay, a finger print reader, L2 and R2 buttons, and SD expandable memory. If that was on the market today, they would have sold way more than 15 Million units. They could have easily had all of this if they would have put the 3 Billion dollars they lost on Xperia into Vita instead.

...and it would have made them billions as all users would be within their ecosystem.

Sony had its own mobile ecosystem: PS Mobile. Most third party developers didn't care to port their mobile apps and games to PSM and even Sony itself didn't support it and released Android and iOS apps instead.

-PlayStation Mobile was never supported for multiple reasons. First it was made for the Xperia Play, a device which Sony never wanted to make because they did not want Ericsson anywhere near the PlayStation brand. Second, PSM was not allowed to be installed on phones via Google Play. Third, Vita was never offered as a phone, so people never had any use for 3rd party apps on the device.

 Xperia Play and PSM were not PlayStation Phone. They were bastard products from a relationship gone bad between Sony and Ericsson. They in no way shape or form, have any relevince to how well a PlayStation Phone could sell with real support.

With that said, now is the time to make the move.

NOW is the time to make their move? Wouldn't it be better if they had made their move before each iOS and Android had more than 1 billion active devices?

-Yes it would have been much smarter to start this back with Vita and 3DS, but they done F'ed that up. Now, we are at the perfect time with NX, PS4 Pro, and PSVR launching though. All of these devices are looking to change the way people look at PlayStation and Nintendo. They are trying to expand and show that they are the dominate game device, but they are also highly capable boxes capable of replacing your PC, Your Cable Box, and give you completely new experiences never seen before.

Pixel is going to be the out right dominate phone in Android land.

Sure, one of the most expensive Android devices will dominate "Android land". Samsung, Huawei and some other big Chinese manufacturers  will roll over and die instead of offering competitive devices.

-Pixel will absolulty dominate Android, but the others won't roll over and die. Samsung will start to heavily promote Tizen phones, and Chinese manufactures will start to move to Chinese based open OS's. There will still be a hand full of low budget Android manufactures, but Google will own the flagship market.

 

Slimebeast said:

But who on earth wants to play PS4 games on a small phone screen with crappy touch controls?

It's wasted money. Plus such a smartphone would cost more than a PS4 Pro.

The market for a dedicated Sony gaming smartphone would be minimal, like 300,000 people. And that wouldn't even cover the development costs.

The market for this would be way more than 300,000 people. Sony sold almost 15M Vita in 5 years, and it is worthless as a mobile, and had very little software support. A Phone with access to the latest Call of Duty, Grand Theft Auto, Gran Turismo, and Uncharted would sell magnatudes better.

This would also not be a crappy touch control device. It would be a Vita like device, but slimmed down, with L2,R2 and L3,R3. It would be more than the Pro, but it would be right in line with other phones, and be a much better value.

VAMatt said:

KBG29 said:

Two Things,

1) Sony has no foot hold with Xperia. It is loosing them billions, with no hope of profits in the future, and is a brand that is on its way to selling less than 10 million units a year.

2) Why would Sony and Nintendo succeed when Microsoft failed? Simple, they are bringing something new to the market. Microsoft tried toenter the market as another me too slab phone. They did not capitalize on any of their assets,a dnt hey entered way to soon. Finally, it is not over for Microsoft in mobile. Once UWA builds a massive catalog, they will be back, and the next phone will have amazing app support, and be backed buy Xbox for games, and a much better Cortana and Bing. 

Pixel is not Nexus. Pixel is Google in full control of the Hardware and the OS. They are going to make Pixel the only choice on Android, with built in functionatly, that is only available on Pixel. All Google Play Store software will be optimized for Pixel, and the rest will be good luck. Samsung was smart enoug to see this coming and started Tizen a few years back, as a way to move on after Android. 

The big key to Sony and Nintendo entering the market is their home consoles. Sony especially can build the device right off the back of PS4. A new handheld and Phone that runs all PS4 software at 540p and checkerboard upscales to 1080p would be an awesome device, and would have home and mobile PlayStation working together to build a massive userbase. This is the way they can get support for Android and iOS ports for banking, trading, home security, fitness, etc., etc. apps on the devices.

The thing to remember is that they don't have to light the world on fire. They still make consoles even though they only sell 20 million a year. Windows PC sells 300 million unit s a year. However, consoles are specialized computers that have a focus on gaming and entertainment, and bring in billions even on the very small number of sales. 

In that same light. If Sony and Nintendo could move 20 million units a year compared to the 200 million iphones, then they will be doing just fine. In fact more than fine, becuase the profit per customer on 20 million phones would be substantialy greater than on 20 million handhelds.

How the hell would they sell 20MM per year?  Neither of them has been able to come close to that with their handhelds recently.  What would make you think that a massively expensive hybrid phone/gaming system would sell like that?

I have answered this many times above.