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bluesinG on 15 May 2008
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blykmik said:
@bluesinG
I understand your point, but to your logic I can then claim that even your definition of spin is "spin". There are always different frames of reference when people look at facts. Who determines which is the correct frame of reference that is not "spin"? So everything ever said is spin... and we'd be going in circles for a long time. ;)

I'd be more inclined to call something spin when it CHANGES the frames of reference to compare the same things using DIFFERENT criteria for each.

For instance, Microsoft saying they beat the Wii to 10 million sales in the US. Yes, that it is a fact. But they are talking about the "speed" at which they hit 10 million, yet they are using different time frames to judge that speed. 2.5 year time frame for the 360 and a 1.5 year time frame for the Wii. That is incongruent to start. That is using DIFFERENT criteria to judge sales speed.

That is true spin.

With regards to Microsoft's press releases about GTAIV selling better on the 360, I used the same frame of reference for both (LTD installed base). Microsoft again ignores the idea of judging from an even playing field and touts the raw numbers. In your definition, both Microsoft's statement of selling better on the 360 and my calibration against install bases are both spin. You're entitled to that...

...but what do you really believe is real? What is true? With a 2.5 to 1 console advantage in the Americas, all things being equal, shouldn't the GTAIV sales ratio be 2.5 to 1 also? Were you one that believed PlayStation brand loyalty meant something here? Did you believe the episodic content was going to give the 360 the boost?

Why is the sales ratio only at 1.67 to 1? I guess it's just gotta get spun one way or the other. But I would imagine that people not invested at all in this "war", when given all the facts, would have a very simple time making their judgments about those numbers.

...as for you last generation sales comparisons, yes... Nice spin. You compared first-run exclusive release sales on a monster install base, to aged re-releases on platform with a paltry install base. You couldn't get the "frames of reference" any different there.


I don't think there's anything for us to argue about here, as long as you accept my definition of "spin" as intentionally situating a set of facts within a positive or negative frame of reference. (Note that this definition does not assume that there is necessarily a "correct" frame of reference--only that the presenter tries to impose a particular frame.)

All I did was articulate this definition to show that you spun the GTA IV numbers, as did Microsoft. If someone wanted to present the GTA numbers without spin, they could simply say something like this: So far, GTA IV for the XBox360 has sold 4.37 million copies, and GTA IV for the PS3 has sold 3.29 million copies.

As for your question about my personal frame of reference, I do not own or plan to own an XBox360 or a PS3. I'm content with my Wii and PC. As a bystander to the Sony-Microsoft "war," I can see why both Microsoft and Sony fans might be pleased with the GTA IV numbers, and also why they both might be disappointed with them.