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happydolphin said:
darkknightkryta said:
happydolphin said:
darkknightkryta said:

How much of this is the case though?  Mind you, we'll never know.  But I still firmly believe that the Wii didn't expand the market as much as people think.  I personally think that the Wii was and still is in the Red Ocean.

The question then would be, how much non-gamer/casual to tradcore ratio was there with the PS2. If you think it's 100m, or in that vicinity, then the Wii not expanding the market would hold water to a certain degree.

However, Wii Sports had a very different appeal than most PS2 non-gamer/casual games, and that game sold 80m worldwide. So just that proves that the Wii expanded the market because with Wii Sports alone, which had a very distinct charm and appeal than most PS2 casual games, sold as much as 80m. So it's hard to argue that Nintendo didn't expand the blue ocean.

Add to this that the 360 and the PS3 sold together (not including move and kinect) some 117m or something like that. So it's hard to see so much of that be expanded market. If 90m of that is tradcore, then the PS2's non-gamer/casual total would be some 60m.

But for the Wii to be in the red ocean within the casual/non-gamer space, there would need to be another competitor. And at the time where Nintendo nabbed the crown, Sony was out of the ocean. So it was still blue ocean. But here I would agree with you if you said a more effective term should exist to describe this form of competition, where one grabs the spoils where another leaves off.

See that's the thing, I do think it's around 100 million.  100 exactly?  no, 80+, yes.

Okay, but then how much of the HD twin total do you attribute to tradcore? Without kinect+move the total sales are 119m (just recalculated). So how much of that was for tradcore?

70+ million.