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Darth Tigris on 13 February 2012
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thismeintiel said:
Darth Tigris said:
thismeintiel said:
Darth Tigris said:

Exactly.  Like profitability and gearing up for the future of gaming.

While your comment was interesting, it really didn't directly answer my questions.  The first one was quite straightforward, but I honestly didn't expect anyone to know the facts about the 2nd one without some high level insight into how the retail channel is maintained for these products.  Thanks anyway.

Your question already has been answered numerous times, but you choose to ignore it.  It must have to do with that whole latching on to whatever supports your position. 

No, it hasn't.  All I've seen is twisted reasoning when all I want is a link to a credible source saying that the PS3 SOLD more than the 360 in 2011.  I didn't say one didn't exist or that it's not true or anything like that.  I just want to see it clearly stated somewhere credible, like say .... someone from SONY?  An analyst?  Anyone anywhere that has confirmed sales data so we can finally and definitively put this thing to rest.  No, no one is providing it, yet they are convinced it's true and keep restating it repeatedly.  What is that????

And nobody answered the overshipping versus over-ordering question clearly either, probably because the term "overshipping" demonizes the console manufacturers and not the retailers.  And who wants to demonize retailers when all we care about is Nintendo vs. Sony vs. Microsoft, right?  *rollseyessomuchgetsdizzyandpukes*

I clearly explained it using MS own shipment numbers from 2010 and 2011, you choose to not except the fact that MS's shipment numbers were inflated by extra units shipped out in Q1 2011.  Again, MS usually ships ~1.5 consoles in Q1.  The only time they deviated from this was in Q1 2011, when they shipped out 2.7 million units to make up for shortages in 2010.  And again, if they had gotten out those units in 2010, then they would have only shipped ~3.5-3.9 million in 2011.  It has nothing to do with whether or not MS overshipped (mostly because retailers overestimated demand) or not, which I think there was very little of.  VGC knows this, and that is why we are not going to get any large adjustments that put the 360 on top by any significant margin. 

Even Seece, who had a thread where he predicted that the 360 would outsell the PS3, conceded that the PS3 most likely won, though not by as much as VGC had it.  And in fact, VGC did adjust their numbers slightly, as the PS3 was ahead by ~630K and is now ahead by ~535K.

So your answer is that the PS3 outselling the 360 for 2011 is based, not on any reported sell-through numbers, but shipping numbers.  Is it really hard to understand why that isn't convincing?  We're still talking nothing but shipments, which is in other ways being used to minimize what has been announced concerning the 360 being the top selling console ww for 2011 (based on SHIPPING numbers).  Shipping numbers being used to prove sell-through numbers.

The only factual conclusion that has been revealed is that there ISN'T any official source that clearly states who the sell-through leader was for 2011.  That's not an analytical opinion, just a fact.  

While I enjoy using VGC's numbers as an educated guess, I'll never be delusional about their inherent inaccuracy.  All polling done by samples are, but it's nice to at least have an estimate.  The consistent arguments, though, over differences that fall well into the admitted 5-10% error cushion, never cease to amaze me.  "Too close to call" just isn't good enough for some.