happydolphin said:
@bold. Yes, analog thumbsticks are something Nintendo brought to gaming. Simple fact. Explanation: The vectrex was not a thumbstick, and it did not have pressure sensitivity. It was analog, but not in the depth axis (again if I'm wrong here I need to be corrected). Ultimately, it was incredibly limited in comparison to the 64's input and ergonomics. Compare that to what I'll describe below.
@bold. No, they didn't improve on it. They revolutionized it. Nobody thought of that before, a thumbstick, and if they did, they didn't spend the R&D to tweak and test it, then to R&D software to best fit it. That is ALL Nintendo's money spent and legwork. Sony copied. Can you get that? It's not a minor improvement here, Nintendo invested significant R&D, Sony copied with less significant investment. When will you understand this simple concept? 2 elements to consider in the innovation: 1) Thumb stick. Frees up the index, and this design goes hand in hand with the trigger button innovation, all with one hand while the other focuses on 4 buttons. Before that, it could not be achieved on a basic controller, vaio also explained that to you. Basically, they took this:
And put it into this:
This is the innovation. If you brush it off as ergonomics and simple design, you FAIL epically to realize that we are speaking about a CONTROLLER DESIGN. The fact that an extra button is available, and that the joystick can be controlled simply by your thumb and with immense precision is MEGATON for a controller innovation. Compare that to the vectrex... the change from Vectrex controller to 64 controller is is not a simple improvement, it is a revolution. 2) Pressure sensitivity. This did not exist on Vectrex in the depth axis, I don't think so. It's a huge innovation, and the games made excellent use of this. I explain this properly in my first post.
@bold. You're supposed to understand this as saying: "Realize the PS1 barely made use of the dual analog, it wasn't designed with that in mind. The N64 was designed with the analog stick (and trigger button it goes without saying) from the ground up." Stop wasting my time. If you can't understand such simple things, just get out. You have no idea how much you aggravate. People take time to research and write elaborate posts so you can answer with stupidity. That's unacceptable.
As far as I remember, these were used as supplements for the D-pad, and within the games mentioned did not offer pressure sensitivity (though the hardware provided that, no or very few games actually used it). Even if they did, a handful of games is nothing to be proud of. This is a VERY weak argument on your part. Excuse me.
@bold. You're making the point because you can't understand simple facts when they are presented to you. I explained to you that analog controls were not part of the original design of the PS1, so using its sales is a very poor argument, even if you wished you could use it, when you do, it makes you sound very ignorant. See my counter-point just above this one to understand why. The Wii actually held the Motion Controls torch for 3 full years this gen. Not only did sales vindicate the business decision (Sony did not make that decision at PS launch/inception), but it also made great use of the technologies in its own games, and made it affordable. They were the first to achieve all that. They also achieved that with the N64 to a lesser extent, Sony came 2nd. |
the vectrex analog stick could be tilted with your thumb like a regular thumbstick ( the reason for the sticks being the size they are ) or operated like a joystick, another console like that was the arcadia and as i said before wasn't reffering to the design of the controller itself beyond the stick
so again i don't get why you're going into unique design elements nintendo put into their controllers as i was never reffering to them in the first place
sure its totally awesome that nintendo had pressure sensitivity and triggers and stuff but i wasn't reffering to that in the first place
edit : when we reffer to analog thumbsticks for gaming all we are talking about is controls with sticks capable of being tilted via the thumb that when tilted sense the direction that the stick is tilted in an provides that as input
yes pressure sensitivity adds to that greatly but it is not needed for the stick to be considered an analog stick or thumbstick
"Realize the PS1 barely made use of the dual analog, it wasn't designed with that in mind."
"As far as I remember, these were used as supplements for the D-pad, and within the games mentioned did not offer pressure sensitivity "
you have me confused here as far as i know dual analogs are generally used in terms of one stick providing character movement and the other camera control and as i stated before several ps1 games allowed for that quite well in addition to other control layouts
your rant on pressure sensitivity in terms of dual analogs makes me wonder if you even understand the main purpose behind the dual analog layout
"analog controls were not part of the original design of the PS1"
true although for me at least given that most of the popular games associated with the ps1 used the dual analogs i don't see why that matters
